Students

Ontario PC’s cutting tuition at universities and college by 10%

Sr. Member
Jul 20, 2017
559 posts
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Just out on CBC: Student union spending scandal at Ryerson. Crazy credit card changes: booze, gas etc....just proves the point about mandatory fees...
Last edited by Sebastian6300 on Jan 25th, 2019 8:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Sr. Member
Jul 20, 2017
559 posts
117 upvotes
Also on CBC: GM is hiring: software developers, electrical engineers etc...and laying out assembly workers...Maybe we do need universities...
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Nov 10, 2018
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Sebastian6300 wrote:
Jan 25th, 2019 6:38 pm
Also on CBC: GM is hiring: software developers, electrical engineers etc...and laying out assembly workers...Maybe we do need universities...
We do need Universities, but we certainly don't need free ones or heavily subsidized ones.
For legal topics and discussions, the opinion, guidance, and thoughts provided are my own and are not considered to be legal advice, in any manner.
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Nov 22, 2009
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StatsGuy wrote:
Jan 17th, 2019 7:24 pm
Any stats to backup your assertion?
Just go out and take a look at all the chinese/indians working in restaurants/construction, none of them report their income. Any job tha involves payment in cash will be the same. You dont seriously think people working in cash jobs will report their income right?

Think about it, who would be stupid enough to not change their address to a friends place and report zero for family income? Its just common sense.
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Apr 8, 2013
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angryaudifanatic wrote:
Jan 26th, 2019 7:29 pm
We do need Universities, but we certainly don't need free ones or heavily subsidized ones.
Yes we do. What do you think will happen if only rich kids can go to school?. You will be holding people back. Brains arent determined by daddy's wealth.

Even fully privatized Ivy league schools offer scholarships. They know that talent can come from anywhere.

Its really common sense.

The big problem with our school is not subsidies. The problem is tuition itself. They know that we have great schools and it attracts international students so they jack up the price.

Tight regulation can easily fix this.
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kevindurant1 wrote:
Jan 29th, 2019 12:56 am
Yes we do. What do you think will happen if only rich kids can go to school?. You will be holding people back. Brains arent determined by daddy's wealth.

Even fully privatized Ivy league schools offer scholarships. They know that talent can come from anywhere.

Its really common sense.

The big problem with our school is not subsidies. The problem is tuition itself. They know that we have great schools and it attracts international students so they jack up the price.

Tight regulation can easily fix this.
What are you going on about?

1) International students' tuition is separate.
2) Nobody said only rich kids can go to school.
3) I'll entertain your wholly subsidized University when private schools aren't an option.
4) Ivy League schools are an OPTION. There are plenty of State Universities.
5) Scholarships are VERY few and far between in the US for Ivy League schools.

By wholly subsidizing education, one is just moving the goalposts so some other barrier down the road will stop people. Folks have a right to an education up to high school. University has, and will always NOT be a right.

That said based on your signature line, I'm going to just agree to disagree with you. We will get absolutely nowhere.
For legal topics and discussions, the opinion, guidance, and thoughts provided are my own and are not considered to be legal advice, in any manner.
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Apr 8, 2013
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angryaudifanatic wrote:
Jan 29th, 2019 10:16 am
What are you going on about?

1) International students' tuition is separate.
2) Nobody said only rich kids can go to school.
3) I'll entertain your wholly subsidized University when private schools aren't an option.
4) Ivy League schools are an OPTION. There are plenty of State Universities.
5) Scholarships are VERY few and far between in the US for Ivy League schools.

By wholly subsidizing education, one is just moving the goalposts so some other barrier down the road will stop people. Folks have a right to an education up to high school. University has, and will always NOT be a right.

That said based on your signature line, I'm going to just agree to disagree with you. We will get absolutely nowhere.
1.) International students forces the price to go up on everyone.
2.)You said we dont need subsidies. How can it be affordable for low and mid income students?.
3/4.) Not the point. Ivy League schools all have scholarships because they know that intelligence can come from anywhere. Even poor people.
5.)Not the point. Scholarships are pretty much a subsidy by the school. The only difference is they have the highest standard and they pick who can get in.

