Need some Overclocking Advise

[Jon Lai]

Believe it or not, this is actually my first time overclocking. My system:

P4 2.8 Northwood HT (200Mhz x 14 multiplier)
Asus P4P8X SE
OCZ 2x 512mb Premier 2.5-3-3-7

Right now, I've OCed to 230Mhz FSB, my specs now are as follows

P4 running at 3220Mhz
2x 512mb Premier running at 2.5-4-4-8

Do you guys think I'll be able to go much higher than 3220Mhz? What do you guys think will be my max limit with the hardware I have?

Also, what will be the device that will limit my OC - the processor, mobo, or RAM?

BTW, I've never seen anyone go higher than 3-4-4-8 for overclocking. Since my Premier set is already running at 2.5-4-4-8 does that in anyway hint that I won't be able to go much farther?

[Amourek]

Your CPU should be able to hit 230Mhz no problem. Your memory on the otherhand probably doesn't overclock well (Premier = Value = Budget) so you will most likely have to run it slower than the CPU... probably a 5:4 ratio which means 230Mhz CPU/184Mhz RAM - technically your RAM will be underclocked so you might be able to get the timings down.

I'd be most worried about your mobo - the P4P8X SE uses the 865P (inferior to the 865PE) chipset which if IRC is actually a modified version of the older E7205 Granite Bay chipset (which could only handle 133Mhz officially). So running your 2.8Ghz at stock speed is actually a 50% overclock for the mobo. I have no idea if it can handle another 30Mhz.

[tdotcbc84]

wow ~! i didnt know that ! very insightful dude!

[Jon Lai]

Your CPU should be able to hit 230Mhz no problem. Your memory on the otherhand probably doesn't overclock well (Premier = Value = Budget) so you will most likely have to run it slower than the CPU... probably a 5:4 ratio which means 230Mhz CPU/184Mhz RAM - technically your RAM will be underclocked so you might be able to get the timings down.

I'd be most worried about your mobo - the P4P8X SE uses the 865P (inferior to the 865PE) chipset which if IRC is actually a modified version of the older E7205 Granite Bay chipset (which could only handle 133Mhz officially). So running your 2.8Ghz at stock speed is actually a 50% overclock for the mobo. I have no idea if it can handle another 30Mhz.

Sorry if my post was confusing, but as I'm typing this, my CPU is already running at 3.22Ghz, so perhaps you didn't recall correctly, as if you did, I shouldn't be able to boot up Windows at this speed. Right now, both my CPU and RAM are running at 230Mhz, give or take a few Hertz or two.

What I want to know is if it can go even higher than just an extra 30Mhz clock.

BTW, according to CPU-Z, the chipset is Intel i865P/PE/G/i848P, Rev. A2. Are you perhaps suggesting that running 3.22Ghz right now is dangerous for my CPU, that I should immediately downclock it ASAP?

[Jon Lai]

bump

help someone?

[goofball]

What I want to know is if it can go even higher than just an extra 30Mhz clock.

BTW, according to CPU-Z, the chipset is Intel i865P/PE/G/i848P, Rev. A2. Are you perhaps suggesting that running 3.22Ghz right now is dangerous for my CPU, that I should immediately downclock it ASAP?

Nobody can give you a definite answer. What cooling are you using? What voltage are you at now for the CPU? How hot is the northbridge chipset/heatsink getting? Those are definitely variables which can affect your ability to overclock.

The 865P is not the same as the 865PE in terms of overclockability. What Amourek (and I am agreeing with) is that it is inferior to the 865PE and built off an older chipset which didn't officially support 800FSB but 533. So potentially, the chipset was already being overclocked to support 800FSB, and pushing it further may be an issue. You've already gotten it pretty far, IMO. 2.8C's tend to average 3.4-3.6Ghz, though the latter is with some high voltage.

[Jon Lai]

Nobody can give you a definite answer. What cooling are you using? What voltage are you at now for the CPU? How hot is the northbridge chipset/heatsink getting? Those are definitely variables which can affect your ability to overclock.

The 865P is not the same as the 865PE in terms of overclockability. What Amourek (and I am agreeing with) is that it is inferior to the 865PE and built off an older chipset which didn't officially support 800FSB but 533. So potentially, the chipset was already being overclocked to support 800FSB, and pushing it further may be an issue. You've already gotten it pretty far, IMO. 2.8C's tend to average 3.4-3.6Ghz, though the latter is with some high voltage.

