Real Estate

Vancouver housing bubble?

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fisher44 wrote:
Feb 11th, 2016 4:02 pm
is anyone actually leaving vancouver, though? are couples in their 20s/30s leaving to raise families in places where they can have a house and a yard? are students bouncing after they graduate?
Its starting to. The demographics has changed significantly in the past 15yrs or so. Especially in Vancouver proper where many schools are now at less than 60% capacity.

Even worse we can no longer attract young professionals to move here to work. On my project we have had a job advertised Canada wide and in the US. Still no takers after a year vacant. The salary is same or slightly lower as other cities while the cost of housing is double or triple other places.
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http://globalnews.ca/news/2462585/vsb-r ... -closures/

As soon as people/couples hit the 30 year mark or the "family" stage, they flee Vancouver.

Students come and go with the school year, rarely ever stay local.

Job market is "ok" on its best days, and salaries are standard or lower than East Coast depending on position. Ever try to pay someone $50-60k when their rent and food costs 3 grand a month? Thats without partying, going out,etc.

Im in the same boat. Here for experience, maybe make 10-20k more than what i can make back home. Once im done with my targets within a year or so, I'm out. I'm also in the age of the aforementioned demographic fleeing Vancouver.
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Magoomba wrote:
Feb 12th, 2016 12:36 am
Its starting to. The demographics has changed significantly in the past 15yrs or so. Especially in Vancouver proper where many schools are now at less than 60% capacity.

Even worse we can no longer attract young professionals to move here to work. On my project we have had a job advertised Canada wide and in the US. Still no takers after a year vacant. The salary is same or slightly lower as other cities while the cost of housing is double or triple other places.
Low real income. Young people don't like spending 4-5+ years in school to come out to make 30-40k/year where housing is the most expensive in the country. Even at one's later stages at around 50-60 nearing time to have a family can hardly afford the living costs here when you spend close to 3K a month on just basic necessities- then bump that closer to 4K with very little entertainment and a vehicle.

Certainly why I left, as really would have no future with that arrangement.
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FirstGear wrote:
Feb 12th, 2016 9:26 pm
Low real income. Young people don't like spending 4-5+ years in school to come out to make 30-40k/year where housing is the most expensive in the country. Even at one's later stages at around 50-60 nearing time to have a family can hardly afford the living costs here when you spend close to 3K a month on just basic necessities- then bump that closer to 4K with very little entertainment and a vehicle.

Certainly why I left, as really would have no future with that arrangement.
Looking at my monthly cost, its roughly $3k for day to day life. 1.6-2k for a junior/normal 1 bedroom rental + food (+lunch at work) + public transit. 3k easy. No car, thats why its not higher.
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If you are living in vancouver and spend 1600 on rent, a bus pass is about 100, so to get to 3k, you are saying you spend 1300 on food?
You could easily save money by spending less on eating out every lunch. I know some of my friends eat out every lunch. Thats probably on average $50 a week, so about $200 a month.
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Stabilo7 wrote:
Feb 19th, 2016 7:10 pm
If you are living in vancouver and spend 1600 on rent, a bus pass is about 100, so to get to 3k, you are saying you spend 1300 on food?
You could easily save money by spending less on eating out every lunch. I know some of my friends eat out every lunch. Thats probably on average $50 a week, so about $200 a month.
$1600 is base. Add home insurance and bills, cell phone as well to make it easier, its $2000.
Groceries are roughly $200-400, eating at work is about $400-600 depending on my working hours(lunch+dinner). Usually $1000 for food (groceries+ out) and alcohol (for home) is my max per month, and that scales up or down with work needs. A low end/normal month would be around $4-500.

Not sure where your friends eat but fast food in downtown Vancouver is over $10, maybe Tim Hortons lunches are cheaper. A sit down lunch place of low to mediocre quality runs you $12-15 + tax on average. Anything better is $15+tax or higher. (burgers for example).

I've looked around for other places for this summer and a standard range seems to be the case. Old buildings from the 60s-70s with shared laundry cost around $1450 for a 1 bed. Studio condos (400 sq ft range) run $1600 on average. 1 bedroom condos(500sq ft range) $1800. Anything bigger is $1800-2000+ generally.

Looked into living outside of downtown, going near half an hour out, prices are about $200 cheaper. Which is great, but i dont have a car, which means I'll be using cabs to get back home if working late, or out drinking with friends. That costs me more than the rental savings.

