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Deal Guru
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Paleo diet criticism

Regarding this Paleo diet... it sounds interesting and there's no doubt you can lose weight with it, but...

- how does anyone know what cavemen ate?
- how does anyone know what cavemen died of? (i.e. heart disease, cancer?)

It seems like people just go "hmmm... what would a caveman do?" and then make it all up.

I mean, I have seen Paleo diet people giving me justifications for why wine and butter are fine, even though butter comes from milk and would require large quantities of milk to be harvested to get the 3% or so you can turn into butter.

And why wouldn't cavemen eat beans if he happened to find them outside the cave one day? Or potatoes?

Personally, I think there are some good messages in the whole thing -- cut way back on sugar, reduce carbohydrates, etc... but some people take it too far and it doesn't seem like there are really any rules for what's in the diet and that people just make it up.
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So you really don't think scientists have discovered the diets of cavemen?

Have you actually done in-depth research about the Paleo diet, rather than just listen to what other people said about it?
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arisk wrote:
Oct 15th, 2011 7:45 pm
Banning proper use in a forum such as this simply perpetuates the problem by reinforcing the perspective that all uses of a word are negative.
KorruptioN wrote:
Oct 29th, 2010 9:11 pm
She must be better than all of us real men, at any cost. Feel like talking down to people who don't fit in her narrow-minded demographic? She's got it in spades.
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Tijuana wrote:
May 27th, 2011 6:29 pm
So you really don't think scientists have discovered the diets of cavemen?

Have you actually done in-depth research about the Paleo diet, rather than just listen to what other people said about it?

No, I haven't done in-depth research.

So cavemen drank wine and made butter? And they didn't die from any diet-related diseases?
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mbg wrote:
May 27th, 2011 6:54 pm
No, I haven't done in-depth research.

So cavemen drank wine and made butter? And they didn't die from any diet-related diseases?
The modern dietary regimen known as the Paleolithic diet (abbreviated paleo diet or paleodiet), also popularly referred to as the caveman diet, Stone Age diet and hunter-gatherer diet, is a nutritional plan based on the presumed ancient diet of wild plants and animals that various human species habitually consumed during the Paleolithic era—a period of about 2.5 million years duration that ended around 10,000 years ago with the development of agriculture. In common usage, such terms as the "Paleolithic diet" also refer to the actual ancestral human diet.[1][2] Centered on commonly available modern foods, the "contemporary" Paleolithic diet consists mainly of meat, fish, vegetables, fruit, roots, and nuts, and excludes grains, legumes, dairy products, salt, refined sugar, and processed oils.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleolithic_diet

Read up on it.
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arisk wrote:
Oct 15th, 2011 7:45 pm
Banning proper use in a forum such as this simply perpetuates the problem by reinforcing the perspective that all uses of a word are negative.
KorruptioN wrote:
Oct 29th, 2010 9:11 pm
She must be better than all of us real men, at any cost. Feel like talking down to people who don't fit in her narrow-minded demographic? She's got it in spades.
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it seems like you don't know anything about it

go do some research and go to the source
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OK, so here are my conclusions based on "research":

1. There is no cooking oil that is satisfactory for this diet
2. Dairy products are not allowed, so butter is not allowed -- it is a product of agriculture (somehow the New York Times readers who've picked up this trend managed to keep butter and cheese in the diet)
3. Alcohol is not allowed, so wine is out (somehow the New York Times readers who've picked up this trend managed to keep wine in the diet)
4. It's not sustainable, but it would be if we allowed some portion of the world's population to die off until it was sustainable

This was basically my point at the beginning -- a lot of people who say they are following this diet really are not. The trendy version now circulating is like an Atkins-with-benefits.
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mbg wrote:
May 27th, 2011 10:31 pm
OK, so here are my conclusions based on "research":

1. There is no cooking oil that is satisfactory for this diet
2. Dairy products are not allowed, so butter is not allowed -- it is a product of agriculture (somehow the New York Times readers who've picked up this trend managed to keep butter and cheese in the diet)
3. Alcohol is not allowed, so wine is out (somehow the New York Times readers who've picked up this trend managed to keep wine in the diet)
4. It's not sustainable, but it would be if we allowed some portion of the world's population to die off until it was sustainable

This was basically my point at the beginning -- a lot of people who say they are following this diet really are not. The trendy version now circulating is like an Atkins-with-benefits.

