Noob help: When to use "middle" appertures

Hi,

A question for all as I'm starting to figure out some of the basics of photography.

I recently bought an Olympus OM-D E-M5 and have started shooting with it. I understand some of the basics of Aperture, Shutter, and ISO and have been mixing them up to get a variety of different styles of shots.

Now, I'm starting to get a feel for when I'd want to use a wide open aperture (portraits, desire for bokeh, etc.), and a narrow aperture (desire for maximum image in focus), but am not really sure of any creative situations when I'd want to use a "middle" aperture (say anything between F6.3 to F14 or so).

From a composition standpoint, when should I think about using those types of apertures? Or is this range primarily just a range that you use to get the right exposure when your primary concern is getting the right shutter speed for a given shot?

Thanks!

The main use of aperture is for how much light you want to hit the sensor, so if you're shooting at night or in a dark room you'll have to use a wide aperture, f1.8 or f2.8 depending on your lens, if you're shooting in bright daylight where the sun is shining really hard you'll have to use a narrow apperture f14 or f16. So everything in between is mostly dependent on what light you have available, if you don't have extra lights like a flash or something else to affect the area you want to take photos of.

as someone who used many different m4/3 lenses, I find that most m4/3 lenses (20mm 1.7 45mm 1.8, 14mm 2.5) are their sharpest at 3.5-4.5, and they start loosing resolution at f8 and higher.

The characteristics of f8 or f11 (well regarded f stops for landscape usages etc) is different for m4/3 sized sensors than full frame or ASPC. so under normal circumstances, don't use higher than 5.6 or 6-7 something on ur m4/3 lenses

As stated above, one thing you should be aware of is that stopping down too much will cause loss of resolution

You will start to pass the diffraction limit around f/8 with most lenses on m43. Some visual real world examples on a 43 camera. http://dpnow.com/7644.html

It's all a balancing act, the aperture you need to use is a combination of getting the right shutter speed you need + the maximum sharpness + enough depth of field.

http://slrcameratips.net/files/2012/05/dof-aperture.jpg

The middle range is considered "who cares" appertures, for when you want the shot to have more in focus than in the low but not completely all in focus as you would in the high.

You put it in that range cause you are not playing with dof, you just want to get a shot.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by warpdrive

As stated above, one thing you should be aware of is that stopping down too much will cause loss of resolution

You will start to pass the diffraction limit around f/8 with most lenses on m43. Some visual real world examples on a 43 camera. http://dpnow.com/7644.html

It's all a balancing act, the aperture you need to use is a combination of getting the right shutter speed you need + the maximum sharpness + enough depth of field.

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Wow this is very interesting

I though that higher f stop was better for sharpness (and that was the reason it was recommended for landscape)

Thank you

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hdom

http://slrcameratips.net/files/2012/05/dof-aperture.jpg

The middle range is considered "who cares" appertures, for when you want the shot to have more in focus than in the low but not completely all in focus as you would in the high.

You put it in that range cause you are not playing with dof, you just want to get a shot.

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Thanks, this is what I had kind of suspected.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by warpdrive

As stated above, one thing you should be aware of is that stopping down too much will cause loss of resolution

You will start to pass the diffraction limit around f/8 with most lenses on m43. Some visual real world examples on a 43 camera. http://dpnow.com/7644.html

It's all a balancing act, the aperture you need to use is a combination of getting the right shutter speed you need + the maximum sharpness + enough depth of field.

---

This I hadn't expected. Very good to know...I guess better late than never. I guess all of my daylight outdoor landscape shots are going to come out a lot softer than I had expected. Thanks

Quote:

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Originally Posted by vonblock

Wow this is very interesting

I though that higher f stop was better for sharpness (and that was the reason it was recommended for landscape)

Thank you

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yes, most lenses will get sharper *until* you hit the diffraction limit of the lens/camera, so you start paying a price to get extreme depth of field. For some lenses, like my 12-35, the sharpest setting is actually wider than f4 and it starts to go downhill with narrower f-stops. For the average m43 lens, you probably don't want to go beyond f7.1

I read up about aperture and it totally confuses me. I can be outside in daylight, have the aperture at 3.5 and the LCD is ncie and bright and then set the aperture to 22 and screen is dark and cant take a picture without it being black. wtf