You can definitely live on the cheap, i used to share apartments, and i still avoid owning a car ($1000 goes out the window real quick with a car), but its more expensive than any other market in Canada.

Mind you, i live here because the work affords me to. If i wasnt making more than what I can get in another market, I wouldnt be here. That said, no way you can raise kids in Vancouver (city) without breaking bank. Everyone i know with kids is 1-1.5 hours away from the city, in different burbs.
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Stabilo7 wrote:
Feb 19th, 2016 7:10 pm
If you are living in vancouver and spend 1600 on rent, a bus pass is about 100, so to get to 3k, you are saying you spend 1300 on food?
You could easily save money by spending less on eating out every lunch. I know some of my friends eat out every lunch. Thats probably on average $50 a week, so about $200 a month.
There are bills other than food, but remember that $35k / year is $2900 GROSS income.

Taxes will reduce that to $2300.
-$1600 rent.
-$217 lunches ( using your $50 / week ) for lunches.
-$300 dinners ( estimating $70 / week ) includes eating out once a week
-$40 Starbucks

Yeah, there's room for savings, but even making your own lunches will only reduce costs by about half ( unless you're eating cup ramen daily ).

A phone costs $50 – $100 / month
Netflix/internet is another $50 at least.

That money goes FAST... Without a roommate, it's hard for any young person coming out of Uni to even THINK about saving money in a TFSA, for a Mortgage, etc.

The single BEST way to save money is by splitting expenses with a roommate... or a working spouse. Super tough to go it alone in Vancouver.
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Vancouver = super tough

Super crazy

Thanks, Christy Clark, glad your government budget was saved from real estate - and a whole generation of Canadians punished right there :(
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Buggy166 wrote:
Feb 19th, 2016 8:30 pm
$1600 is base. Add home insurance and bills, cell phone as well to make it easier, its $2000.
Groceries are roughly $200-400, eating at work is about $400-600 depending on my working hours(lunch+dinner). Usually $1000 for food (groceries+ out) and alcohol (for home) is my max per month, and that scales up or down with work needs. A low end/normal month would be around $4-500.

Not sure where your friends eat but fast food in downtown Vancouver is over $10, maybe Tim Hortons lunches are cheaper. A sit down lunch place of low to mediocre quality runs you $12-15 + tax on average. Anything better is $15+tax or higher. (burgers for example).

I've looked around for other places for this summer and a standard range seems to be the case. Old buildings from the 60s-70s with shared laundry cost around $1450 for a 1 bed. Studio condos (400 sq ft range) run $1600 on average. 1 bedroom condos(500sq ft range) $1800. Anything bigger is $1800-2000+ generally.

Looked into living outside of downtown, going near half an hour out, prices are about $200 cheaper. Which is great, but i dont have a car, which means I'll be using cabs to get back home if working late, or out drinking with friends. That costs me more than the rental savings.

You can definitely live on the cheap, i used to share apartments, and i still avoid owning a car ($1000 goes out the window real quick with a car), but its more expensive than any other market in Canada.

