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RFD Official Detailing Thread - Post all Detailing/Paint Related Questions here!

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RFD Official Detailing Thread - Post all Detailing/Paint Related Questions here!

This is the Official detailing thread.

Purpose is to hopefully help some of you RFDers with detailing related questions without having to resort to 3rd party websites OR making new threads.

1. People new to detailing might be confused by acronyms used. If you ever wondered what KSG or M95 was and wasn't sure where to search; here is the official acronym encoder:

http://www.autopia.org/forum/1036231-post1.html

This is your reference point for unknown ones but I will briefly list the most common ones that will be used:

LSP - last step product (wax, sealant, glaze)
MF - Microfiber (only towel that should be used for detailing related work
CC- Clear Coat
Klasse SG - Klasse Sealant Glaze (a sealant)
KAIO - Klasse AIO (all in one sealant/wax/polish)
ZAIO - Zaino AIO (sealant)
ISA - Isopropyl alcohol (rubbing alcohol cut in 50% with water)
SSR - Poor Boys Super Swirl Remover products
Megs - Meguiars Product

Other terminology we will try to clarify as much as possible in the original post but if not; please refer to the above link.

2. These articles will very quickly answer your questions to the most frequently asked questions:

How to wash your vehicle
How to clay your vehicle
How to wax your vehicle
The Perfect Shine!


3. You might notice I am linking alot to Autopia; it is a great resource. If we do not have the answer, Autopia will. However ask us and lets see if we can help first. Autopia is sometimes not very newbie friendly (especially when you do not search).

4. Alot of people have PMed me about detailing supplies. I will make my next post about what I recommend for vehicle paint conditions. This is not a definite answer; just what I choose to use. If you want something more specific you can PM me or post.

5. I will periodically post articles (hence why next three post are reserved) to help some of you RFDers out. If you want to see how to do something (polishing/waxing/sealant/claying/touch up/wetsanding) let me know and I will post in those reserved spots.

6. If you are looking for a detailer; please see the 2nd post.

7. That is it, you can post away!
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Where to get your vehicle detailed!

[Update August 18 - Approved]

Below is a compilation of detailers on RedFlagDeals. You will find their contact information, what services they offer, and what areas they service below:

Detailers in the Greater Toronto Region:

Attentiv to Detailz - Review Thread


Detailers in the Greater Vancouver Region :


Detailers in Quebec:


Detailers in the Maritimes :


Detailers in Alberta:


Detailers in Manitoba/Saskatchewan:
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Update
[QUOTE][August 9, 2008 - Can Stoners IG remove KAIO on a Windshield?]

Products:
Klasse AIO
E-shine Regular MF Towel 70/30 Blend (Buffing)
Canadian Tire All Purpose MF Towel 70/30 blend (drying)
Stoners Invisible Glass

Process:

Begining Shots:

[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Beading/IMG_1679.JPG[/IMG]

First step was to divide the glass into 4ths. I placed the half-@$$ ripped masking tape to divide a half of the windshield into halves. Once this was done; the area was cleaned with Distilled Water.

After cleaning it with distilled water; the area was then further cleaned with an ISA Mixture. This is to remove any sealant/wax that might be on the glass and impinge on the results. Once the area was cleaned; the area was sprayed with distilled water from a water sprayer (8 Shots) to the glass. Here is what the beading appeared to be:

[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Beading/IMG_1680.JPG[/IMG]

^ As you can tell the beads appeared to be quite distance and after a couple moments; most of the water remained on the windshield. After drying the surface; I then did a wipe across with a plastic bag to measure the slickness; it did not feel very slick although it did allow more glide than the other half (not shown in pictures) of the windshield not cleaned with an ISA mixture.

After the area was completely clean; I then proceeded to applying a thin amount of KAIO; right side first then left hand side. This was how much was applied on each side (followed trace line in pad and attempted to keep same thickness):

[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Beading/IMG_1682.JPG[/IMG]

After application of KAIO on both sides and buffing with the eshine towel; the glass was then again sprayed with distilled water. Here is the beading:

[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Beading/IMG_1683.JPG[/IMG]

[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Beading/IMG_1684.JPG[/IMG]

As you can tell the beading is MUCH more evident and the beading is much tighter than with just an ISA mixture. After a couple of moments the water appeared to roll down but I was not to concerned about this. After drying the glass on both sides; I then again measured the slickness/smoothness of the glass. It felt much, much more slick than just the ISA mixture before; evidently because of the Klasse AIO.