We need international students here. Its pretty much adding thousands of tourists all year long. The effect of that is higher tuition, more expensive books, more fees. etc.

This is why subsidy and tighter regulation is needed.
No political content in sigs please.
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Sebastian6300 wrote:
Jan 25th, 2019 6:38 pm
Also on CBC: GM is hiring: software developers, electrical engineers etc...and laying out assembly workers...Maybe we do need universities...
just computer science and engineering degree it seems
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Nov 24, 2004
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I would say that merit scholarships are not common at Ivy League universities in the USA. Scholarships based on financial need are much more common, though AFAIK they weren't formerly.

Admission to Ivy League universities is not as cut-and-dry as admission to Canadian universities. The latter look almost solely at marks, while the former take a far broader range of factors into account. Many top high school graduates in Canada would really struggle to be admitted to these schools.

I think that Canada has very good universities. I also think Canada has too many students in its universities, a phenomenon which has many policy- and sociology-related causes.

I think there is a lot we can learn from the university systems in places like France and Germany, where tuition is very inexpensive, but admission is more highly regulated.
Sr. Member
Jul 20, 2017
559 posts
117 upvotes
divx wrote:
Jan 29th, 2019 1:57 pm
just computer science and engineering degree it seems
An engineering degree costs about 16k/year currently plus lots of other fees. Parents have to make about 30-40k gross income to pay for that. What I do not understand is why low income students should get almost all the tuition covered by grants. Take a family of 4 with 100k income. Based on the OSAP calculator they would get a whopping $400 in grants and about 7k in loans. Multiply that with 2 kids, and that 100k income is pushed down to poverty level.
100k gross is about 55 net, after ui, cpp and taxes. So if you spend 10 k each on 2 children, you are left with 35 net....
I think we have to discourage families from having children. The immigration system can be adjusted to take care much faster of any needs that Canada has. We just have to make sure that immigrants agree not to have any children :-)
Last edited by Sebastian6300 on Jan 29th, 2019 5:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Sr. Member
Jul 20, 2017
559 posts
117 upvotes
Here are some relatively absurd solutions for students:
-get married to another student, and submit the application as a couple. You both get the max grants.
-ask your parents to separate. A lot of them were waiting for the children to grow up to do it anyway. Then live with the lower income parent.
-if your parents are single or divorced, ask them not to remarry, otherwise you loose your grants. Watch "Two and a half men" for ideas how to stop an unwanted marriage:-)
-choose a school that is more then 40 km from your parents house, unless you really want to commute to school. You will then qualify for the housing allowance too.
Sr. Member
Jul 20, 2017
559 posts
117 upvotes
I did some more reading about the school fees. Ford did not say that they will stop the schools from charging the fees. What they actually said is that , when calculating OSAP needs, they will not consider those fees. So students, or their parents, will have to earn the money themselves to pay for those fees.
I also found that the Minister ( you know the goat farm...) said that she understands OSAP because she has 3 kids. It seems that is her only knowledge in this matter. I would like to remind her that with one parent having a minister's salary her kids won't get OSAP.
Sr. Member
Jul 20, 2017
559 posts
117 upvotes
DId anybody see some info for multi-child families, I have a mixture of students and high school students. It seems they eliminated any reference to this. Please post any info you might have!
However I found this:
"New for 2019-20: Your contribution will be $3,600." This is an increase of 20% compared to $3000 this year. The change is even bigger if we consider that some fees are taken out of the calculation, when calculating student needs. These are the subtle ways, well behind the headlines to make the changes that hurt. I have not seen any mention of this in any media. Imagine how would it look 25% increase of students' contribution, before calculating OSAP needs. I have to agree the 10% tuition cut sounds much better....for the government, and for those who have no idea about how OSAP works, which is 99% of the population...

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