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Questions on... Graphic & Web Design Post-Secondary Options & Careers

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Jun 18, 2006
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Questions on... Graphic & Web Design Post-Secondary Options & Careers

I'm Currently in highschool, and I'm starting to wonder about my post-secondary options. My field of interest in graphic designing, webpage designing, animations, etc... I talked to a lot of people and they all said the same story: graphic designers go to colleges. My teacher, especially, recommended the this college. After a short googling and websites search, I realized George Brown does seem like they have an extensive graphic design program.

However, I have very little knowledge on postsecondary options, programs, and whatnots, so I was just wondering if anyone have any opinions as to which college or university to go to.

As a matter of fact... is graphic designing even a good career? My concerns are that they are already way-too-much graphic designers out there, which will lead to a great deal of competition.


some questions...

1. University (which one)/ College (which one) for graphic design programs?
2. Useful courses to take in grade 11/12 to prepare for graphic design...
3. Career examples or job examples from graphics design program...

Any input/opinions will be very helpful ; )
27 replies
Jr. Member
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Sep 21, 2005
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Hey,

We kinda have something in common here!!! I love graphic design but im prolly gonna go to a advertising program when i graduate from Univ. I find graphic design doesn't offer many job opportunies where as advertising you can do media buys etc.

If you are the type of person who prefers hands on experience then i suggest you to go to college. University teaches you theories and doesnt have any production work except Concordia Univ in Montreal. Their communication program is one of the best in Ontario.

I dont recommend going to George Brown College...have you thought about Sheridan college ? they are a well known art college but its very competitive! OCAD is another art college but i heard its a lot of work...students spend a lot of time on their artwork.

You can also purchase the Macleans magazine that rates the Univ..i think they do college too im not to sure about that. Visit the colleges/univ that will help you on your decision...i hope this helps! :)
Jr. Member
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May 22, 2005
137 posts
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Toronto
Go to OCAD (Ontario College of Art and Design) or YSDN (York University/Sheridan College Joint Program in Design) if you want to go to school in Ontario. Outside Ontario, I've heard good things about NSCAD (Halifax?) and Emily Carr (Vancouver). Keep in mind I know almost nothing about George Brown or Humber.

Personally I'm a graduate of YSDN, although I did some electives at OCAD. From my experience, YSDN tends to teach more professional skills such as how to handle the business aspect of design, etc, whereas OCAD tends to focus more on the conceptual aspects. That's not to say that either ignores those things, it's more of a slight tendency in one direction over another.

Reasons to go to YSDN or OCAD:

1. It's a 4 year program which means you end up with a degree (Bachelor of Design). People can argue about whether or not a degree is required in design, but ALL OTHER THINGS BEING EQUAL, the job will go to the person with the degree. Design isn't something you can pick up in a year or two. It takes years to develop your skills. Therefore it makes sense that more education is better than less. Also if you choose, you can go for your masters after your bachelors. That means you can become a university professor... some day. If you want.

2. Probably better instructors on average. Why? They're the biggest and most well known programs in Canada. It's the same reason why Harvard and MIT get better instructors than U of Toledo or whatever. YSDN even has a Masters degree program now, and links to IIT, which is one of the most respected design schools in the world. Granted, some of my profs were idiots (YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE...) but some of them were brilliant.

3. Connections, connections, connections. Since I graduated I've never been unemployed more than 3 weeks. Last week I had to turn down 2 interviews that were offered to me that I didn't apply for. I'm just average talented, but I have an insane amount of connections I've made through my professors and their friends, many of whom are big names in the industry. Yes there are too many designers out there right now. That being the case, wouldn't you rather know the guys who run the design firms?

4. Best(ish) of the Best(ish). I think the minimum highschool average for an entry interview into the program is mid-high 80's now, maybe even 90's. I imagine OCAD is around the same. YSDN claims to have the most talented students (propaganda! haha). I dunno how true that is in reality, but I can tell you for a fact that from the time I was in first year to now (6-7 years later i guess), the quality of work has improved significantly. People coming into first year now are as good as those who were in 2nd and 3rd year when I was in the program. Scary.

