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Locked: The politics rule is getting out of hand

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  • Jun 5th, 2012 9:37 am
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Again, I know the new rule will take some time to used too and from the mods side, to apply it evenly and consistently. Yes, there will be an adjustment period for everyone, including the mods and myself.

I just wanted to remind everyone, that there was a strict no political rule when Ryan was here. The community was asking for Political discussion to be allowed and I did allow it. It worked for big issues like Federal and Provincial elections but when it came to city politics and such, it just became a bicker feast. Which isn't good for the health of the community and traffic. Also, we are a national site and I have a know that for those who live outside of Toronto, all the Toronto related political threads, were annoying and made the decision not to come to Off Topic easier.

Please bare with us and I am positive that everything will settle down and we can all get on with our lives and have a fun Off Topic with good discussions.

I did say the political sub forum was put on the back burner and in no way is that not dealing with the issue. Down the road in 3-6 months, it will get revisited but currently, no political discussions are allowed.

I know that all stories in the news or in life have a political aspect to it. You can't get around it as politics touches/drives our way of life. We need to make judgement calls everyday on every thread that is posted. Most times we get it right but there are the odd time when we don't. I totally understand that everyone has a different view on what is considered political and what isn't and we won't appease everyone and for that I am sorry.

I know change is hard and there will be an adjustment period. Please be patient and don't take it out on the mods, they are doing a very tough job and are doing it out of the love of the site. Calling out mods is not allowed, plain and simple!
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It's not going to take much time to get used to if the rule is applied consistently. You can't threaten people with bans for creating political discussions, then turn around and allow some political discussions. This thread is political.

banned-china-tiananmen-anniversary-6-4- ... a-1185345/

That is as political as they come, yet you said you were going to allow it. I posted what I did in that thread as I wanted it to be locked. I don't like the new censorship rules but I can live with it no problem and so can others, provided it's actually enforced consistently. How on earth is it fair to ban some for political threads due to no tolerance and then turn around and allow some political threads. It seems you guys are still clearly missing the point I've been trying to make. I'm not bitching about the new rules, I'm complaining about how hypocritical it is to tell the members that political threads are not allowed, no exceptions, then turn around and allow some political threads, but also threaten to ban anyone who makes political threads.

It's like me training my dogs to stay off the couch, inviting them up onto the couch, then giving them trouble once they do so. It makes no sense and is confusing everyone. I don't want you guys to ban all political threads, but you have decided to do so already, so please just enforce the rule consistently so we know what to expect.
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Shaner wrote:
Jun 4th, 2012 10:58 am
It's not going to take much time to get used to if the rule is applied consistently. You can't threaten people with bans for creating political discussions, then turn around and allow some political discussions. This thread is political.

banned-china-tiananmen-anniversary-6-4- ... a-1185345/

That is as political as they come, yet you said you were going to allow it. I posted what I did in that thread as I wanted it to be locked. I don't like the new censorship rules but I can live with it no problem and so can others, provided it's actually enforced consistently. How on earth is it fair to ban some for political threads due to no tolerance and then turn around and allow some political threads. It seems you guys are still clearly missing the point I've been trying to make. I'm not bitching about the new rules, I'm complaining about how hypocritical it is to tell the members that political threads are not allowed, no exceptions, then turn around and allow some political threads, but also threaten to ban anyone who makes political threads.

It's like me training my dogs to stay off the couch, inviting them up onto the couch, then giving them trouble once they do so. It makes no sense and is confusing everyone. I don't want you guys to ban all political threads, but you have decided to do so already, so please just enforce the rule consistently so we know what to expect.
How many political threads have been " allowed " since the political thread ban has come into effect ?
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poedua wrote:
Jun 4th, 2012 11:09 am
How many political threads have been " allowed " since the political thread ban has come into effect ?

Honestly poedua, I have no interest in discussing this with you. My comments were directed to the admin of this site and the answer to your question is already in the post you quoted.
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Shaner wrote:
Jun 4th, 2012 11:10 am
Honestly poedua, I have no interest in discussing this with you. My comments were directed to the admin of this site and the answer to your question is already in the post you quoted.

Well, I'm not sure what ' political threads ' you're referring to that have been " allowed " - which is why I asked.

You keep saying " turn around and allow some political discussions [ threads ] "

What political discussions [ threads ] ?

