ticket for not surrendering insurrance card

[Redro]

Ok i think we're done arguing this. you know what you know and i know what i know.

i'm happy with what i know and enjoy my "hack" to avoid increases in premiums by pleading guilty to non moving violations which includes failure to surrender insurance cards while getting my speeding ticket thrown out in court as part of my plea bargain.

logically, if my minor conviction does not increase my risk of an accident or injury payout or theft, it should have no affect on my premiums. whether the offence is in the insurance act or highway traffic act makes no difference, it's against the law either way and the fine for the ticket is appropriate punishment.

if those companies you quoted decide to screw their customers over by charging them a surcharge for such minor convictions, it's something good for everyone to know to avoid them as insurers from the point of view of keeping premiums low. obviously, for some people, other factors will make them worthy of doing business with.

and I"m sure you're happy knowing what you know with the satisfaction that you're making a living off of it. but just for the record, theories and company policies mean nothing at the end of the day, it's actual experiences that speak louder than words.

state your rebuttal to this final post... i will note our disagreement on this issue and your credibility so we won't argue about this again.

I check the HTA but I seem to find anything about a case like that. Can anyone else confirm this is true? because if I ever get stopped by a cop again I'll pretend I can't find my insurance slip and then plead guilty to driving with an insurance slip rather then something like speeding.

[Anonymouse]

This discussion has turned rather intemperate, with folks accusing other folks of ad hominem attacks, and following it up with their own AH garbage. I think I'll contribute to other threads that have a more positive outlook. You stay classy, guys/girls.

[actng]

I check the HTA but I seem to find anything about a case like that. Can anyone else confirm this is true? because if I ever get stopped by a cop again I'll pretend I can't find my insurance slip and then plead guilty to driving with an insurance slip rather then something like speeding.

why would you look in the HTA to find a case like that?
why would HTA have cases for you to look up?
why would the HTA teach you how to defeat the system?

this is a strategy i devised on my own through my traffic court experiences and research with various insurance companies.

as you can see it's highly controversial, as some people refuse to believe it works. i can't guarantee that you won't get screwed for both speeding and failure to surrender and be hit by those insurance companies named by kenchau (aside from Aviva). so i can't recommend it to you or the general public.

but it works very well for myself and some people i know.

[Nikita]

I check the HTA but I seem to find anything about a case like that. Can anyone else confirm this is true? because if I ever get stopped by a cop again I'll pretend I can't find my insurance slip and then plead guilty to driving with an insurance slip rather then something like speeding.

Are you looking for confirmation that non-moving violation convictions won't affect your insurance? Because if that's what you're asking, you surely won't find anything at all about insurance or insurance consequences in the HTA. The HTA is law, seems like you're looking for info regarding insurance companies, which is business, private business. You'll only get that info from different insurance companies.

[brian.gerson]

LOL..I think you need to look up the meaning of strawman argument. If you still think it doesn't apply, you have a reading comprehension problem.

Is that one of those "ad hominem" attacks you keep complaining about? Do you feel better now?

I don't much care what Anon pointed out,there IS no criminality involved, there's an infraction of a provincial offense. One is not 'criminalized' by provincial offenses. There is no 'criminal record' for this or any other HTA offense. Now you can consider yourself informed...you learned something new today. Your welcome.

From the Oxford English Dictionary (have you heard of it?): crime noun 1 an offence against an individual or the state which is punishable by law

Especially, to repeat myself, when it's absolutely no hardship for drivers to carry it along with all the other documents they carry.

It's a hardship for me. I get these ridiculous dead trees in the mail every year and have to remember to put them in 4 cars, to satisfy busybodies who like to make "rules." I keep the policy number on my cell phone; that's good enough for me.

I'm more concerned with following the law than I am with making a big deal i.e. whining about having to carry a piece of paper.

I feel sorry for people who follow the law because it is the law, never questioning authority. These are the kind of people who populated Nazi Germany.

It only highlights your tunnel vision and lack of knowledge.

Is that another one of those ad hominem attacks? Do you feel better now?

And DrXenon, your arguments are ad hominem, the weakest kind of argument...which tells me you're realllly reaching just to try to prove me wrong.

I see no real ad hominem attacks in his posts, certainly nothing approaching the truculence of your own.

Yes, thank you I know that. Show me the numbers that say this is such a huge problem (driver's showing false insurance info) that it warrants our tax dollars and police resources being used this way, and warrants us law-abiding tax-paying citizens being treated as though we're not.

The cops who pull me over for 20 minutes while they file their nails in their cruisers to prove their omnipotence could just as easily be doing something useful. You know how long it takes to authorize your credit card when you buy something at a store? That's how long it would take.

The mandatory nature of automobile insurance makes it a kind of tax; it just creates profits for certain wealthy individuals instead of revenue we can all use. By eliminating the need to mail out dead trees, there would be economic and environmental benefits.

I dunno, take that up with your insurance company. But don't carry on like this is a widespread problem unless you have the numbers to back it up. And to be clear, I mean the numbers of people who show false insurance documents.

The problem is big and growing. 20 year olds in Ontario are being asked to pay $3000+ for auto insurance and many are opting not to.

Throwing the word terrorists into an argument about carrying proper documentation...we have a word for that too, but the board censors it.

There is a very clear smiley after that statement. As you learn to use the Internet more, you will discover that these strange symbols have meaning.