Okay buddy, you obviously didn't do enough research. Exactly how is it not sustainable? Can you explain? Do you not understand how Atkins works? It is not a low carb diet because carbs = bad. It is a low carb diet so your body uses fat as it's fuel source, rather than carbs. Also with the Paleo diet, you still consume fruits/vegetables which contain carbs. So I don't know how you can say it is not a sustainable diet.

There are different variations of the Paleo diet, some consume dairy, some don't. There is no reason to "hate" on it, just like people who "hate" on Atkins because they see it as a way of giving up. They think you don't need to completely stop eating certain foods, so it goes against their way of thinking. They feel threatened that there is a possibility they were doing something wrong all these years. Ask baz5, he's on the atkins diet basically. You ask him if it's not a good diet. My quote goes well with this. People try to find excuses to not believe or not accept something because it goes against what they believe. Atkins is not a fad diet. Fads don't exist for over 40 years.
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arisk wrote:
Oct 15th, 2011 7:45 pm
Banning proper use in a forum such as this simply perpetuates the problem by reinforcing the perspective that all uses of a word are negative.
KorruptioN wrote:
Oct 29th, 2010 9:11 pm
She must be better than all of us real men, at any cost. Feel like talking down to people who don't fit in her narrow-minded demographic? She's got it in spades.
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Cavemen didn't exactly have the longest/healthiest of lives.
Stop supporting monopolistic companies like Bell and Rogers if you want positive change in the Canadian telecommunications industry.
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Tijuana wrote:
May 27th, 2011 10:41 pm
Okay buddy, you obviously didn't do enough research. Exactly how is it not sustainable? Can you explain? Do you not understand how Atkins works? It is not a low carb diet because carbs = bad. It is a low carb diet so your body uses fat as it's fuel source, rather than carbs. Also with the Paleo diet, you still consume fruits/vegetables which contain carbs. So I don't know how you can say it is not a sustainable diet.

Right, it's a low carb diet so your body uses fat as its fuel source... which implies carbs would make you fat, and carbs are therefore bad, right? Or are people who following Atkins doing it for some reason other than that they think weight gain is bad?

Paleo (and Atkins) are not sustainable because of the amount of meat involved. 6 billion people going nuts on this kind of diet would not work, so it is not sustainable. Seriously -- I have seen people who one year ago were talking about how meat was a terrible thing for the environment now talking about this Paleo thing without seeing the disconnect.

It's one thing to raise a caveman population naturally on the Paleo diet. It's quite another thing to increase the world's population to 6 billion with the significant help of agriculturally-raised grains and then decide you're going to switch them all over to meat (which uses far more grains than would eating the grains directly, and has its own water input and pollution issues).
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hyperion wrote:
May 27th, 2011 10:48 pm
Cavemen didn't exactly have the longest/healthiest of lives.

That is one of my points -- how the hell does anyone know that cavemen didn't die of high blood pressure, heart disease, or cancer? That kind of evidence doesn't exist. All I've had so far in response are people telling me to go and "do the research", as if this has all been documented by caveman scholars with video footage to back it up.
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mbg wrote:
May 27th, 2011 10:50 pm
That is one of my points -- how the hell does anyone know that cavemen didn't die of high blood pressure, heart disease, or cancer?

