Careers

Standard Practice to Neg. $$/Benefits in Offer?

  • Last Updated:
  • Jun 30th, 2006 12:19 pm
Tags:
None
Newbie
Feb 20, 2005
48 posts
2 upvotes

Standard Practice to Neg. $$/Benefits in Offer?

When employers make an offer do they try to nickel and dime you in one way or another? Put another way, when you receive an offer are you expected to negotiate on items such as salary, vacation days or other benefits.

E.G. If in an employement application I said I would be happy with a salary in 62-75K range, would they intentionally offer me 62K to see my reaction?

TIA
16 replies
Deal Addict
User avatar
Sep 30, 2003
3906 posts
130 upvotes
Toronto
it depends on a lot of factors.
1)size of company
2)your worth/experience/value
3)the position
4)additional benefits etc etc etc.

for *most* companies, the salary range is usually pre-determined before they even interview people. It's usually decided when the job description is done up. Having said that, if it's an upper-echelon position or niche field, then there's more wiggle room.

first steps from an employee's standpoint is - you should know the pay scale for the position, and the pay scale for the company. That's basic research.
Once you know that, there's no harm is asking for the upper range of what the scale is, if you feel you are worth it. Quite frankly, I don't understand why anyone would go anything less than upper end.

Next, don't give a large range. in your example, you've given 68K +/- ~10%. Or in other words, a 20% spread
I'd narrow that down to +/- 5% or lower.
To be honest, I'd just give them a single number i.e. 75K and let them come back with a higher/lower figure.

And to answer your question,
if a person comes and asks for a range, and gives a value lower than what was decided for the position, I'll give the pre-determined value.
if a person comes and asks for higher than what was decided, if worth it, they usually get it.
--
There is no happy ending
Deal Addict
Sep 1, 2005
2469 posts
4 upvotes
Theres no harm in asking, salery is ussaly easier then benifits as companys enrol in benifit packages, if your not happy with the benifits make sure the bump in pay mro ethen covers the loss there.

vacation has to be one of the most over looked form of pay, each week fo vacation is equal to ~2% of your pay, it never hurts to ask for a extra week or two.
Deal Addict
Feb 22, 2005
2431 posts
8 upvotes
Everything is negotiable beyond the entry level position.

There is usually a range that employers have to play with and undoubtedly they want to hire you for the least they can get away with so they can waste the excess savings elsewhere.

You MUST heckle on at least 3 things at the bare minimum:

1) start date
2) vacation time
3) salary

Otherwise, those year to year raisees in some cases are only 2% to 3% per annum.

Do some research online of the industry and be prepared to negotiate what you are worth as best as possible.

Rookies to the game often fear of doing this because they are afraid that their employer wll pass judgement on them and think they are simple being unreasonable or greedy. This is not the case. If they are prepared to make you an offer, this means that they have already decided they want you to join the organization...so the rest are just details for negotiation.
Deal Expert
Oct 6, 2005
16872 posts
2557 upvotes
Eagle_One wrote:When employers make an offer do they try to nickel and dime you in one way or another? Put another way, when you receive an offer are you expected to negotiate on items such as salary, vacation days or other benefits.
No they're not trying to nickel and dime you... afterall what good is an unhappy employee?

Eagle_One wrote: E.G. If in an employement application I said I would be happy with a salary in 62-75K range, would they intentionally offer me 62K to see my reaction?
Is 62K not in your range? If you want more - then negotiate for a higher salary. If you don't get the job because the salary is a sticking point, then it's upto you to decide whether you'll be happy with what they're paying you. If not, go job hunting - no sense in being stuck in a job you feel you're being underpaid.

Also make sure whatever you negotiate is in WRITING, preferably written on the contract itself :)
Deal Addict
User avatar
Sep 30, 2003
3906 posts
130 upvotes
Toronto
dark169 wrote:vacation has to be one of the most over looked form of pay, each week fo vacation is equal to ~2% of your pay, it never hurts to ask for a extra week or two.
while very true, what I hate is the fact that having vacation time doesn't always equate to being able to take it :(
--
There is no happy ending
Deal Addict
Sep 1, 2005
2469 posts
4 upvotes
Sylvestre wrote:while very true, what I hate is the fact that having vacation time doesn't always equate to being able to take it :(
The key here is to make the point known that time with your family and the relaxation from vacation is VERY important to you. I've always been lucky to have a boss who understands this as well, deadlines be dammed if the vacation is booked its booked and very little will change that.
Deal Expert
Oct 6, 2005
16872 posts
2557 upvotes
dark169 wrote:The key here is to make the point known that time with your family and the relaxation from vacation is VERY important to you. I've always been lucky to have a boss who understands this as well, deadlines be dammed if the vacation is booked its booked and very little will change that.
I would say this depends on your level. For junior employees, I would not stress vacations too much - it makes you look lazy. Basically it says "I rather take vacations and sacrifice my career" :)

Of course it's OK to prod a bit... but i wouldn't make vacation a sticking point if it's your first (or even second) job.
Deal Addict
Feb 24, 2004
1549 posts
269 upvotes
Eagle_One wrote:E.G. If in an employement application I said I would be happy with a salary in 62-75K range, would they intentionally offer me 62K to see my reaction?
Yes, it does happen... Your % bonus is based on your salary and managers usually get a bucket to play with. If he can keep your salary as low as possible, your % bonus would look higher and you'd be happier. eg. 10k bonus on 75k is 13% while the same bonus on 65k is 16%!

If you have the upper hand (employed and somewhat like your job), just tell them you're disappointed at the offer and respectfully say no. They'll ask you how much you want in order to say yes. Be prepared to give that number and if they say yes then be prepared to accept the offer. Nothing like asking for something and then to say no.