Attend the grad shows for all the colleges and universities. They usually happen around April or May. Take a look at the level of work produced and choose a school you think is right for you.

Reasons NOT to go to YSDN or OCAD:

1. Full of themselves. They're among the best grads in Canada and they sure do act like it sometimes. I do too... whoops.

2. Professional Memberships. They try to jam a whole lot of professional crap down your throat (more YSDN than OCAD). Organizations, RGD, blah blah blah. If you want to be the design equivalent of a corporate lackey, then take it all in. If not, ignore it. I'm not gonna start my ranting, but research it for yourself. It's a case of old school values and red tape destroying good intentions.

3. All the work coming out of there looks the same. Kind of. Yes there are variations, but because the schools are SO STRUCTURED and rigid, all the projects assigned are EXACTLY the same, and thus the results are very similar. I found YSDN to be somewhat suffocating at times. I was once (twice, three times!) told one of my projects (a stamp design) was too different and was forced to change it or fail. I then designed a stamp that looked like any other stamp... and was praised. Woohoo!

4. You may end up hating design because of the school. I did. Now I'm trying to move my career in another direction. Granted, some of my friends absolutely love design now because of the program. So who knows.

Good luck!
Sr. Member
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Jan 13, 2006
682 posts
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Graphic Design: Great career only if you have the creativity skills. You should have an art portfolio by now. Very competitive program. Very hard to move up the corporate laddar. Anyone can get a graphic design diploma/degree, but its all about what you do and how you create promotional materials, posters, web images, that makes a difference. Great places that offer a graphic design diploma in college: Seneca, George Brown & Sheridan. If you have extra cash on hand, you might want to check out International Academy of Design or OCAD. Great reputation for design/

Is this really you want to do? You can earn big cash only if you can create awesome stuff. In the long run, I suggest you to take web/graphic design + taking additional theory marketing/sales courses. Thus, you will have an understanding of the business & technical side of Marketing. Then, you might have more chances of getting into business meetings. Rather than just sitting in front of a screen creating stuff all day long. Graphic Design/Web Design, you will most likely be working in the Marketing Department if you dont see the big picture of a company. Take some marketing courses or obtain a certificate to back you up. Otherwise, get a bachelor degree-continual education.

Good luck my friend.
Newbie
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Jun 18, 2006
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Go to OCAD (Ontario College of Art and Design) or YSDN (York University/Sheridan College Joint Program in Design) if you want to go to school in Ontario. Outside Ontario, I've heard good things about NSCAD (Halifax?) and Emily Carr (Vancouver). Keep in mind I know almost nothing about George Brown or Humber.
I'll definitely have a look at OCAD. Seems like it's a highly recommended college for design. (Btw, Your explanation is so thorough, thanks ; ) )

So far it seems to me that everyone is recommending me colleges, including my own relatives & family. Now, I'm in a chinese family... :lol: You know chinese moms & dads. Colleges: big NONO. University: YOU BETTER GET IN.

Also, I know this is a very typical 'noob' thought, but, do colleges students generally have a lower grade than university students? Or, do colleges have a lower minimum grade/average requirement than universities?



Computer500 wrote: Graphic Design: Great career only if you have the creativity skills. You should have an art portfolio by now. Very competitive program. Very hard to move up the corporate laddar.
An art portfolio? Crap. If you mean art as in visual arts... then, well I haven't took any visual art / photography courses yet, and currently I'm in Grade ten. Georgebrown college also requires an art portfolio to enter their graphics design program... does that mean I should take art / photography in Grade 11? I've looked into the grade 11 art courses, and they all require the prerequisites of grade 9 or 10 art courses, which I have never took...
Computer500 wrote:
Is this really you want to do? You can earn big cash only if you can create awesome stuff.
So far, yes. I have a huge interest in graphic designing and web designs. In fact I've created quite a few websites (not those sucky geocities ones, but they're personal websites, so I'd preferred not to share the link...).

Also I think your take on taking business marketing courses is a great idea. I really would never have thought about it. Thank you so much for that pointer.