Cooling - none, just fan + heatsink for the CPU, plus an exhaust 80mm case fan
Voltage - Don't know, haven't changed from stock
Temp - Was at 35C idle BEFORE I OCed, I'll check tomorrow for the new temp

How do you check the voltage that your CPU and memory is running at? I don't seem to be able to find it in BOIS nor from CPU-Z. Perhaps another 3rd party software?

I kinda understand what you guys are saying now. I actually bought this system prebuilt, and it came bundled like this, so I'm actually surprised to hear that the guy perhaps didn't give me a perfect fit for my system? And I gave him $1380's worth of business!

So, would you suggest that running 3.22Ghz (230Mhz) be an issue for my situation? Should I change it back to stock speeds for the potential health of my CPU/mobo?

Again, I'm an OCing n00b, but when you said "high voltages" with 3.4-3.6Ghz clocks, I persume "high voltages" = impact on CPU lifespan, would that be correct?

Should I be satisfied at 3.22Ghz?

[goofball]

How do you check the voltage that your CPU and memory is running at? I don't seem to be able to find it in BOIS nor from CPU-Z. Perhaps another 3rd party software?

So, would you suggest that running 3.22Ghz (230Mhz) be an issue for my situation? Should I change it back to stock speeds for the potential health of my CPU/mobo?

Again, I'm an OCing n00b, but when you said "high voltages" with 3.4-3.6Ghz clocks, I persume "high voltages" = impact on CPU lifespan, would that be correct?

Should I be satisfied at 3.22Ghz?

You could try the Asus Probe software. I'm sure it is supported by Asus Probe.

Not to sound like a goof but no one really cares about idle temperatures. Do you use your computer? Very rarely will a computer really show big problems at idle. It is load that you will see issues, unless the system is completely and hopelessly unstable, which is when you will see issues at idle.

The issue about buying full systems without prior hardware knowledge is that they usually just put things together that work at stock. Hardly anyone advocates overclocking, especially system builders. That's more problems that will come back to their store when things go wrong.

Measure all your temps if you can. If your setup is within range, you shouldn't worry.

Myself, I use my computer all the time, so I try to extract all the performance I can get. I dont' feel it is too fast for me, I feel it is actually too slow. Things don't happen right away, so it's still too slow.

Voltages can decrease the life but so can temperatures. Keeping them both at reasonable levels, you shouldn't have your hardware die on you before you would change them anyways. Can you imagine running a CPU/motherboard/ram combo that is 10 years old now? That would be the equivalent of a Pentium 166 with 16MB of EDO RAM!

[jdi_knght]

Again, I'm an OCing n00b, but when you said "high voltages" with 3.4-3.6Ghz clocks, I persume "high voltages" = impact on CPU lifespan, would that be correct?

Should I be satisfied at 3.22Ghz?

Do a google search for "sudden northwood death syndrome". I wouldn't go too high on the voltage, but other than that I don't forsee any major short-term issues.

I have a P4 2.8C on an asus P4P800, and around 3.2Ghz, things would start to get flaky. Others have gone up past 3.4 with ease, so YMMV.

Personally, I'd probably be satisfied with 3.22. Try running Prime95 for a day or two and see if it really is stable. If it is, you could try squeezing it up more a little bit at a time, and you'll probably eventually get to the point where you either have to up the voltage, play with some bios settings, and play with some memory settings to keep things stable. Just take it slow, watch the temps, and don't go crazy on the voltage.

Good luck!

[Jon Lai]

You could try the Asus Probe software. I'm sure it is supported by Asus Probe.

Not to sound like a goof but no one really cares about idle temperatures. Do you use your computer? Very rarely will a computer really show big problems at idle. It is load that you will see issues, unless the system is completely and hopelessly unstable, which is when you will see issues at idle.

The issue about buying full systems without prior hardware knowledge is that they usually just put things together that work at stock. Hardly anyone advocates overclocking, especially system builders. That's more problems that will come back to their store when things go wrong.

Measure all your temps if you can. If your setup is within range, you shouldn't worry.

Myself, I use my computer all the time, so I try to extract all the performance I can get. I dont' feel it is too fast for me, I feel it is actually too slow. Things don't happen right away, so it's still too slow.