The other thing you have to bear in mind is that your job is probably set at a certain band level. If the range for the band level is $50-$75k and they offer you $70k it means your maximum raise next year is $5k.
Deal Addict
User avatar
Aug 9, 2003
2358 posts
100 upvotes
Toronto
Audiogenic wrote:You MUST heckle on at least 3 things at the bare minimum:
Now why would you want to taunt your perspective employer with severity or antagonism? Kind of a lousy way to start off a relationship. :D

But seriously, you're right. This is the time to negotiate the extras such as more vacation time. Don't assume you won't use the vacation time. Even if you don't, it still needs to be paid out so think of it as extra money if you don't take it.

You would be amazed at how often a company WILL try to nickel and dime you if you let them. If they can get you in 4%-6% under what you wanted, it's basically like getting the next two salary increases for free.

--Pete
Remember: We elect the government we deserve.
Deal Addict
Mar 24, 2005
1361 posts
117 upvotes
dark169 wrote: vacation has to be one of the most over looked form of pay, each week fo vacation is equal to ~2% of your pay, it never hurts to ask for a extra week or two.
I have to disagree. Vacation is really overlooked by young graduates who really just look at the pay and don't care so much about the vacation. They're mainly eagered to just take what they can get. On the other hand, seasoned workers in the work force care a great deal about vacation time and is never overlooked when applying for new positions.

Vacation is pre-determined by HR and is non-negotiable. There may be some room to negotiate in small-medium sized companies but that is rare these days too. Only time a negotiable vacation time is heard of is if you are applying for an executive or officer level. Maybe senior management (in smaller companies).
Deal Addict
Mar 24, 2005
1361 posts
117 upvotes
Audiogenic wrote:Everything is negotiable beyond the entry level position.

There is usually a range that employers have to play with and undoubtedly they want to hire you for the least they can get away with so they can waste the excess savings elsewhere.

You MUST heckle on at least 3 things at the bare minimum:

1) start date
2) vacation time
3) salary

Otherwise, those year to year raisees in some cases are only 2% to 3% per annum.

Do some research online of the industry and be prepared to negotiate what you are worth as best as possible.

Rookies to the game often fear of doing this because they are afraid that their employer wll pass judgement on them and think they are simple being unreasonable or greedy. This is not the case. If they are prepared to make you an offer, this means that they have already decided they want you to join the organization...so the rest are just details for negotiation.
Everything is negotiable beyond entry level position? This is only true for very small companies. Otherwise, vacation is already predetermined and so is the pay range. Typically a larger sized company will offer you what they already feel you are worth, whether it be on the lower scale or higher scale - depending on your level of skill.

Vacation is never negotiable for most positions.

Salary is almost impossible to negotiate if you're a fresh graduate or have very little work experience. It is also difficult to negotiate if you're currently unemployed. If a company is prepared to make you an offer, yes it means they want you but only at a tabled salary offer. You really don't have a lot of room to push if any at all. Could also be that you may be asking more than what the company is prepared to offer but when you're new to the "game" as you call it, you really don't have the right to ask for more.

From my experiences and that of many others, managers don't like to be unreasonable and try to get you for the lowest price possible. They need to make an offer that is attractive and competitive. Otherwise who is to stop you from walking to the next company or competitor who is willing to offer more?
Deal Addict
Mar 24, 2005
1361 posts
117 upvotes
Sylvestre wrote:while very true, what I hate is the fact that having vacation time doesn't always equate to being able to take it :(
Which is why you should be working for a company that endorses their employees to take vacation. Where I work, my company forces you to take vacation or you lose it - which is a good policy because it encourages employees to take vacation in order to be more relaxed and productive.

Of course, this is only as good as how it is managed by the company. Where I work, tasks and projects are scheduled AROUND planned vacations which is a really good thing.
Deal Addict
User avatar
Aug 9, 2003
2358 posts
100 upvotes
Toronto
Coke355mL wrote:Where I work, my company forces you to take vacation or you lose it
While this is a good policy, one also needs to understand that you never _lose_ your vacation.

Under the Ontario Labour code, if you don't take your vacation days, your employer must still pay you for your vacation pay.

http://www.cbsc.org/servlet/ContentServ ... lay&c=Regs

So, effectively, negotiating more vacation time is putting more money in your pocket, even if you don't take the time off.

--Pete
Remember: We elect the government we deserve.
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Jul 7, 2003
7399 posts
2413 upvotes
T dot 6
The last company I worked for made me an offer, my headhunter rejected on my behalf (he thought it was a low ball offer and didnt even tell me about it, I would have rejected it anyway, but the fact he didnt tell me was wrong). They came back with another offer for $15000 more and another week vacation.

My current job I tried to negotiate more money and they flat out said no.

It doesnt hurt to try to negoticate for more. Its doubtful they would take the offer off the table because they made you the offer in the first place. The worst that can happen is they say no.
stubhub and clearly.ca suck, like really suck
Deal Addict
Mar 20, 2004
1120 posts
3 upvotes
Toronto
Most large companies have their vacation days set in stone. You apply for a particular band/grade and the vacation days are predetermined based off that band/grade.
Deal Addict
Mar 24, 2005
1361 posts
117 upvotes
Pete Jones wrote:While this is a good policy, one also needs to understand that you never _lose_ your vacation.
Yes, I should have mentioned that. To clarify, the company I work for does not allow employees to "carry over" vacation days. You take them or lose them (and get reimbursed). But the management at my work here really encourages everyone to take vacation when we want.

Top

Thread Information

There is currently 1 user viewing this thread. (0 members and 1 guest)