Last question. (in this post) (Sorry, I know I have lots of questions, but this post-secondary-options-thing is all over my mind right now.)
Let's just say, I'm SURE that I want to be a graphic & web designer.
So, what courses should I take in grade 11 and/or 12?

Bare in mind that in grade 11:
1. the mandatory courses are, English & Mathematics.
2. There are 6 optional courses I can choose
3. Leave 1-2 courses open for my interest-courses ;-)...
which will most likely be Gym and something else... (Philosophy...?)
this makes 4-5 optional courses available

In grade 12:
1. the only mandatory courses are, English.
2. There are 7 optional courses I can choose

Thank you guys.
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May 22, 2005
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Toronto
Oreo__ wrote: I'll definitely have a look at OCAD. Seems like it's a highly recommended college for design. (Btw, Your explanation is so thorough, thanks ; ) )

So far it seems to me that everyone is recommending me colleges, including my own relatives & family. Now, I'm in a chinese family... :lol: You know chinese moms & dads. Colleges: big NONO. University: YOU BETTER GET IN.

Also, I know this is a very typical 'noob' thought, but, do colleges students generally have a lower grade than university students? Or, do colleges have a lower minimum grade/average requirement than universities?
No problem. With OCAD and YSDN you get a university degree. So for example, with OCAD it's called a college, but the design program is really no different than any university. If it helps, if you go YSDN you can take almost all your classes at York U instead of Sheridan, so you're even on a university campus. Specifically you come out with an Honours Bachelor of Design.

And generally speaking, yes colleges have lower minimum requirements than universities. But it all depends on the specific program.
Sr. Member
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Jan 13, 2006
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1. Graphic/Web Design programs require you to show them your art portfolio (a couple samples). Yes, its 'visual arts' and anything else you have created would be a bonus. They want someone who understands a bit of those principles of something such as tone, balance, color, etc. Someone at RedFlagDeals also mentioned about completing a drawing test at Seneca to see if you are qualified.

2. Its good to take marketing/sales/business courses because a web.graphic designer is usually placed in the marketing department of a company.

Beware on what courses you take in high school. It's not too hard to get into a graphic design program in College. If you want a Bachelor degree in design, watch out! You have to take those art courses gr11, 12.

Buy Apple PowerMac G5, learn photoshop, indesign, illustrator, flash, quark, etc.

Another option is: you can learn these softwares on your own time while developing your skills and get a bachelor degree in design. It would be 10X better. You will have management skills + technical graphic design skills. :)
If you are a hands on person, college diploma is ok.

bye
Newbie
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Jun 18, 2006
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Computer500 wrote: 1. Graphic/Web Design programs require you to show them your art portfolio (a couple samples). Yes, its 'visual arts' and anything else you have created would be a bonus. They want someone who understands a bit of those principles of something such as tone, balance, color, etc.
Damn. I've really never thought about taking art courses, so I never enrolled myself into any in grade 9 or 10. Now all the grade 11 visual art courses requires a previous grade9/10 art course. Similarly, the grade 11 photography courses requires a grade 10 photography course.... now I'm sure I can pick up grade 11 art material without any previous course background, but I doubt they'll let me... so Would it still be worth it to take a grade 11 AND a grade 10 art course in grade 11?

For one thing, I know it's virtually impossible to change grade 10 courses. Reason one being it's already a month through the first semester. Reason two? Apparently they say 'grade 9&10 courses do not affect your post-secondary options or choices'. Right. So, Is it ever possible in highschools to skip the prerequisites? I've never tried it before.
Deal Addict
Jan 27, 2004
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Toronto
just take art in second semester

i'm sure they offer it in second semester in grade 10 since most kids just take visual arts in grade 9 or 10 to get one of the arts credit which is a high school requirement

or talk to the art teacher and see what he/she can do to get you into grade 11 visual arts course...the art teacher at my high school made me do a drawing test and stuff to see if i can handle the course :P

i highly doubt it was even neccessary since there's usually like only 10 students who actually takes senior visual art courses in high school :lol:

also i beleive you dont need visual arts in gr. 12 to get into OCAD or sheridan's design program...not 100% sure though i remember when i applied the only requirement was a good portfolio + (70% in english for OCAD) (85%+ average for york/Sheridan's design)

i think the only Sheridan's animation and illustration program requires grade 12 visual arts...at least that's what it was when i applied

*key to getting into OCAD is a very versatile sketchbook*
Sr. Member
Dec 6, 2005
634 posts
11 upvotes
Markham
gruegoo wrote: Granted, some of my profs were idiots (YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE...) but some of them were brilliant.


