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Jan 27, 2006
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Not to mention the DIFFERENT players Brady has to work with over the years.

I never understood the HATE for Brady. Incredible talent, Super Model Wife, Money which he took a pay cut.

I guess it's just human nature to hate those who are better than you.
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Jan 2, 2005
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Probably the greatest game of all time last night. Epic performance by the Patriots in the 2nd half in the face of Goodell after his deflatagate debacle - glad to hear him drowned out by the boos awarding the Lombardi trophy to the greatest team of all time in Superbowl history.
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grappos13 wrote:
Feb 6th, 2017 1:33 am
the reason they didnt get points on that drive is the reason that seattle lost 2 years ago.. Pats/Kraft must be paying off the other teams to do stupid, idiotic play calls to give Pats chance to win..

we all now about the Seahawks one.. 2nd and goal with Lynch.. 3 chances to run it in but u do a slant pass into everyone? terrible / unforgivable / possibly worst play call ever...

but NOW.. u get Falcons up 16 with like 6-7 min left at their own 25.. they decide NOT to run it 3 times and punt (if u dont get it).. and take 2min 30 sec off time... instead they drop back and get sack/fumble.. u do NOT do that up 16 in your own zone... now that one may not be that bad.. BUT with 4:30 left.. at Pats 22 yard line.. 1st down.. u have to run 3 times here and kick a FG.. simple as that... first run you lost 1 yard / back to scrimmage.. u RUN the next 2.. simple as that.. u NEVER pass in that situation.. ESPECIALLY AFTER u have fumbled the last time.. chance that Bryant misses a 40 yard field goal? maybe 10%.... chance your RB fumbles on 2nd or 3rd down? maybe 5%... so 85% chance you are hitting the FG and taking a 11 point lead with 2:30left in the game.. especially ending the game... but nope....

dont get me wrong.. the comeback by Brady and co. was pretty epic.. but it shoulda never been allowed to happen if the coaching/play calling wasnt dumbfounding...like seriously.. seems soo rigged..

also, Brady is not the GOAT.. not sure why ppl saying that... leaving the CHEATING aside (the guy was convicted and suspended for cheating)... Montana went 4 for 4.. DOMINATED 2 superbowls.. 3rd one he controlled the whole game and won (other team never within 5 pts after SF got first TD)... and last one he got a big game winning drive with TD pass to win.....

lets see Brady's 5... first 2 were won by Viniteri kicks (yes brady did drive them into FG range.. tho one of them the idiot team kicked kick off out of bounds)..3rd one he was pretty solid and did a lot to win in... 4th one was basically a loss if Carroll wasnt mentally challenged... this past one he had an epic comeback that shoulda never happened if Shanahan wasnt mentally challenged as well....not to mention he has had INTs in a bunch of superbowl games... also lost 2 of them while being the favourites (and a 12.5 fave against NYG first time).....
A lot of things make why teams win. Not sure why you say Montana was the sole reason for 49ers winning but others cuz of Brady. I mean you play a lot of hypotheticals to discredit him. So against NY if the helmet catch didn't happen they would have won. (see I can play that game too).
But Brady's been winning for so long with so many different teammates. I mean must have been nice for Montana to have one of the (if not the) greatest wide receivers (in his prime) to pass to. Or how good could their opponents have been if SF blew them out.
Last edited by rems on Feb 6th, 2017 8:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The reason why montana didnt overcome any 10 point deficit is cuz he only trailed in the superbowl one time. And that one time he got the winning td with 30 sec left. Other superbowls the game was never in question.

Yes brady has been in 7 superbowls. Won 5. 2 on last sec fg. 1 by 3 pt that he did well in. And 2 pt other team coaching blunders. Lost twice to far worse team on paper than him and was behind late in like all 7 games.

Cant fault montana for not making comeback drives when he never needes to lol.

Not to mention montanas qb rating in superbowls is 127.8 and brady is 89.3
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Im not discrediting it but just because he has one more superbowl win doesnt make you the greatest. Snd because you did do an epic comeback shouldnt be the reason either. The comeback was aided by one of the stupiest coaching decisions ever...twice.

Is frank reicht one of the greatest ever because he won the miracle at rich? Nope.