Following this; I sprayed the right side with this amount of Stoners Invisible Glass:

[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Beading/IMG_1686.JPG[/IMG]

The area was then wiped with a towel and again both sides were sprayed with distilled water from a spray bottle (10 shots):

[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Beading/IMG_1687.JPG[/IMG]
^^ (most of water rolled off the left side in this shot)
[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Beading/IMG_1690.JPG[/IMG]
[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Beading/IMG_1691.JPG[/IMG]
[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Beading/IMG_1692.JPG[/IMG]

Water beading appeared to be very similar on both sides; although the left side did roll the beads off much quicker which is why it kind of distorts some of the beading. On some of the close ups; it is very hard to say which side was cleaned with Stoners IG or was still with KAIO. The size of the beads was still very small in comparision to how it was with no protection and still showed signs of KAIO on both sides. I then dried both sides; and both felt equally slick; although I am sure my visual and hand are an accurate gauge.

Conclusion:

Overall I did not notice Stoners IG evidently stripping KAIO COMPLETELY off the windshield. On close ups; it is almost impossible to say which side recieved IG. Both exhibited much tighter beading than the glass not being protected & both exhibited similar slickness. The beading on both sides was of similar size and tightness. Only difference noted was that the side that did not apply IG water beads rolled off much quicker than the side that did recieve IG; this can be for numerous reasons and cannot be directly linked to IG persay.

It is possible that Stoners IG did remove a layer of KAIO but not enough to strip the protection. The amount I applied was also much more than one would apply to a section of glass. In practical sense; I do not see KAIO being completely stripped off glass after 1 application of IG althought more applications can make this possible.

Possible Faults
Unequal KAIO amounts for both sides (must have been)
Unequal glass porportions (must have been)
Did not measure amount of water sprayed on both sides (just measured shots)
Stoners IG application amount
Using my visual and sensory skills as a measurement


Follow up
I will not touch my windshield; and on a raining day I will take my car on the highway and see if there is a difference.

Any questions, comments, remarks, criticism; whatever. Let me know.[/QUOTE]
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How to determine when to wax your vehicle
[QUOTE][1st Article] July 15, 2008

How can you be sure when to wax your vehicle or your vehicle has an adequate layer of wax on it? When is it time to pull the vehicle in the garage for a good rub down with your favorite carnuba/sealant?

One quick way to check if water beads on your vehicle and how tight the beading is (although the tightness more or less varies heavily with the quality of the wax). This is how a vehicle with adequate layer of wax (3 layers of P21S Concours to be exact) looks after having water placed on it:

[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Canon/Picture%2 ... Large).jpg[/IMG]

Notice that the beading is not as tight as it can be? That is because the vehicle has not been waxed for 2 weeks. Contrary to what it says on that bottle of Turtle Wax or whatever you use; wax typically only last 2-3 weeks under regular driving. The more shine the wax produces usually the less durability it has. If you wash your vehicle at any point using an automated carwash or a carwash bay; you will find that you will have no LSP left. You must insure to wax your vehicle every month at a minimum to make sure it has adequate protection.


Now you are probably wondering; how does a vehicle look that hasn't been waxed. Well here is how it would look (although might not be as extreme since this vehicle has not been waxed for years):

[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Detail/Accord/I ... edium).JPG[/IMG]

Why wax your vehicle?

Wax essentially acts as a barrier between the elements and your clear coat. It prevents elements from scratching and degrading your clear coat. In short; it makes bird droppings and having your vehicle egged a smaller chance of permenently etching your clear coat. How does this look? This is what an eggshell can do to a vehicle without an adequate LSP (this cannot be polished out/wetsanded out):

[IMG]http://imusion.net/asad/Canon/IMG_0580%20(Medium).JPG[/IMG]

^^ In this picture it has come out as the white dot on a relatively well polished area. Save yourself the grief of having the same thing happen to your vehicle. Keep a good layer of wax/sealant on your car, keep a QD in yout trunk along with a MF Towel to wipe these up ASAP.