Professional Memberships. They try to jam a whole lot of professional crap down your throat (more YSDN than OCAD). Organizations, RGD, blah blah blah. If you want to be the design equivalent of a corporate lackey, then take it all in. If not, ignore it. I'm not gonna start my ranting, but research it for yourself. It's a case of old school values and red tape destroying good intentions.


4. You may end up hating design because of the school.

Good luck!

yup i know what you mean.. im second year right now..

and im starting to hate it now lol..
course workload is harsh.
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Sep 21, 2005
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[quote="Oreo__" post_id="3961589" time="1159719314" user_id="49416"]
So far it seems to me that everyone is recommending me colleges, including my own relatives & family. Now, I'm in a chinese family... :lol: You know chinese moms & dads. Colleges: big NONO. University: YOU BETTER GET IN.
[QUOTE]

LOL!!! i know what u mean my family's like that too! :cheesygri

I think you have a lot of time to decide on your career.You should still keep your options open because in the middle of gr 12 you might decide that graphic design isn't for you. I'm not against graphic design ..dont get me wrong here! But i know a lot of ppl who end up changing their minds last min and realized oh **** i dont have the requirements to apply for this program in univ/college. Then they stay behind for one yr or longer b/c they dont meet the prequisites for the course.

In grade 12 I suggest you to continue taking art courses because it gives you a sense of the lvl of difficulty (altho we all know its not even close to as OCAD etc. ) and it improves your skills which is benefical to u...ur portfolio will look a lot better with gr 12 work b/c u have improved.
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May 5, 2005
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Withouth resorting to heavy handed research of my own (I'm lazy), how much would a full course program at OCAD or YSDN cost? I'm marginally interested in taking a 3D animation course but fear it may not be enough to garner attention of the employers. It's all about the degree as Gruegoo said.

At any rate, I am no spring chicken and would love to get into it sooner rather than later; and this would be a big investment in both time and money for me so it has to be the right one. I would say passionate would be a too strong of a word, but I do fancy the idea of making models and such for games. I can learn to love it when I look at the vocational alternatives.
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May 22, 2005
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Emancipated wrote: Withouth resorting to heavy handed research of my own (I'm lazy), how much would a full course program at OCAD or YSDN cost? I'm marginally interested in taking a 3D animation course but fear it may not be enough to garner attention of the employers. It's all about the degree as Gruegoo said.

At any rate, I am no spring chicken and would love to get into it sooner rather than later; and this would be a big investment in both time and money for me so it has to be the right one. I would say passionate would be a too strong of a word, but I do fancy the idea of making models and such for games. I can learn to love it when I look at the vocational alternatives.
If you're looking at graphic design, YSDN is about $7000 a year plus supplies and books. I think OCAD is around the same, but I don't know for sure. Realistically including supplies and tuition, its about $32,000 for the 4 years. If you're stupid/lazy like me and end up taking extra time to finish, its alot more... bah.

For 3D Animation at Sheridan (the post grad program) I'm pretty sure it's over $10k for the 1 year. My friend took it and mentioned it was around there, but don't quote me on that.

YSDN or OCAD currently do NOT offer anything that directly relates to game design. For that I think Humber and George Brown have specific game design courses. Sheridan (without york) or Seneca@York offer good post-grad 3D programs from what I've heard. Actually Sheridan is considered one of the best in North America. Tuition prices reflect this.
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Dec 6, 2005
634 posts
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Markham
Emancipated wrote: Withouth resorting to heavy handed research of my own (I'm lazy), how much would a full course program at OCAD or YSDN cost? I'm marginally interested in taking a 3D animation course but fear it may not be enough to garner attention of the employers. It's all about the degree as Gruegoo said.