Also, brady has be suspended for being caught cheating and his coach has been caught cheatibg yet this guy gets so much praise still.

Barry bonds is the best baseball player ever and has never been caught cheating yet is still screwed over by the media and baseball fans alike. Why not brady?
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Sep 24, 2007
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I dislike all the talks of GOAT in any sport because of the varying degrees of differences in the game from then to now. I would prefer they use decades or eras when talking about GOAT because Brady is the GOAT in this era. No need to compare him to pass great QB who play in vastly different situations. There has been no better QB in the past 10 years besides him and Manning. You can also chuck Big Ben and Rogers into that convo.
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Jun 28, 2015
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grappos13 wrote:
Feb 6th, 2017 8:21 am
Also, brady has be suspended for being caught cheating and his coach has been caught cheatibg yet this guy gets so much praise still.
Not that I care either way but there is a reason the phrase "if you ain't cheating, you ain't trying" exists.

Lets not pretend that Brady and/or Bellichek are the first nor the last people in sports who have cheated. From steroids to Vaseline, athletes and coaches have cheated for decades, and probably longer. Brady and Bellichek got caught.
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LonesomeDove wrote:
Feb 6th, 2017 3:53 am
If you look at the stats, there is no way Brady is not considered the GOAT compared to Montana.

Brady - Won 5 Superbowls
Montana - Won 4 Superbowls

Brady- 4 Superbowl MVPs
Montana - 3 Superbowl MVPs.

Brady - Played in 6 Superbowls
Montana Played in 4 Superbowls

Brady won Superbowl 50 at age 39, still at peak of career.
Montano won last Superbowl at age 34 and never played in another Superbowl.

Brady engineered TWO touchdown drives in the last 5 minutes PLUS two point conversions for a total of 16 points AND drove the team down to the goal line in overtime for winning touchdown. Total of 23 points. Montana had only 1 TD in the last minute. Brady had engineered 3 TDs in half a quarter.

According to TV broadcasters, no team has overcome a 19 point deficit in playoff history . 93-0 teams won when they had such a lead.
Only 2 teams have overcome a 10 point deficit in Superbowl to win it. Montana was not on one of them.
THIS!!!!!!!!!
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Do you think they will cut Gronk? Three back surgeries he should retire.
"I'll put up color bars before I'll put you in front of our cameras."

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THE NEWSROOM (HBO)
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Apr 28, 2004
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Wow, that was a great game. Was about to start heading home after 28-3, but I thought it's Brady & Belichick - let's see one or two more drives to see what they could do. Glad I stayed to witness one of the greatest comebacks.
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akira1971 wrote:
Feb 6th, 2017 10:40 am
Wow, that was a great game. Was about to start heading home after 28-3, but I thought it's Brady & Belichick - let's see one or two more drives to see what they could do. Glad I stayed to witness one of the greatest comebacks.

Yes it was nailbitting indeed...
I had also written Patriots off after 28-3 but then the dead cat bounced back...
And didn't they made it 28-28 practically with 1 minute remaining in the game ?
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grappos13 wrote:
Feb 6th, 2017 1:33 am
the reason they didnt get points on that drive is the reason that seattle lost 2 years ago..

we all know about the Seahawks one.. 2nd and goal with Lynch.. 3 chances to run it in but u do a slant pass into everyone? terrible / unforgivable / possibly worst play call ever...
That Seattle play call has been debunked – it was absolutely a good call.

FACTS:
- Beast Mode Lynch was a pathetic 1-for-5 at the goal line that year and 4-for-13 lifetime. He was ranked 30th out of 39 RBs over the previous five years at punching it in at the 1 yd line.
- The 1 yd pass was marginally more successful in 2014 (108 pass plays with 66 TDs and zero INTs until Butler > 61.1% success) vs (223 run plays with 129 TDs and TWO fumble turnovers > 57.8% success)
- Russell Wilson/OC Bevell had FIVE successful 1 yd TD passes (Tony Moeaki, Zach Miller 2x, Kellen Davis, Golden Tate)
- Most importantly, you had a veteran Lockette vs an UNDRAFTED ROOKIE last on the Patriots’ depth chart. Butler wasn’t even a signed free agent – he was a walk-on tryout at training camp.
- Here’s a snapshot of the play. The middle is wide open.

