Careers

Second Career Program - Feedback .

  • Last Updated:
  • Feb 14th, 2018 9:42 pm
Sr. Member
Aug 2, 2012
592 posts
205 upvotes
leesam wrote:
Nov 6th, 2017 5:57 pm
i withdraw from second career program last year due to personal problem. and i am wondering if it is possible to go back to school again ? i want to go back to the same school and same program of study ? do i need to go through the same process ? my situation has not changed from last year. i mean i am still unemployed.
Short answer: yes, you can.

Longer answer: There are several issues that need to be considered. First, you will have to reapply - a full new application. Second, as part of the application you will have to include an explanation as to why you withdrew (yes, your ETC from that time will have known, but there is no guarantee that your new application will go to the same ETC, or that that ETC would remember all of the circumstances), and show that you are now fully ready to return and that the issues that caused you to withdraw are no longer a problem.

Third, as you're within two years of your withdrawal date, the money available to you will be less than $28,000 - the Ministry looks at how much was spent on you the first time around and deducts that from the $28,000. So you'll need to look very carefully at whether you can afford to return. Since you're looking at returning to the same program in the same training institution, can you return at the point where you withdrew, rather than restarting? That could save some money.

First step: go and see your employment counsellor to get things started, and good luck.
Newbie
Nov 8, 2017
1 posts
I submitted my application for out of town schooling/ residency on October 23rd.. it has been almost 3 weeks now and still no call back from second career. How long does it typically take for them to contact back after submission?

Thank you for your help
Last edited by intotheblues on Nov 9th, 2017 3:31 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Sr. Member
Aug 2, 2012
592 posts
205 upvotes
It depends: on how busy they are, how much work needs to be done in reviewing your application, and on your start date as opposed to other applicants' - if they have several applications with start dates in the next couple of weeks and yours is a January start date, the others will be prioritised.

Have you asked your counsellor whether s/he has heard anything? If the Ministry is working on your application and there are questions, your counsellor will be contacted. Also, your counsellor would be able to see on the CaMS database whether your application is being worked on.
intotheblues wrote:
Nov 9th, 2017 3:31 pm
I submitted my application for out of town schooling/ residency on October 23rd.. it has been almost 3 weeks now and still no call back from second career. How long does it typically take for them to contact back after submission?

Thank you for your help
Newbie
Nov 11, 2017
0 posts
If u owe osap can u still get second career? Also how do I go about it? I'm on ow right now n have also bin on ei in last 5 years. Help!!! I don't Wana stuck on welfare cuz I can't get a job!!! Where do I go n who can help me???
Sr. Member
Aug 2, 2012
592 posts
205 upvotes
EmilyM728882 wrote:
Nov 12th, 2017 11:57 am
If u owe osap can u still get second career? Also how do I go about it? I'm on ow right now n have also bin on ei in last 5 years. Help!!! I don't Wana stuck on welfare cuz I can't get a job!!! Where do I go n who can help me???
Owing money to OSAP doesn't prevent someone from being approved for Second Career - but if you are restricted from receiving OSAP due to misrepresentation this restriction needs to be lifted before you can be approved.

Are you even eligible for Second Career? You would need to have been laid off, left a job on medical grounds, or taken maternity leave with EI benefits and now be ready to re-enter the labour market.

To find out whether you could be eligible, you will need to go to an Employment Ontario-funded agency and meet with an employment counsellor. This website will help you: http://feats.findhelp.ca/eng/search.html

(And a suggestion: if you're serious about getting training and looking for a job, leave the textspeak for friends and family. It doesn't create the best of impressions in any kind of professional interactions).
Newbie
Mar 3, 2016
3 posts
Hi everyone. Will try to keep this short and thanks in advance. I have gone thru a layoff then severance and finally EI. At that point I went on Ontario works. Over the last year I have worked with 2nd career and my counsellor scored my matrix more then high enough to apply. I am now looking at education starting in January but am concerned. When specifically doing the financial calculator it's very sketchy.

#1 if I calculate my 720 income and 680 living expenses then essentially i woukd not get a BLA cause I'm in the positive. However if I go on 2nd career then will I not get cut off from OW? So ultimately my income is 0 at that point.

#2 can anyone confirm that you can be on OW or ODSP while going on 2nd career.

#3 I've heard others say you will get denied because essentially you are too broke to be on 2nd career. It's a shared expense program and basically with no money you can't pay for anything they might ask outside of the 28k max they could provide.

Thanks again for any thoughts or advice.
Sr. Member
Aug 2, 2012
592 posts
205 upvotes
Your situation is one I deal with all the time when working with Second Career applicants. It's rough to be surviving on OW - for all that it's a lifeline, the level of support is just not enough. However, Second Career's Basic Living Allowance is also not enough. Let's start from there.