At any rate, I am no spring chicken and would love to get into it sooner rather than later; and this would be a big investment in both time and money for me so it has to be the right one. I would say passionate would be a too strong of a word, but I do fancy the idea of making models and such for games. I can learn to love it when I look at the vocational alternatives.
yah im paying around 7k at the moment at YSDN, if your interested in 3d, like gruegoo said, sheridan is the place to go to.
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Jun 18, 2006
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nightwalker wrote: just take art in second semester

i'm sure they offer it in second semester in grade 10 since most kids just take visual arts in grade 9 or 10 to get one of the arts credit which is a high school requirement
As I mentioned earlier, taking art in my second semester is sadly not an option. The /stupid/ guidance dept. apparently claims that no course changes in grade nine and ten will be made because they won't affect our post-secondary options.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Btw, what sort of 'things' do graphic&webpage(or-related) designers do @ work? Designing grpahics, duh. But Are there anything else? Although I truly truly truly want to be a graphic/web designer, I also don't want to be a officechair-potato and sit in front of the monitor every, single, day. I would love to have an easy job in life, but not one that is boring, dull, and systematic... So. Are there any interpersonal things involved? i.e. talking-to-clients and meetings-with-people, etc.
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Oct 6, 2005
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Oreo__ wrote: I'm Currently in highschool, and I'm starting to wonder about my post-secondary options. My field of interest in graphic designing, webpage designing, animations, etc... I talked to a lot of people and they all said the same story: graphic designers go to colleges.[/B]
Goto York/Sheridan Design Program. It's a B. Des... probably the best program in Ontario.

As others have said, the York Sheridan program is a degree program, which gives you more options in the future - you can apply for post graduate programs (MBA, PMP, or whatever!).

Also, the degree cuts the amount of time to get your RGD designation (Registered Graphic Designer). The top students from this program seem to be in high demand. The pay might not be so great (starting low-30s), but almost everyone seems to enjoy what they do.
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Emancipated wrote: Withouth resorting to heavy handed research of my own (I'm lazy), how much would a full course program at OCAD or YSDN cost?
4 year program. Each semester is about 4 - 5K... so about 40K+ in total including books.

The labs at York are equiped pretty well - so you can get away without a computer at home.

Hours are harsh - especially during project time. I was at the design labs until 4 or 5 am with some design friends one time ;)
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Dec 6, 2005
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Markham
coolspot wrote: 4 year program. Each semester is about 4 - 5K... so about 40K+ in total including books.

The labs at York are equiped pretty well - so you can get away without a computer at home.

Hours are harsh - especially during project time. I was at the design labs until 4 or 5 am with some design friends one time ;)

4-5 k, which year are you in?


im paying 7k right now, and thats not including printing, boards, supplies, books, the works. thats going to cost around $600-$900 more

Oreo__ wrote: Btw, what sort of 'things' do graphic&webpage(or-related) designers do @ work[/COLOR]? Designing grpahics, duh. But Are there anything else? Although I truly truly truly want to be a graphic/web designer, I also don't want to be a officechair-potato and sit in front of the monitor every, single, day. I would love to have an easy job in life, but not one that is boring, dull, and systematic... So. Are there any interpersonal things involved? i.e. talking-to-clients and meetings-with-people, etc.

you design graphics, but it branches into many areas, typography, web, interactive, printing, packaging, industrial.. blah blah blah...


but sadly most of the time designers spend their time infront of the computer like "office chair potatoes".

if you want more interpersonal things, maybe you can look into marketing, or advertising.
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Apr 6, 2003
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I think with Graphic & Web Design the most important thing is your portfolio.

In my experience (both going to school for several years in multimedia courses and working in the field) people just don't care about college or courses you took.

The first question they will ask is "let's see your portfolio". ie: what have you done?
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ullyeus wrote: I think with Graphic & Web Design the most important thing is your portfolio.

In my experience (both going to school for several years in multimedia courses and working in the field) people just don't care about college or courses you took.

The first question they will ask is "let's see your portfolio". ie: what have you done?
Bang on. I work in the visual effects field doing 3d and compositing for feature film and a persons demo reel/portfolio is everything. Its more important then what school you go to and in many cases even more important then a resume.

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