Real Estate

Vancouver housing bubble?

  • Last Updated:
  • Apr 8th, 2020 1:42 pm
Tags:
None
Penalty Box
Oct 14, 2005
1461 posts
761 upvotes
carmageddon wrote: How are so many immigrants getting in ? I'm sure they all aren't applying under the skilled worker category.

The new Express Entry PR system is a complete joke. People with 0 experience are easily faking their degrees and work experience to get PR within 4-6 months from applicaton. I don't understand how the Canadian govt. can allow this
The government allows this because Canada is a xenocracy, a country run for foreigners. This is a country with a 7% official unemployment rate and we're increasing the number of immigrants admitted, not decreasing it. For the people who run this xenocracy, ballooning house prices are not a "bug, they're a feature".
Sr. Member
Dec 16, 2014
851 posts
436 upvotes
Easter Island
This did exist and was done through Quebec but who the hell wants to live in quebecois. Rich foreigners bought houses in GTA & gva
Banned
Aug 12, 2010
4875 posts
148 upvotes
Diafel wrote: The government allows this because Canada is a xenocracy, a country run for foreigners. This is a country with a 7% official unemployment rate and we're increasing the number of immigrants admitted, not decreasing it. For the people who run this xenocracy, ballooning house prices are not a "bug, they're a feature".
If the matter was as simple as, 'less immigrants, lower unemployment rate', why do you think we keep accepting more immigrants? I mean according to you the whole matter is so simple isn't it? So why isn't that the reality?
Deal Addict
User avatar
Feb 9, 2013
1683 posts
1201 upvotes
Ottawa
Diafel wrote: The government allows this because Canada is a xenocracy, a country run for foreigners. This is a country with a 7% official unemployment rate and we're increasing the number of immigrants admitted, not decreasing it. For the people who run this xenocracy, ballooning house prices are not a "bug, they're a feature".
As everyday passes, I am starting to believe this more and more. The current situation is appalling and is only getting worse.
Deal Addict
Jan 17, 2012
4727 posts
175 upvotes
Toronto
a-tree wrote: If the matter was as simple as, 'less immigrants, lower unemployment rate', why do you think we keep accepting more immigrants? I mean according to you the whole matter is so simple isn't it? So why isn't that the reality?
There are many reasons that governments have brought huge numbers of immigrants here...one of the biggest is the low birth rate of Canadians and the need to find workers to pay for the social safety net. Another issue is that we have programs here...welfare, EI, odsp to an extent...which essentially lead to labour shortages while the unemployment rate increases. Lets not also forget political issues come into play...you think the Liberals would be quick to import 25,000 Syrians if they were not sure they would get their future votes? It has been leaked that part of the reason the U.S. democrats want to patriate illegal Mexican immigrants is because it should lie as to a few million more Democrat voters...it could change the balance in places like Texas.
Penalty Box
Oct 14, 2005
1461 posts
761 upvotes
[quote="a-tree" post_id="25763633" time="1461295961" user_id="322283"]If the matter was as simple as, 'less immigrants, lower unemployment rate', why do you think we keep accepting more immigrants? I mean according to you the whole matter is so simple isn't it? So why isn't that the reality?[/QUOte]

We keep accepting immigrants because Canada is run for foreigners. The unemployment rate could be 50% and we'd still be hearing from corporations, the government, and the media about how we need more immigrants.

Canada has a huge labor surplus. Why do we need more workers when we have a surplus? Why is immigration the single exception to the law of supply and demand?
Deal Addict
Apr 10, 2011
1445 posts
861 upvotes
Vancouver
Why is the article being seen by some as an immigration issue? It isn't really about immigration. Generally speaking, immigration is good and we are all of One World. However, the article is counter to the normal immigration ideal that a person/family moves to a new country and together that family adopts the new country and does everything to succeed in it.

With the issue of the wealthy foreign visa programs, it's used by some to park often corruptly made money outside of one's country (so it won't be confiscated). Then, the new country is milked and squeezed for every benefit while the "immigrant investor" continues to spend his time and resources in his old country.