They didn't live long enough to develop these diseases.
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mbg wrote:
May 27th, 2011 10:49 pm
Right, it's a low carb diet so your body uses fat as its fuel source... which implies carbs would make you fat, and carbs are therefore bad, right? Or are people who following Atkins doing it for some reason other than that they think weight gain is bad?
No, on the contrary, if anything fats make you "fat"

1g of carbs = 4 calories
1g of fats = 9 calories

So the reason why the Atkins diet works, is because you weed your body off using carbs as a fuel source, and instead you use fat, which is a better fuel source since it contains more energy. Remember. A calorie is a unit of energy.
mbg wrote:
May 27th, 2011 10:49 pm
Paleo (and Atkins) are not sustainable because of the amount of meat involved. 6 billion people going nuts on this kind of diet would not work, so it is not sustainable. Seriously -- I have seen people who one year ago were talking about how meat was a terrible thing for the environment now talking about this Paleo thing without seeing the disconnect.

It's one thing to raise a caveman population naturally on the Paleo diet. It's quite another thing to increase the world's population to 6 billion with the significant help of agriculturally-raised grains and then decide you're going to switch them all over to meat (which uses far more grains than would eating the grains directly, and has its own water input and pollution issues).

No one is saying everyone should be on a Paleo diet. Some are just saying it has its advantages for certain situations. Like losing weight. As mentioned, people have a problem with this because they see this as cheating or unethical. They think you are being lazy. You know how hard it is to do the Atkins diet? No carbs? If you are lazy this diet won't help you.

Like I said, you clearly, haven't done your research since you don't know how the Paleo/Atkins diet works. People like to put their own beliefs in front of science when it doesn't benefit their view point.
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arisk wrote:
Oct 15th, 2011 7:45 pm
Banning proper use in a forum such as this simply perpetuates the problem by reinforcing the perspective that all uses of a word are negative.
KorruptioN wrote:
Oct 29th, 2010 9:11 pm
She must be better than all of us real men, at any cost. Feel like talking down to people who don't fit in her narrow-minded demographic? She's got it in spades.
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Tijuana wrote:
May 28th, 2011 3:38 am
No, on the contrary, if anything fats make you "fat"

1g of carbs = 4 calories
1g of fats = 9 calories

So the reason why the Atkins diet works, is because you weed your body off using carbs as a fuel source, and instead you use fat, which is a better fuel source since it contains more energy. Remember. A calorie is a unit of energy.
If fats make you fat, Atkins eschews carbs in favour of an increase in fat, and Atkins helps you lose weight, how does "on the contrary" fat make you fat?
No one is saying everyone should be on a Paleo diet. Some are just saying it has its advantages for certain situations. Like losing weight. As mentioned, people have a problem with this because they see this as cheating or unethical. They think you are being lazy. You know how hard it is to do the Atkins diet? No carbs? If you are lazy this diet won't help you.
I have no problems with the Paleo diet. I have problems with the fact that it's become a trend, and trendy people have picked it up and are trying to shoe-horn their favourite foods into it by making up weird justifications based on what they imagine cavemen might have done.
Like I said, you clearly, haven't done your research since you don't know how the Paleo/Atkins diet works. People like to put their own beliefs in front of science when it doesn't benefit their view point.
Yeah, and other people like to pretend their beliefs are scientific. Is there sound science behind the idea that fat makes you fat simply because it has more calories?
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mbg wrote:
May 28th, 2011 6:25 am
If fats make you fat, Atkins eschews carbs in favour of an increase in fat, and Atkins helps you lose weight, how does "on the contrary" fat make you fat?



I have no problems with the Paleo diet. I have problems with the fact that it's become a trend, and trendy people have picked it up and are trying to shoe-horn their favourite foods into it by making up weird justifications based on what they imagine cavemen might have done.



Yeah, and other people like to pretend their beliefs are scientific. Is there sound science behind the idea that fat makes you fat simply because it has more calories?

Dude, if you don't know the mechanism of how calories affect and interact with the body, you simply wont understand. Ask a dietician if you are really concerened or ask baz5 and he can tell you more.
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arisk wrote:
Oct 15th, 2011 7:45 pm
Banning proper use in a forum such as this simply perpetuates the problem by reinforcing the perspective that all uses of a word are negative.
KorruptioN wrote:
Oct 29th, 2010 9:11 pm
She must be better than all of us real men, at any cost. Feel like talking down to people who don't fit in her narrow-minded demographic? She's got it in spades.
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