Image

edit 1: SB practice film showed Butler getting beat on the exact same play. Only great NE coaching fixed Butler to recognize the formation and aggressively break on the pass. Just awesome stuff.
edit 2: with only 1 timeout left, it would've been A) run, timeout, pass, pass or B) pass, run/pass, timeout, run/pass. By going for a pass on 2nd down, it gave Seattle the option of having two run/pass plays left, otherwise NE would know for certain the last two plays would've been passes onl;y.
Last edited by akira1971 on Feb 6th, 2017 10:44 am, edited 2 times in total.
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grappos13 wrote:
Feb 6th, 2017 1:33 am
Pats/Kraft must be paying off the other teams to do stupid, idiotic play calls to give Pats chance to win..
...
but NOW.. u get Falcons up 16 with like 6-7 min left at their own 25.. they decide NOT to run it 3 times and punt (if u dont get it).. and take 2min 30 sec off time... instead they drop back and get sack/fumble.. u do NOT do that up 16 in your own zone... now that one may not be that bad.. BUT with 4:30 left.. at Pats 22 yard line.. 1st down.. u have to run 3 times here and kick a FG.. simple as that... first run you lost 1 yard / back to scrimmage.. u RUN the next 2.. simple as that.. u NEVER pass in that situation.. ESPECIALLY AFTER u have fumbled the last time.. chance that Bryant misses a 40 yard field goal? maybe 10%.... chance your RB fumbles on 2nd or 3rd down? maybe 5%... so 85% chance you are hitting the FG and taking a 11 point lead with 2:30left in the game.. especially ending the game... but nope....
The more I think about it, I'm not convinced it wasn't the right playcalling from Kyle Shanahan.
- The previous 9 runs netted the Falcons only 18 yards.
- Taking the FG makes it a 11-point lead with 3:30 (no timeouts left for Pats). That's not impossible for elite QBs like Brady, Brees or Rodgers. If Falcons scores a TD (and 2-pt conversion) the game is over.
- What got Falcons into the big game was being aggressive and going for the win. Can't play conservative (run, run, run, punt) or Prevent D - critics would've ripped into them for letting Pats back into the game. If Kyle wasn't aggressive, you wouldn't have gotten the 29yd pass to Jones or the 40-yd pass to Freeman. You are who you are.
- The Atlanta D was gassed. Pats ran something like 90 plays. This D wasn't stopping anything.
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Asker123 wrote:
Feb 6th, 2017 10:43 am
Yes it was nailbitting indeed...
I had also written Patriots off after 28-3 but then the dead cat bounced back...
And didn't they made it 28-28 practically with 1 minute remaining in the game ?
You know, I thought Brady was going TOO FAST and scoring. They left 57 seconds (although no timeouts) that for an elite QB (Brady, Brees, Rodgers or P.Manning) could easily get the 45-50 yards to put them into FG position. Guess I can't elevate Matt Ryan into that category yet.
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akira1971 wrote:
Feb 6th, 2017 10:57 am
The more I think about it, I'm not convinced it wasn't the right playcalling from Kyle Shanahan.
- The previous 9 runs netted the Falcons only 18 yards.
- Taking the FG makes it a 11-point lead with 3:30 (no timeouts left for Pats). That's not impossible for elite QBs like Brady, Brees or Rodgers. If Falcons scores a TD (and 2-pt conversion) the game is over.
- What got Falcons into the big game was being aggressive and going for the win. Can't play conservative (run, run, run, punt) or Prevent D - critics would've ripped into them for letting Pats back into the game. If Kyle wasn't aggressive, you wouldn't have gotten the 29yd pass to Jones or the 40-yd pass to Freeman. You are who you are.
- The Atlanta D was gassed. Pats ran something like 90 plays. This D wasn't stopping anything.
It's called 'failure to adjust', just because it worked 1st half doesn't mean it'll work 2nd. BB knew this, heck if they didn't change they would've gotten wiped out. ATL otoh failed to adjust, they definitely should've slowed down esp since you say their D got tired. Put a FG up there, game over, I don't care if 'god' is leading the last drive, it's 2 scoring plays required, no way Pats come back from that.
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