Voltages can decrease the life but so can temperatures. Keeping them both at reasonable levels, you shouldn't have your hardware die on you before you would change them anyways. Can you imagine running a CPU/motherboard/ram combo that is 10 years old now? That would be the equivalent of a Pentium 166 with 16MB of EDO RAM!

Well that was because I didn't know how to, thanks for recommending Asusprobe to me.

Here is my monitor at default thresholds:



How am I doing? I haven't changed any settings to overclock except the FSB. I've heard about the sudden deaths of Northwoods and thus I'm not even going to touch the VCore settings - I'd rather run slower and keep my computer.

Am I "within range" as you said with these temperatures?

[Jon Lai]

I have a P4 2.8C on an asus P4P800, and around 3.2Ghz, things would start to get flaky. Others have gone up past 3.4 with ease, so YMMV.

Personally, I'd probably be satisfied with 3.22. Try running Prime95 for a day or two and see if it really is stable. If it is, you could try squeezing it up more a little bit at a time, and you'll probably eventually get to the point where you either have to up the voltage, play with some bios settings, and play with some memory settings to keep things stable. Just take it slow, watch the temps, and don't go crazy on the voltage.

Good luck!

Thanks for the personal experience, lol. How in your sense does "things start to get flaky"? Right now, after Amourek's remarks, I'm not as concerned about getting it even higher than 3.22Ghz, rather, I'm more interested to know if even STAYING at 3.22ghz is even safe for my system. Otherwise, if it isn't, I'd honestly rather go back to stock than risk it - I can't afford another computer anytime soon.

[goofball]

Well that was because I didn't know how to, thanks for recommending Asusprobe to me.

Here is my monitor at default thresholds:



How am I doing? I haven't changed any settings to overclock except the FSB. I've heard about the sudden deaths of Northwoods and thus I'm not even going to touch the VCore settings - I'd rather run slower and keep my computer.

Am I "within range" as you said with these temperatures?

Personally, that's about the upper limit of what I would call acceptable. I don't feel comfortable with 50+ c load on anything but prescott, and even then, 55c is all i feel comfortable with.

Like I stated before, make sure your other components are cool. RAM and Northbridge chipset (as well as mosfets) are kept within reason. If you can't keep your finger on the Northbridge chipset for 5 seconds without burning, that's too hot.

[Jon Lai]

Personally, that's about the upper limit of what I would call acceptable. I don't feel comfortable with 50+ c load on anything but prescott, and even then, 55c is all i feel comfortable with.

Like I stated before, make sure your other components are cool. RAM and Northbridge chipset (as well as mosfets) are kept within reason. If you can't keep your finger on the Northbridge chipset for 5 seconds without burning, that's too hot.

I heard from somewhere that the point of thumb is that anything lower than 70C on some overclocker's forums, and you said your comfortable level is 50C? Perhaps I should return to 2.8Ghz or maybe down to 3.0Ghz then, since that screen was taken when I was doing nothing except for running Bittorrent and MSN in the background...

BTW, by default, the threshold in PC Probe is 72C for CPU, and the mobo temp threshold is 75C! Are those numbers inflated or something?

And it seems like my mobo temp is much lower than my CPU temp - is that normal? Becuase it seems like my mobo/chipset is pretty cool, but my CPU temp is way off the scale. As I'm talking right now, I'm doing some CPU-intensive video conversions, and I'm reaching 60-66C... I feel unsafe now that you said 50C is your expectations.

[HUH]

That seems like a little too hot if 49C is the idle cpu temp. Also have you try running Prime95 and memtest? These programs will do stress testing on your system so you know if it's a stable oc.

[Jon Lai]

That seems like a little too hot if 49C is the idle cpu temp. Also have you try running Prime95 and memtest? These programs will do stress testing on your system so you know if it's a stable oc.

Right now my video conversion is finished and over 3 minutes it dropped back ot 49C, MB temp at 39C, so 49C does seem like the idle temp.

Keep in mind, though, I'm using the stock cooling - my computer was bought as a clone, so I've no idea how the guy installed everything. I'm thinking perhaps I should go back to 2.8Ghz or go down a notch to 3.0Ghz and see if the temps are acceptable first, since as you guys suggested, the temps are too hot even if the OC is stable anyways.

Or perhaps I need a new CPU cooler, but if so, I'd rather no OC, IMO, becuase I'm not an enthusaist anyways.