Investing

TD e-Series funds Megathread (Post all your questions here)

  • Last Updated:
  • Oct 15th, 2018 11:15 pm
Member
Nov 1, 2013
222 posts
25 upvotes
DefconZero wrote:
Jan 16th, 2018 10:15 am
There is an inherent lag between index funds and the market.
DefconZero Thnks for replying. Lag is usually in same direction though, this one is 180 opposite.
Deal Addict
Feb 9, 2013
1435 posts
363 upvotes
Mississauga
Louking wrote:
Jan 16th, 2018 10:08 am
If US Markets are up big time this morning (Dow 250+, S&P 16+) why are US market based E series funds such as TDB902, TDB903, TDB908 and ETFs like VUN (VANGUARD U.S. TOTAL MARKET IDX ETF ), XUU, VSP down? can anyone please explain?
Mutual funds take NAV after market closes
Member
Nov 1, 2013
222 posts
25 upvotes
jdu0ng wrote:
Jan 16th, 2018 10:41 am
Mutual funds take NAV after market closes
Correct. But why would ETF drop when market is rocketing up in morning? very odd.
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User avatar
Dec 24, 2005
2112 posts
2649 upvotes
Toronto
I have eSeries funds in a non-registered MF account. If I sell them do I have to manually calculate and report any capital gains or should I expect a slip from TD? I'm doing all transactions through Easyweb, not Waterhouse.
Nothing to see here folks...
Sr. Member
User avatar
Feb 1, 2012
839 posts
822 upvotes
Thunder Bay, ON
loonieryan wrote:
Jan 18th, 2018 2:02 pm
I have eSeries funds in a non-registered MF account. If I sell them do I have to manually calculate and report any capital gains or should I expect a slip from TD? I'm doing all transactions through Easyweb, not Waterhouse.
You need to calculate capital gains (or losses) yourself. The T-slip you get only includes dividends/distributions/interest earned within the fund. It does not include any capital gains / losses realized when you sell.

Here is CRA's explanation:
https://www.canada.ca/en/revenue-agency ... duals.html
Invest your time actively and your money passively.
Jr. Member
Jan 20, 2017
176 posts
21 upvotes
Why US market tracking etf were down in summer of 2017?
According to an answer on ccp it is linked to cad even though it tracks US index.
A kind of dangerous and additional variable. Without the boost from Sept 8 to year end all e series funds would have resulted in negative or flat returns.
Jr. Member
Jan 20, 2017
176 posts
21 upvotes
dainfamous41 wrote:
Jan 18th, 2018 9:31 pm
How are the e-series funds doing so far this year?
900 is down, others are mostly up
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Dec 24, 2005
2112 posts
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Deepwater wrote:
Jan 18th, 2018 3:00 pm
You need to calculate capital gains (or losses) yourself. The T-slip you get only includes dividends/distributions/interest earned within the fund. It does not include any capital gains / losses realized when you sell.

Here is CRA's explanation:
https://www.canada.ca/en/revenue-agency ... duals.html
Thanks, TD actually sent me T5008 slips, but I'm not entering my capital gains in that area in TurboTax, just going to use the capital gains/losses section. I read that from a NETFILE perspective it all ends up in the same place anyway.
Nothing to see here folks...
Member
Oct 17, 2015
229 posts
35 upvotes
Toronto, ON
jaguaar wrote:
Jan 19th, 2018 7:08 am
Why US market tracking etf were down in summer of 2017?
According to an answer on ccp it is linked to cad even though it tracks US index.
A kind of dangerous and additional variable. Without the boost from Sept 8 to year end all e series funds would have resulted in negative or flat returns.
Not only the US market trackers it seems. Tangerine investment funds all ended up in negative territory in dec 2017 which was otherwise a pretty good month for markets
https://www.tangerine.ca/en/products/in ... rformance/
Sr. Member
User avatar
Feb 1, 2012
839 posts
822 upvotes
Thunder Bay, ON
AdsJoint wrote:
Jan 20th, 2018 11:37 am
Not only the US market trackers it seems. Tangerine investment funds all ended up in negative territory in dec 2017 which was otherwise a pretty good month for markets
https://www.tangerine.ca/en/products/in ... rformance/
These are index funds. They track the underlying index returns, less management fees, expenses and trading costs, in C$. The first fund on the page to which you linked is Tangerine Balanced Income which holds 70% bonds (FTSE TMX Canada Universe Bond Index), 10% Canadian stocks (TSX60), 10% US Stocks (S&P500), and 10% global developed market stocks (MSCI EAFE).