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mayosandwich

I read up about aperture and it totally confuses me. I can be outside in daylight, have the aperture at 3.5 and the LCD is ncie and bright and then set the aperture to 22 and screen is dark and cant take a picture without it being black. wtf

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Decrease your shutter speed for a longer exposure or increase your ISO. Are you using M mode? if you use A mode it should automatically compensate for the smaller aperture by decreasing shutter speed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by warpdrive

As stated above, one thing you should be aware of is that stopping down too much will cause loss of resolution

You will start to pass the diffraction limit around f/8 with most lenses on m43. Some visual real world examples on a 43 camera. http://dpnow.com/7644.html

It's all a balancing act, the aperture you need to use is a combination of getting the right shutter speed you need + the maximum sharpness + enough depth of field.

---

Actually now I guess I have a different question. Under what circumstances would you ever want to use a very small aperture? The link you posted includes a table that lays out what the diffraction limits are for every type of sensor size/megapixel combination. Since both of those are features of the camera body, wouldn't it make more sense for the camera body to simply limit the aperture range at that point?

Or is this again a scenario where it's needed to match off against certain shutter speeds -- e.g., you want a long shutter in bright light, you have to use these small apertures (or buy a filter) -- and that's why they're included?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chinesedevil

Decrease your shutter speed for a longer exposure or increase your ISO. Are you using M mode? if you use A mode it should automatically compensate for the smaller aperture by decreasing shutter speed.

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Ya im using manual mode but honestly i cant tell what shutter speed to use on still pictures like landscape or portrait.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MaxwellMcGee

Actually now I guess I have a different question. Under what circumstances would you ever want to use a very small aperture? The link you posted includes a table that lays out what the diffraction limits are for every type of sensor size/megapixel combination. Since both of those are features of the camera body, wouldn't it make more sense for the camera body to simply limit the aperture range at that point?

Or is this again a scenario where it's needed to match off against certain shutter speeds -- e.g., you want a long shutter in bright light, you have to use these small apertures (or buy a filter) -- and that's why they're included?

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it's all a balancing act between all the various factors.

smaller aperature = more depth of field.
bigger aperature = faster shutter speed allowed. Depth of field is also affected by your focal length and distance to background and subject.
too small aperature hitting diffraction = loss of resolution.
too wide of aperature (wide open) = loss of sharpness in corners in most lenses.

you may need those very small aperatures because you actually need maximum depth of field that the higher apertures can give you, so it wouldn't make sense for the camera to limit it

Quote:

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Originally Posted by warpdrive

it's all a balancing act between all the various factors.

smaller aperature = more depth of field.
bigger aperature = faster shutter speed allowed. Depth of field is also affected by your focal length and distance to background and subject.
too small aperature hitting diffraction = loss of resolution.
too wide of aperature (wide open) = loss of sharpness in corners in most lenses.

you may need those very small aperatures because you actually need maximum depth of field that the higher apertures can give you, so it wouldn't make sense for the camera to limit it

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After some experimenting I cant think of any situations or specific type of picture that would require highest setting of aperture. Cause you have to then lower the shutter speed or increase the ISO as the LCD is now almost pitch black in daylight. You would assume that high aperture settings are best for family photos or landscapes cause you dont want any blurring in the background but when i go into my landscape mode, it surprisingly has a 3.5 aperture!

I did some experimenting with the apertures and am understanding bit more now.

3.5 aperture (lowest setting on my cam), 200ISO, 1/60 middle of the range shutter

http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/4988/dsc00543yi.jpg

22 aperture (highest setting on my cam) 800ISO, lowered to 1/2 shutter. It was noticably harder to take this shot with a lower shutter cause from handshake.

http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/4118/dsc00549pr.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mayosandwich

After some experimenting I cant think of any situations or specific type of picture that would require highest setting of aperture. Cause you have to then lower the shutter speed or increase the ISO as the LCD is now almost pitch black in daylight. You would assume that high aperture settings are best for family photos or landscapes cause you dont want any blurring in the background but when i go into my landscape mode, it surprisingly has a 3.5 aperture!

I did some experimenting with the apertures and am understanding bit more now.

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It's fairly rare for me to use very small apertures. What camera are u using? Smallest sensors have more depth of field so you can get away with wide apertures. Full frame sensors have the least depth of focus

You should repeat your shots outdoors with the lens highly zoomed in for a headshot and you will see that you will start to need the higher apertures