Mind you, i live here because the work affords me to. If i wasnt making more than what I can get in another market, I wouldnt be here. That said, no way you can raise kids in Vancouver (city) without breaking bank. Everyone i know with kids is 1-1.5 hours away from the city, in different burbs.
Groceries are more expensive downtown too, considering there is no Superstore or Pricesmart etc. All there is is Whole Foods or Urban Fair. So yea, grocery costs I can see being more expensive.
People in Vancouver have an issue with giving up a "downtown" lifestyle. There are lots of options along the skytrain that cost a good amount less than downtown. I'm not saying its cheap, but it is cheaper. By Brentwood you can get a 650sqft condo for about $1300 a month. You are still downtown vancouver in 20 min by skytrain and in a building that is under 10 years old.
On any salary, every little bit adds up.
I would say we spend about $500 a month on food for 2 of us. And thats isn't skimping out and getting junk. It does mean not going out to eat as much, but thats all part of the plan. Buy meat when its on sale, making bigger batches of food and freezing it/having it for lunch the next day, making coffee at home instead of having starbucks. If you want to save, then something has to give. But one big problem is that people dont want to sacrifice anything.
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Stabilo7 wrote:
Feb 19th, 2016 8:52 pm
Groceries are more expensive downtown too, considering there is no Superstore or Pricesmart etc. All there is is Whole Foods or Urban Fair. So yea, grocery costs I can see being more expensive.
People in Vancouver have an issue with giving up a "downtown" lifestyle. There are lots of options along the skytrain that cost a good amount less than downtown. I'm not saying its cheap, but it is cheaper. By Brentwood you can get a 650sqft condo for about $1300 a month. You are still downtown vancouver in 20 min by skytrain and in a building that is under 10 years old.
On any salary, every little bit adds up.
I would say we spend about $500 a month on food for 2 of us. And thats isn't skimping out and getting junk. It does mean not going out to eat as much, but thats all part of the plan. Buy meat when its on sale, making bigger batches of food and freezing it/having it for lunch the next day, making coffee at home instead of having starbucks. If you want to save, then something has to give. But one big problem is that people dont want to sacrifice anything.
I'll look into that area. The problem stems that im not from Vancouver and my social circle is small, and generally involves work colleagues, 98% of which are foreigners, or, like me, from different parts of Canada. So, everyone lives in downtown, Kits, or just across the bridge on Cambie. Anything further out, and you're essentially cut off without a car. That said, yea, downtown is ridiculously expensive.
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Buggy166 wrote:
Feb 20th, 2016 7:01 am
I'll look into that area. The problem stems that im not from Vancouver and my social circle is small, and generally involves work colleagues, 98% of which are foreigners, or, like me, from different parts of Canada. So, everyone lives in downtown, Kits, or just across the bridge on Cambie. Anything further out, and you're essentially cut off without a car. That said, yea, downtown is ridiculously expensive.
Look around Joyce/Collingwood. Brentwood is meh. filled with Crows in the evenings and involves a transfer to the SkyTrain at Commercial. Joyce is an older neighbourhood and has either ground-level suites, apartments, and a big developement being built right now. Also, proximity to Central Park is nice. If your focus is the Tri-cities or Korea town in Coquitlam, then Brentwood is probably better... but Joyce/Collingwood is, I think, one of Vancouver's more underrated neighbourhoods.
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Stabilo7 wrote:
Feb 19th, 2016 8:52 pm
I would say we spend about $500 a month on food for 2 of us. And thats isn't skimping out and getting junk. It does mean not going out to eat as much, but thats all part of the plan. Buy meat when its on sale, making bigger batches of food and freezing it/having it for lunch the next day, making coffee at home instead of having starbucks. If you want to save, then something has to give. But one big problem is that people don't want to sacrifice anything.
True in part about sacrificing things, but Vancouver does ask you to give up a LOT if you're just coming out of school.
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atomiton wrote:
Feb 20th, 2016 3:43 pm
Look around Joyce/Collingwood. Brentwood is meh. filled with Crows in the evenings and involves a transfer to the SkyTrain at Commercial. Joyce is an older neighbourhood and has either ground-level suites, apartments, and a big developement being built right now. Also, proximity to Central Park is nice. If your focus is the Tri-cities or Korea town in Coquitlam, then Brentwood is probably better... but Joyce/Collingwood is, I think, one of Vancouver's more underrated neighbourhoods.
Brentwood area isn't too bad. Crows typically stay just south around Still Creek. You see them fly by but they dont stick around all night or anything.
But yes, there are a lot of areas that are underrated
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Hi Everyone,

I don't live in Vancouver but I've been there many times for work and stayed downtown in hotels. Vancouver is a nice city, but wow these prices are crazy. I'm an outsider, but I see limited land for building due to mountains and the US border so close. I saw some fee land out in Langley and Abbotsford, but overall seems space is limited.

Here in Ontario you see tones of Single Family home developments, I didn't see anything like that in Vancouver or the lower main land, unless I missed something.

I'm guessing the city charges an Arm and Leg for development fees when building a new house or condo. I know there's an influx of Chinese money parked in Vancouver Realestate, I know this various sources. Nobody knows for sure how much is foreign owned there's no data or hard numbers to back this up.

Who knows when prices will drop, it seems possible and logical due to the rapid price increases.

Overall it's a nice city, it's a shame that the average Canadian can't afford to live there and raise a family. Might as well move to Monte Carlo Monaco, over there you have much better weather with a nice beach and warm ocean water for swimming.

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