In my part of Ontario, Second Career applicants who are OW participants exit OW when they start training, so they would receive BLA. For some people, this means they're better off. For others, they are not - particularly if they receive child tax benefit, because this is treated as income and is deducted from BLA. I have heard people in Toronto say that they get to stay on OW while in Second Career. Ask your counsellor how this works - I'm surprised that s/he has not had this conversation with you. It's one of the first conversations I have with my clients.

(Re. ODSP: people normally want to keep their ODSP because of how difficult it is to get that status, and because of the medical and other benefits they receive. I have had Second Career clients who maintained their ODSP while in training. They generally do not qualify for BLA because their ODSP is higher than what they would be eligible for).

The Ministry is very concerned about financial feasibility, because it doesn't help anyone when someone drops out of training because they can't afford it. That is the main concern which leads to that 'too broke' comment. Cost-sharing, on the other hand, only applies when someone has a higher income (they may be required to contribute a % of the allowable training costs), or when total costs for their program are higher than the maximums available ($28,000 total, $10,000 for tuition at a private career college).

In your case, it will all be about affordability. Are your tuition and books all covered within the maximum? Will there be enough money left over to fund your basic living allowance and anything else you're entitled to - such as transportation? If you have expenses that Second Career doesn't help with - such as the costs of running a vehicle, paying insurance on your home/contents, etc - then they want a plan as to how you can manage. Some of my clients have other resources (family members, a line of credit etc) which they can draw on. Some can get a part-time job, and that's when we make a request for consideration of financial hardship, which at its basic is 'please don't deduct the $300 I'm making from this part-time job because I need it to pay for X, Y and Z'.

One other thing: some of my clients also consider OSAP to see whether any top-ups could be available, especially when tuition exceeds the maximum. Now that OSAP has a grant portion, this has helped some people.

So there are options, and it isn't as difficult as you may have thought for an OW participant to be approved - in fact, for a layoff to end up in a need to access OW, it could even be argued that you are more in need of training than many - after all, if you didn't need training, surely you could have found another job by now? (Simplistic, I know, but it could be seen as additional justification for approval).

I hope this helps. Do sit down with your counsellor, though, and discuss all these questions - this is what we're there for, and you shouldn't be left on your own to figure all of this out. Good luck! Hope you're approved and that training works out for you.
ISMISIBM wrote:
Nov 23rd, 2017 4:38 am
Hi everyone. Will try to keep this short and thanks in advance. I have gone thru a layoff then severance and finally EI. At that point I went on Ontario works. Over the last year I have worked with 2nd career and my counsellor scored my matrix more then high enough to apply. I am now looking at education starting in January but am concerned. When specifically doing the financial calculator it's very sketchy.

#1 if I calculate my 720 income and 680 living expenses then essentially i woukd not get a BLA cause I'm in the positive. However if I go on 2nd career then will I not get cut off from OW? So ultimately my income is 0 at that point.

#2 can anyone confirm that you can be on OW or ODSP while going on 2nd career.

#3 I've heard others say you will get denied because essentially you are too broke to be on 2nd career. It's a shared expense program and basically with no money you can't pay for anything they might ask outside of the 28k max they could provide.

Thanks again for any thoughts or advice.
Newbie
Mar 3, 2016
3 posts
Thanks emp.

I spoke to OW and for sure cut off immediately . When I spoke to the counsellor she basically said she has never seen anyone get approved with 0 income because essentially they are afraid you will not be able to afford year 2.

At this point in applying for ODSP so I will wait till September and then reapply.

You were bang on . Tx again
Sr. Member
Aug 2, 2012
592 posts
205 upvotes
She has never seen anyone be approved with zero income? How long has she been doing this? I have had many clients approved with zero income - if the attitude was really that someone in that situation couldn't be funded, there would be uproar, complaints to MPPs, accusations of discrimination against those in the greatest need and so on.

It's not whether someone has no income or savings; it's whether the funding provided by Second Career is sufficient. Are all the education costs covered, and can you live on the BLA?

Good luck with your ODSP application. When you are ready to start the Second Career process, you could consider accessing services at a different agency that does Second Career - you are not obliged to stay with your current counsellor if you feel that she is not going to support your application.

ISMISIBM wrote:
Nov 24th, 2017 1:18 am
Thanks emp.

I spoke to OW and for sure cut off immediately . When I spoke to the counsellor she basically said she has never seen anyone get approved with 0 income because essentially they are afraid you will not be able to afford year 2.