Which wax to choose?

There are two waxes on the market; carnauba based waxes (per discussion; none that contain cleaners) and synthetic waxes (blends of carnauba, etc.). Which wax you choose depends on what your results are and how you maintain your vehicle.

A synthetic wax offers more protection than a carnauba based wax, usually a much slicker surface, more durable, and hides minor swirls and imperfections.

A carnauba based wax offers low-to mid protection in comparision to a synthetic wax, a much warmer look, does not hide imperfections in the paint and has the ability to be layered.

With that being said; why would anyone go with a carnauba based wax over a synthetic wax? Simple, for those who need to ask synthetic wax is the way to go. You can usually stretch your waxes to 6 weeks as opposed to the 3-4 weeks and the protection is much more than a carnuaba wax. Synthetic waxes tend to flatter metallic vehicles and provide a very slick look. Synthetics cannot be layered due to cleaning ability (will strip last layer) but some manufactuers (Meguiars) recommend two layers for adequate coverage (might be to use more or that the cleaning abilities are not strong enough to fully remove both layers.

Where the carnauba waxes really shine; is well just that. They provide a warm, sunny (if you can say) glow to the vehicle versus the cold, plasticky look of synthetic waxes. They especially flatter darker vehicles. They have the ability to be layered which is a major plus. When you want to give your sealant a pop; you cannot use a synthetic wax as it will remove the sealant (the cleaners in the wax).

The carnauba waxes have their place; but it more reserved for people looking for the aesthetic purpose as opposed to the regular Joe just wanting to wax every 6 weeks and getting a nice result. That is not to say Carnauba waxes provide better results than a synthetic wax; just that both have their place for different purposes.

A good synthetic wax is Meguiars NXT 2.0.

A good pure carnuaba wax is P21S Concours.


Please refer to the first post as to how to apply wax. Any other questions post away! My first article so please feel free to correct my mistakes, so comments/criticism is appreciated.[/QUOTE]
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Example of a detailing scheme w/ example products

1.Wash/Dry (Meguiars Gold class car wash)
2.Clay (Riccardo clay)
3.Wash/dry (Meguiars Gold Class car wash, clean/dress wheels)
4.Compound Polish with UDM (Poorboys SSR 2.5)
5.Finishing Polish with UDM (Poorboys SSR 1)
6.Glaze/Filler (RMG)
7.Sealant (Klasse SG)
8.Wax (P21S/s100)

Notes:
1. Initially cleans the car and preps car for claying. Sheeting method works amazing for the drying car.
2. Remember to lube car properly with clay lube. And throw away clay when its too dirty, dirt particles will scratch the car.
3. Wash/dry to remove the oils left by clay lube. You may clean wheels using soap/water or use a formulated tire cleaning compound. Dress tires when dry.
4. The compounding stage is used to remove a fine layer of clearcoat to remove the swirls and paint defects, essentially revealing a new layer of paint.
5. The finishing polish stage removes a very fine layer of clearcoat. It is used to create/enhance the shine.
6. I would say this part is optional. If a swirl or paint defect is too deep it is recommend to just fill up the scratch rather than use an aggressive polish which removes a large part of clearcoat. I also use the RMG to help enhance the gloss of paint.
7. Another word for a synthetic wax, or a non-carnauba wax. A sealant and wax can both be used, but it is recommended to put the sealant first then the wax, due to bonding issues. Also, it is advisable to let the sealant cure for at least 12hrs before applying a carnauba wax)
8. P21S carnauba wax is essentially the same as s100 wax


A great site to purchase detailing supplies is eshine.ca
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Please ask your questions, and one of us will surely be able to help you :)
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It's a horrible day outside today; but I am thinking Monday I will do one about rust repair/paint touch up.
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I have a question, maybe someone can answer this.

I just took my car to have it detailed by a shop. This is my first time having my car detailed. Hand wash, waxing etc. The shop comes highly recommended and they do a lot of expensive cars (my car isn't very expensive).

My car's paint is black and I think the shop did an amazing job.