This is where the program failed. It assumed, as with wealthy new immigrants from decades ago that they would start businesses and hire employees and tax revenues grow. Not here and not now. In addition, all that juicy capital gain for them with their purchased new passport country is tax free. It doesn't get any better.

Multimillionaires with no income collecting mothers and child benefits, getting free access to city services (community centre programs), etc.

Painting this as a general immigration issue will ultimately rule that anything and everything goes without restriction. This subject and concern is specifically about a small group of individuals who are bending and twisting programs to achieve different results than their intention.

Some countries base their tax structure on asset tax. Here though, a person could continue to earn money somewhere else and transfer it continuously as asset transfers (tax free). They have 5-10 million in properties, spread the ownership around with companies and relatives, while paying virtually no tax -- and consuming all the services and benefit programs that the system allows for such income starved families (with mansions and $300k worth of vehicles in their driveway).
Deal Addict
Jun 29, 2007
4628 posts
1312 upvotes
RxMills wrote: Why is the article being seen by some as an immigration issue? It isn't really about immigration. Generally speaking, immigration is good and we are all of One World. However, the article is counter to the normal immigration ideal that a person/family moves to a new country and together that family adopts the new country and does everything to succeed in it.

With the issue of the wealthy foreign visa programs, it's used by some to park often corruptly made money outside of one's country (so it won't be confiscated). Then, the new country is milked and squeezed for every benefit while the "immigrant investor" continues to spend his time and resources in his old country.

This is where the program failed. It assumed, as with wealthy new immigrants from decades ago that they would start businesses and hire employees and tax revenues grow. Not here and not now. In addition, all that juicy capital gain for them with their purchased new passport country is tax free. It doesn't get any better.

Multimillionaires with no income collecting mothers and child benefits, getting free access to city services (community centre programs), etc.

Painting this as a general immigration issue will ultimately rule that anything and everything goes without restriction. This subject and concern is specifically about a small group of individuals who are bending and twisting programs to achieve different results than their intention.

Some countries base their tax structure on asset tax. Here though, a person could continue to earn money somewhere else and transfer it continuously as asset transfers (tax free). They have 5-10 million in properties, spread the ownership around with companies and relatives, while paying virtually no tax -- and consuming all the services and benefit programs that the system allows for such income starved families (with mansions and $300k worth of vehicles in their driveway).
You got it. The other sad part is the incompetence of the govt and bureaucrats in allowing this to happen.
Sr. Member
Nov 13, 2011
623 posts
221 upvotes
Vancouver, BC
I believe the 800k investors program is still open through Quebec. That's how they've been coming and they use underground banks to transfer money overseas.
Newbie
Nov 18, 2012
45 posts
8 upvotes
Greater Toronto Area
RxMills wrote: Why is the article being seen by some as an immigration issue? It isn't really about immigration. Generally speaking, immigration is good and we are all of One World. However, the article is counter to the normal immigration ideal that a person/family moves to a new country and together that family adopts the new country and does everything to succeed in it.

With the issue of the wealthy foreign visa programs, it's used by some to park often corruptly made money outside of one's country (so it won't be confiscated). Then, the new country is milked and squeezed for every benefit while the "immigrant investor" continues to spend his time and resources in his old country.

This is where the program failed. It assumed, as with wealthy new immigrants from decades ago that they would start businesses and hire employees and tax revenues grow. Not here and not now. In addition, all that juicy capital gain for them with their purchased new passport country is tax free. It doesn't get any better.

Multimillionaires with no income collecting mothers and child benefits, getting free access to city services (community centre programs), etc.

Painting this as a general immigration issue will ultimately rule that anything and everything goes without restriction. This subject and concern is specifically about a small group of individuals who are bending and twisting programs to achieve different results than their intention.

Some countries base their tax structure on asset tax. Here though, a person could continue to earn money somewhere else and transfer it continuously as asset transfers (tax free). They have 5-10 million in properties, spread the ownership around with companies and relatives, while paying virtually no tax -- and consuming all the services and benefit programs that the system allows for such income starved families (with mansions and $300k worth of vehicles in their driveway).
I'm sure this is true in some cases, but I'm not sure wealthy non-resident immigrants have as large an impact as people think. For starters, in your example, they either 1) don't live here, in which case they're not using much of our infrastructure that their property taxes pay for, or 2) they live here and spend conspicuously. I'm not sure they're a net negative in either case.