At this point in applying for ODSP so I will wait till September and then reapply.

You were bang on . Tx again
Newbie
Aug 13, 2017
7 posts
EmpCouns wrote:
Sep 29th, 2017 9:37 pm
You're very welcome! If I can help with anything else as you find out more information, just ask Smiling Face With Open Mouth
Hi Empcouns;

I would like to know what happen if someone, resident from other province, recently move in Ontario, still receiving his province social aid, and applying for SC?

I Have a friend of mine who were laid-off in Quebec and got social assistance(équivalent of Ontario works) from Quebec after his EI ran. Now he moves in Ontario and still receive the social aid for this December. When he moved here in Ontario, he applied for second career because he were eligible as a resident of Ontario regardeless the arriving the period. Now his application is in the process...
Do you already face with a situation like that?Someone, recently move in Ontario from an other province and apply for second career? Do you think his application will be rejected at the end since he receives advantages/government help from his province of origine?
Sr. Member
Aug 2, 2012
592 posts
205 upvotes
Receiving any kind of social assistance has no bearing on being approved for Second Career. What matters (besides eligibility/suitability and fitness of desired program) is being resident in Ontario. So if your friend is now permanently resident in Ontario (as opposed to just visiting) it should be fine.

jb2017 wrote:
Dec 19th, 2017 5:37 am
Hi Empcouns;

I would like to know what happen if someone, resident from other province, recently move in Ontario, still receiving his province social aid, and applying for SC?

I Have a friend of mine who were laid-off in Quebec and got social assistance(équivalent of Ontario works) from Quebec after his EI ran. Now he moves in Ontario and still receive the social aid for this December. When he moved here in Ontario, he applied for second career because he were eligible as a resident of Ontario regardeless the arriving the period. Now his application is in the process...
Do you already face with a situation like that?Someone, recently move in Ontario from an other province and apply for second career? Do you think his application will be rejected at the end since he receives advantages/government help from his province of origine?
Newbie
Dec 27, 2017
3 posts
I started my application process in June 2017 for Second Careers, from June to present I have filled the forms out 6 times. That's right 6 times. Second Careers contacts me today and advised that I qualify for funding, however my basic living allowance is $61 per week. I can't wrap my head around this one. My gas will be $100 per week as I have to travel to the city, we don't have public transportation that would take me there. Won't even cover my bills. If you decide this route, look at other funding. Because no one can survive off of $61 a week.
Newbie
Dec 27, 2017
3 posts
I qualified for funding, however with the amount that you get for living expenses you might as well go on Welfare and have them put you thru school
Newbie
Aug 3, 2016
5 posts
Thank you very much for all the information in this forum. From starting until I entered school and a week before graduated, I was employed by the city I live in. It's not a permanent job but at least it got me something. Empcouns, if only I can take you for a coffee or something I will definitely do that!

I do still need info in regards of tax filing. What would come next and how should I do it. Which column I have to fill in. Is my second career considered as income? Will I get tax refund from it? Help please? I tried calling CRA and their line is super crazy by this time of year!!! TIA.
Sr. Member
Aug 2, 2012
592 posts
205 upvotes
LauraL975526 wrote:
Dec 28th, 2017 4:28 pm
I started my application process in June 2017 for Second Careers, from June to present I have filled the forms out 6 times. That's right 6 times. Second Careers contacts me today and advised that I qualify for funding, however my basic living allowance is $61 per week. I can't wrap my head around this one. My gas will be $100 per week as I have to travel to the city, we don't have public transportation that would take me there. Won't even cover my bills. If you decide this route, look at other funding. Because no one can survive off of $61 a week.
Basic living allowance under Second Career is absolutely inadequate, and we've all (counsellors as well as ETCs) been saying this for years. However, your counsellor should have gone through this with you before your application was submitted. I have no idea why you would have had to complete the forms multiple times, unless you changed your mind about your program or start date.

Anyway: you should talk to your counsellor about whether it's possible in your situation to make an application for financial hardship. I'm guessing that you do have some other household income (spouse/partner earnings, child tax benefit etc) because otherwise $61/week makes no sense at all - unless your tuition and other costs are so high that you have hit the $28,000 maximum and you've had to take a "voluntary" cut in BLA. See your counsellor. At the very least, you should be able to ask for help with transportation costs (they'll pay 15c per km for every km above 50 per day, though I have had that minimum amount waived in hardship applications). Be aware that if you do ask for financial hardship to be considered, you'll have to write a letter explaining why you can't cover these costs yourself, which will include explaining what other resources you've explored (eg loan, line of credit, OSAP, family support etc). But it's definitely possible to succeed.

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