But I did notice that a couple of small spots (maybe the size of a penny), looks kind of faded and when I rub it, it won't come off. It looks like dust but it isn't. I tried to take a pic but it didn't come out.

Could this be a burn when they were buffing it? Just wondering. Other than that, the car looks good and very shiny.
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ji2o0k wrote:
Jul 12th, 2008 6:17 pm
I have a question, maybe someone can answer this.

I just took my car to have it detailed by a shop. This is my first time having my car detailed. Hand wash, waxing etc. The shop comes highly recommended and they do a lot of expensive cars (my car isn't very expensive).

My car's paint is black and I think the shop did an amazing job.

But I did notice that a couple of small spots (maybe the size of a penny), looks kind of faded and when I rub it, it won't come off. It looks like dust but it isn't. I tried to take a pic but it didn't come out.

Could this be a burn when they were buffing it? Just wondering. Other than that, the car looks good and very shiny.

Possibly, sounds like an area that wasn't properly finished. Bring it back there and let them see it, the quicker the better.
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Asad_A203, very informative first post.

For those of you in the GTA if one were looking to get detailing done at a reasonable price, what price range would be considered reasonable?
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FYI, Meg's Gold Class Car Wash is $7.47 at Walmart here in Canada. Forget trying to get it at twice that at CT. If you like using OTC products like Meg's, Walmart is the place to get them, since it's a little cheaper than CT overall. Walmart in the US however has all this stuff for ridiculously low prices, and stuff like Lexol/Vinylex can be picked up at Pep Boys or similar.

More esoteric stuff can be ordered in Canada either from http://www.eshine.ca/ (Niagara Region, ON) or http://www.thedetailingshop.com/ (Montreal, QC - no PST for Ontario residents). Both have free shipping over $150.
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Too bad eshine dosent carry the UDM anymore. And as for thedetailingshop, I was gonna order from them but them not answering my emails makes me wanna stay away.
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ji2o0k wrote:
Jul 12th, 2008 6:17 pm
I have a question, maybe someone can answer this.

I just took my car to have it detailed by a shop. This is my first time having my car detailed. Hand wash, waxing etc. The shop comes highly recommended and they do a lot of expensive cars (my car isn't very expensive).

My car's paint is black and I think the shop did an amazing job.

But I did notice that a couple of small spots (maybe the size of a penny), looks kind of faded and when I rub it, it won't come off. It looks like dust but it isn't. I tried to take a pic but it didn't come out.

Could this be a burn when they were buffing it? Just wondering. Other than that, the car looks good and very shiny.
It might be from the compounding, dried polish/wax residue. Burning through the clear coat usually occurs at the edge of body panels; random burn (over multiple small spots) through the clear coats even with a rotary polisher are not common.

As previously addressed; best bet would be to to take it back and see if they can remove it for you. If it is just polish/wax residue that dried; take some ISA and rub the area and see if removes the haze. If it was hazed from compounding; you will need to follow up with a finishing polish (SSR 1.0). You do need to reapply your LSP though after using ISA as it is strips wax and sealants.
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dbx wrote:
Jul 12th, 2008 10:32 pm
Asad_A203, very informative first post.

For those of you in the GTA if one were looking to get detailing done at a reasonable price, what price range would be considered reasonable?
Thanks.

Getting a reasonable price on a detail is hard to determine from what I have seen. You can get it done at a detailing shop for a median price (say 200-300 for a full polish) but the employees are generally not concerned on the final results and more or less on the time involved. The end result might be a detail that looks alright but not one that was done properly and might have damaged your vehicles clear coat than before. But some staff may special attention, etc. but I would not count on this.

You can pay an above average price for experienced and well known private detailers like gtaindetail and end up with an above average detail where your vehicle was probably their top priority. The $$ usually comes with the name; but you can be assured results are good.

There are also private detailers who aren't well known and usually have to adjust their price to compete. Some of their work might be spectacular but can also be very bad (just purchased their rotary and want to experiment on your shiny car) I would like to base this on an indepenent basis.

So to summarize; reasonable price for a detail is kind of hard to define. I would check out some local detailers (can be found through autopia.org) and see their results (ask for prior jobs) and gauge from their. A reasonable 3 stage polish in GTA from a medium-well known private detailer can range from $300-500.

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