I can think of many immigrant (and resident) categories that are likely far more negative if you measured their contribution to society (in dollar terms) versus the benefits they receive.
Jr. Member
Dec 10, 2011
129 posts
109 upvotes
514
Diafel wrote: The government allows this because Canada is a xenocracy, a country run for foreigners. This is a country with a 7% official unemployment rate and we're increasing the number of immigrants admitted, not decreasing it. For the people who run this xenocracy, ballooning house prices are not a "bug, they're a feature".
Look what the natural rate of unemployment means, there is no country in the world that is running at 100% employment. But it's much easier to blame the immigrants.
Deal Addict
User avatar
Sep 23, 2014
1722 posts
463 upvotes
Toronto, ON
raygeta wrote: I'm sure this is true in some cases, but I'm not sure wealthy non-resident immigrants have as large an impact as people think. For starters, in your example, they either 1) don't live here, in which case they're not using much of our infrastructure that their property taxes pay for, or 2) they live here and spend conspicuously. I'm not sure they're a net negative in either case.

I can think of many immigrant (and resident) categories that are likely far more negative if you measured their contribution to society (in dollar terms) versus the benefits they receive.
People might disagree or think it is unfair but the truth is your contribution towards this country is measured either by your tax paid or consumption. The best case scenario is paying both taxes and consumption but a typical large dollar amount RE purchase equates to a lifetime worth of consumption of that a typical Canadian. From an economic standpoint, these wealthy investors/immigrants have paid their fair share to Canada.
Dual XEON E5-2696V4 | ASUS STRIX GeForce GTX 1080Ti OC | 3X NEC PA301W | 64GB DDR4 ECC |1 TB Samsung 960 Pro
FreeNAS & Plex Server XEON E3 1265L V3 | Supermicro X10SAE | 16GB DDR3 ECC | 6 X 3TB HGST 7K4000 RAIDZ2 | 3 X 3TB HGST 7K4000 RAIDZ1
Deal Addict
Apr 10, 2011
1445 posts
861 upvotes
Vancouver
raygeta wrote: , in your example, they either 1) don't live here, in which case they're not using much of our infrastructure that their property taxes pay for
Many are guessing and going with their feeling on the issue. The article, and other articles, simply state facts of what's happening. I'm close with several players in real estate in Vancouver (buyers, agents, etc).

The numbers are significant with both homes and new condos of mothers with one or two kids as 'owners' and husband/father virtually never here due to continuing to make money in the other other country.

The result, and studies and statistics contest, multimillion dollar new homes with poverty level incomes that qualify as 'poor' for benefits/resources. Not my opinion, just facts.

Someone I know is trying to buy a house on Vancouver's east side. They, of course, overbid and lost to "an overseas buyer who offerred $100k over whatever the highest bid was" (source: Selling agent told other agent).

Someone I also know is tying to buy a condo in the $600-800k range. They recently gave an offer but the sellers agent said "the seller (mom) is currently in labour at the hospital and is unable to look at offers on any of her properties at the moment".

Etc. Etc. Anybody close to the Vancouver real estate market in some way will find it difficult to find an exception. This is mainly true for any house, or relatively new condo/townhouse. Of course, the real estate agents themselves love it with high prices, cash buyers, frequent turnovers, and 2-3 day transactions.

Note to mods: Why are you lumping all these subjects into one thread(bubble)? I don't think there is a bubble as long as the system stays the same. And even if there was a significant change, the millions in parked money that's already here will continue to acquire many future dwellings for their offspring.
Sr. Member
Jan 30, 2006
857 posts
286 upvotes
traderjay wrote: People might disagree or think it is unfair but the truth is your contribution towards this country is measured either by your tax paid or consumption. The best case scenario is paying both taxes and consumption but a typical large dollar amount RE purchase equates to a lifetime worth of consumption of that a typical Canadian. From an economic standpoint, these wealthy investors/immigrants have paid their fair share to Canada.
They invest when they purchase RE - they don't consume
do you understand the difference?

what do you think happens when they sell, get their profit and move money somewhere else?

Top