Following is the performance of those indices for Dec 2017 in C$ (source: benchmark performance from iShares.ca):
TMX Canada Universe Bond Index -0.41%
TSX60 +1.13%
S&P500 -1.7%
MSCI EAFE: -1.03%
(Note that 3 of the 4 components of the fund lost money when measured in C$ for Dec 2017, despite the baseless perception that it was "a pretty good month for markets")

So the performance of the underlying indices at the weighting held by the fund is as follows:
.9959*0.7 + 1.0113*0.1 + 0.983*0.1 + 0.9897*0.1 = .99553, or a loss of (1-.99553)*100 = .447, for a loss of .447% before fees and expenses.

MER = 1.07% per year, or .089% per month

Total expected performance including fees = -0.447% -0.089% = 0-.536%, rounds to -0.54%
Actual performance as published by Tangerine: -0.55%
So actual performance is within 0.01% of expected performance considering indices, asset allocation, and MER.
(Unless you expect that index mutual funds will always go up, even when the underlying indices drop.)
Invest your time actively and your money passively.
Member
Oct 17, 2015
229 posts
35 upvotes
Toronto, ON
Deepwater wrote:
Jan 20th, 2018 9:01 pm
These are index funds. They track the underlying index returns, less management fees, expenses and trading costs, in C$. The first fund on the page to which you linked is Tangerine Balanced Income which holds 70% bonds (FTSE TMX Canada Universe Bond Index), 10% Canadian stocks (TSX60), 10% US Stocks (S&P500), and 10% global developed market stocks (MSCI EAFE).

Following is the performance of those indices for Dec 2017 in C$ (source: benchmark performance from iShares.ca):
TMX Canada Universe Bond Index -0.41%
TSX60 +1.13%
S&P500 -1.7%
MSCI EAFE: -1.03%
(Note that 3 of the 4 components of the fund lost money when measured in C$ for Dec 2017, despite the baseless perception that it was "a pretty good month for markets")

So the performance of the underlying indices at the weighting held by the fund is as follows:
.9959*0.7 + 1.0113*0.1 + 0.983*0.1 + 0.9897*0.1 = .99553, or a loss of (1-.99553)*100 = .447, for a loss of .447% before fees and expenses.

MER = 1.07% per year, or .089% per month

Total expected performance including fees = -0.447% -0.089% = 0-.536%, rounds to -0.54%
Actual performance as published by Tangerine: -0.55%
So actual performance is within 0.01% of expected performance considering indices, asset allocation, and MER.
(Unless you expect that index mutual funds will always go up, even when the underlying indices drop.)
deepwater
you are awesomeness personified! What a perfect and deep analysis.
I was wrong indeed, the S&P did not have a stellar last month, it went up by just 30+ points which when co-related to rising CAD made it negative in reality.
Sometimes one need electric shock therapy to wake up and analyze. I am speechless. Cheers.
Sr. Member
User avatar
Feb 1, 2012
839 posts
822 upvotes
Thunder Bay, ON
AdsJoint wrote:
Jan 20th, 2018 9:54 pm
deepwater
you are awesomeness personified! What a perfect and deep analysis.
I was wrong indeed, the S&P did not have a stellar last month, it went up by just 30+ points which when co-related to rising CAD made it negative in reality.
Sometimes one need electric shock therapy to wake up and analyze. I am speechless. Cheers.
Yes, I think it is the exchange rate that is confusing people.
Tangerine funds hold equities from over 20 countries, so the only way to consistently measure performance in a comparable way is to convert all returns to a single currency. And for Canadian based funds, the currency is C$. Which makes sense considering most of us will be spending our money in Canada. Even if an investor directly holds foreign stocks, or foreign ETFs like VTI, they have the same currency exposure when measured in C$.

Strange though. Most people will easily understand that when the C$ rises against the US$, it is cheaper to buy things in the US, or to vacation there. I.e. when our $ goes up, US goods cost less. But somehow it is harder to understand that when the C$ goes up, US investments also are worth less when valued in our currency.
Invest your time actively and your money passively.
Member
Apr 11, 2012
316 posts
59 upvotes
Mississauga
Hi Folks,
I am completely new with ETFs and need advice from experts! I am ready to purchase few ETF and after going through TD website and performances of the funds I noticed Fund Code-TDB903 & Fund Code-TDB908 have been performing well for the past couple of years. So, is it ok to invest them on those 2 funds? Do you set up authorized monthly payment or buy lump sum?
I am just testing water buy starting small investment. I have few bank's mutual funds but the ROI is not more than 4-5% so interested to get more and end up here.
Thanks in advance for the advice!
Cheers!

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