I've looked at OT and I don't recognize any political threads have been " allowed " to remain since the political thread ban has come into effect.
" The placebo effect is the most powerful supplement of all "
" The pain of discipline weighs ounces, the pain of neglect weighs tons "
" The best training in the world can't overcome a lousy diet "
TRAIN HARD !!!!
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Jan 12, 2012
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Shaner wrote:
Jun 4th, 2012 10:58 am
It's not going to take much time to get used to if the rule is applied consistently. You can't threaten people with bans for creating political discussions, then turn around and allow some political discussions. This thread is political.

banned-china-tiananmen-anniversary-6-4- ... a-1185345/

That is as political as they come, yet you said you were going to allow it. I posted what I did in that thread as I wanted it to be locked. I don't like the new censorship rules but I can live with it no problem and so can others, provided it's actually enforced consistently. How on earth is it fair to ban some for political threads due to no tolerance and then turn around and allow some political threads. It seems you guys are still clearly missing the point I've been trying to make. I'm not bitching about the new rules, I'm complaining about how hypocritical it is to tell the members that political threads are not allowed, no exceptions, then turn around and allow some political threads, but also threaten to ban anyone who makes political threads.

It's like me training my dogs to stay off the couch, inviting them up onto the couch, then giving them trouble once they do so. It makes no sense and is confusing everyone. I don't want you guys to ban all political threads, but you have decided to do so already, so please just enforce the rule consistently so we know what to expect.

Actually they CAN - they run this site - they work for YPC - they can decide what they think is mod-able and what isn't. The fact that they CHOOSE to communicate and try to co-operate with us is a BONUS. If they think something isn't "political" in the same context as you or want to leave a thread open that's their right- I think people like you that purposely go into threads to have them locked should be banned because it's really IMMATURE imo.....You're not getting your way so you want everyone else to suffer....That's how a lot of the trolls acted in Off topic before the purge....Hell I was in the "rfd unofficial chatroom" one time and people were discussing purposely trolling threads because they didn't like that they were being modded for trolling and others weren't......It was funny because the posts that weren't modded were never reported...

I think if people want the mods to act properly and fairly they need to look at themselves first and the way their acting....Instead of derailing the Eaton centre thread complaining about mods why not PM them directly? Report the posts you think are mod-able and if action isn't taken then again PM the mods - it's quite simple...

If you don't want to discuss things with poedua and what to talk directly to the mods then PM the mods directly. This is a public forum.
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Shaner wrote:
Jun 4th, 2012 10:58 am
It's not going to take much time to get used to if the rule is applied consistently. You can't threaten people with bans for creating political discussions, then turn around and allow some political discussions. This thread is political.

banned-china-tiananmen-anniversary-6-4- ... a-1185345/

That is as political as they come, yet you said you were going to allow it. I posted what I did in that thread as I wanted it to be locked. I don't like the new censorship rules but I can live with it no problem and so can others, provided it's actually enforced consistently. How on earth is it fair to ban some for political threads due to no tolerance and then turn around and allow some political threads. It seems you guys are still clearly missing the point I've been trying to make. I'm not bitching about the new rules, I'm complaining about how hypocritical it is to tell the members that political threads are not allowed, no exceptions, then turn around and allow some political threads, but also threaten to ban anyone who makes political threads.

It's like me training my dogs to stay off the couch, inviting them up onto the couch, then giving them trouble once they do so. It makes no sense and is confusing everyone. I don't want you guys to ban all political threads, but you have decided to do so already, so please just enforce the rule consistently so we know what to expect.
I don't know who's been saying you will get banned for creating a political thread. This is just fear mongering at its best. We don't allow them, nobody ever said you will get banned for making them.

I totally understand your position but the Tiananmen square situation was a global defining moment, thought users would like speak their peace about it without politics like human resolve, determination, etc. You are right Shaner, I shouldn't have said I would have left it open. It's been edited to show that.

Thanks for your due diligence!
For all community related matters, please PM TomRFD
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oranr wrote:
Jun 4th, 2012 11:29 am
I don't know who's been saying you will get banned for creating a political thread. This is just fear mongering at its best. We don't allow them, nobody ever said you will get banned for making them.

A moderator said users who make political posts/threads would be banned. I honestly don't feel like naming the mod as I'm not trying to bring heat to him/her (although that post that threatened a ban still remains). You know I don't like the new rule, but as Drew said, it's your site and you make the rules and I'll abide by them. I just didn't like reading a post from a mod that threatened a ban, and then hearing from an admin that a political thread can remain.

Anyway, I'm done with this post and the comments/suggestions forum.
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Shaner wrote:
Jun 4th, 2012 11:41 am
A moderator said users who make political posts/threads would be banned. I honestly don't feel like naming the mod as I'm not trying to bring heat to him/her (although that post that threatened a ban still remains). You know I don't like the new rule, but as Drew said, it's your site and you make the rules and I'll abide by them. I just didn't like reading a post from a mod that threatened a ban, and then hearing from an admin that a political thread can remain.

Anyway, I'm done with this post and the comments/suggestions forum.

I'm in the same boat as Shaner. I have no problem with the new rules, but I'd just like to know what they actually are in realistic terms. There are cases in OT (I believe it was the Eaton Centre thread) where a user's post is edited by a mod, and then that mod-edited post is deleted by another mod. I have no problem with the post being either edited or deleted to make the thread conform to the rules, it just feels like there is a lot of inconsistency in a) what the actual rule is, and b) how it will be enforced (e.g. some threatening bans, oranr saying no bans). Furthermore I'd just like to say I don't think Shaner has been treated very fairly, as several mod posts in the thread (where he questioned whether or not something was political) are basically along the lines of "this topic is clearly politics, so either you're a troll or an idiot", as though it's obvious to anyone with any common sense (it isn't) where the line is. Like I said I have no problem with following the rule, I just think it would be helpful to everyone involved to know more clearly what exactly is allowed and what isn't, and how these things are going to be dealt with.

Edit: In fact, looking back through the Eaton Centre thread, I believe that a user did end up getting banned for posting about politics (gun control).
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Manatus wrote:
Jun 4th, 2012 12:51 pm
I'm in the same boat as Shaner. I have no problem with the new rules, but I'd just like to know what they actually are in realistic terms. There are cases in OT (I believe it was the Eaton Centre thread) where a user's post is edited by a mod, and then that mod-edited post is deleted by another mod. I have no problem with the post being either edited or deleted to make the thread conform to the rules, it just feels like there is a lot of inconsistency in a) what the actual rule is, and b) how it will be enforced (e.g. some threatening bans, oranr saying no bans). Furthermore I'd just like to say I don't think Shaner has been treated very fairly, as several mod posts in the thread (where he questioned whether or not something was political) are basically along the lines of "this topic is clearly politics, so either you're a troll or an idiot", as though it's obvious to anyone with any common sense (it isn't) where the line is. Like I said I have no problem with following the rule, I just think it would be helpful to everyone involved to know more clearly what exactly is allowed and what isn't, and how these things are going to be dealt with.

Edit: In fact, looking back through the Eaton Centre thread, I believe that a user did end up getting banned for posting about politics (gun control).

It's already been noted that our moderators have been highly trained in determining themselves what is acceptable or not. Every decision they have made has been the correct one so leave them alone.
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So someone made a thread asking if Remembrance Day threads will be locked and Mr. Perfect said:
Anyways your answer is NO. It wouldnt be locked and contrary to whats being fed, we are reasonable enough to know what should be allowed. We have no qualms with people paying their respect to the soldiers and we will try our best to moderate and delete out any irrelevant posts just as we presently do.
So how come Hairball's Tiananmen Square thread gets locked?
Hairball wrote:I would personally like to pay tribute to all those who suffered the loss of a loved one that day who tried to fight for freedom
Mods should either promise to lock the Remembrance Day threads when the time comes or re-open the Tiananmen Square thread as originally intended by Oranr.
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Aznsilvrboy wrote:
Jun 4th, 2012 4:09 pm
So someone made a thread asking if Remembrance Day threads will be locked and Mr. Perfect said:



So how come Hairball's Tiananmen Square thread gets locked?



Mods should either promise to lock the Remembrance Day threads when the time comes or re-open the Tiananmen Square thread as originally intended by Oranr.

HB's thread was closed because as a user himself stated in this thread earlier he clearly broke the rules to have HB's thread close...

Oranr probably could have just deleted said post and allowed the thread to stay open but who knows.
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Drew87 wrote:
Jun 4th, 2012 4:23 pm
HB's thread was closed because as a user himself stated in this thread earlier he clearly broke the rules to have HB's thread close...

Oranr probably could have just deleted said post and allowed the thread to stay open but who knows.

What rules?
oranr wrote:Oh, well, closed for Politics.
Remembrance Day is just as political.
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Aznsilvrboy wrote:
Jun 4th, 2012 4:28 pm
What rules?



Remembrance Day is just as political.

PM Oranr and I'm sure you'll get a prompt answer within a reasonable time explaining what happened.
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Aznsilvrboy wrote:
Jun 4th, 2012 4:09 pm
So someone made a thread asking if Remembrance Day threads will be locked and Mr. Perfect said:

So how come Hairball's Tiananmen Square thread gets locked?

Mods should either promise to lock the Remembrance Day threads when the time comes or re-open the Tiananmen Square thread as originally intended by Oranr.
Although I'm not a mod, I definitely can see a difference in the two threads. In most Remembrance Day threads I've read, the discussion centers mostly around the historical aspects. I'm sure the mods would jump in if members derailed it to the politics of war or certain government policies towards war. Whereas the Tiananmen thread, the OP already started to make a political statement (ie. "one day the truth will come out") and the thread would likely follow that line down towards government policies.

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