50 Charged in US College Admissions Scam

chimaican wrote: ↑ .... Privilege

Not privilege ... privilege would be if they got in without paying a bribe.

Piro21 wrote: ↑ I don't understand this. You'd be better off just giving the money directly to the kid and sending them to a lower school.

They're buying prestige for their kids. Similar in a way to how wealthy American families would arrange marriages for their daughters to poor British nobles in the Gilded Age.

aviador wrote: ↑Color me shocked! It's always been this way and everybody knows it.

............

Correct. If admission wasn't gained by marks then it was by who your parents are (alumni) or, who sponsored you (political) or, who could give the school most donations.
If athletics are involved, it is a different story all together.

DelusionalDiva wrote: ↑Interesting. Canadian universities are also mostly funded by the gov't and who's to say that the same thing doesn't happens here. In any case, nothing will come out of this and it'll die down in few days at the most.
I wonder if Felicity Huffman and Lori Loughlin pissed off someone higher up to be outed like this.

It does happen here all the time as well. There is always room for those that wish to pay a little extra for an education. Foreign students are a perfect example....pay a lot more for tuition and you get in.
Athletes can get in with low marks especially how badly they need you on the field, gym, track etc..

Pete_Coach wrote: ↑ Correct. If admission wasn't gained by marks then it was by who your parents are (alumni) or, who sponsored you (political) or, who could give the school most donations.
If athletics are involved, it is a different story all together.

It does happen here all the time as well. There is always room for those that wish to pay a little extra for an education. Foreign students are a perfect example....pay a lot more for tuition and you get in.
Athletes can get in with low marks especially how badly they need you on the field, gym, track etc..

There a few details that make this admission cheating case a bit different from the usual preferential treatment case -- which I don't think is truly cheating because these are private universities: they can set as many spots that will go to high paying applicants (regardless of merit) and as many spots that will go to high merit applicants (fairness mandatory -- cheating not allowed) as they wish. One issue is that it seems that some of the cheaters had someone else take the SAT test for them [which means they probably lied to other universities in their applications]. The other issue being that these universities are recipients of huge amounts of taxpayers money and by doing so they should abide by fairness rules [same way contracting with the US government require those companies/institutions to be equal opportunity employers, etc.]

IMO, the case about foreign students in Canada is completely different and fair game -- there's no place for an analogy as they do not benefit from Canadian taxpayer's money or cheat their way in.

aviador wrote: ↑ There a few details that make this admission cheating case a bit different from the usual preferential treatment case -- which I don't think is truly cheating because these are private universities: they can set as many spots that will go to high paying applicants (regardless of merit) and as many spots that will go to high merit applicants (fairness mandatory -- cheating not allowed) as they wish. One issue is that it seems that some of the cheaters had someone else take the SAT test for them [which means they probably lied to other universities in their applications]. The other issue being that these universities are recipients of huge amounts of taxpayers money and by doing so they should abide by fairness rules [same way contracting with the US government require those companies/institutions to be equal opportunity employers, etc.]

IMO, the case about foreign students in Canada is completely different and fair game -- there's no place for an analogy as they do not benefit from Canadian taxpayer's money or cheat their way in.

Yes, there is allegations that some students paid someone else to take the SAT's but really, there were other ways to get in without that. The real good thing that comes out of this is that the college entrance system in the US is all blown up and being investigated now. I really am surprised that so many people are surprised that this has been going on LOL Just form the athletic departments alone, did anyone really think some (many?) of those athletes actually took their own SAT's and passed? LOL
My point with the foreign student analogy is they buy their way in. There are only so many spots in each yearly class and if there is money, you get in.

Is anyone actually surprised by this? Elite private universities in the States are notorious for this, and it'll only continue to get worse and more discreet. 50 people out of the thousands every year that perpetuate this.

FreshCo wrote: ↑ Is anyone actually surprised by this? Elite private universities in the States are notorious for this, and it'll only continue to get worse and more discreet. 50 people out of the thousands every year that perpetuate this.

LOL, you think it's just 50? C'mon man.

JayLove06 wrote: ↑ LOL, you think it's just 50? C'mon man.

No, I'm sure thousands of wealthy parents do this every year. There's a good book written about this on Amazon I saw the other day called "The Price of Admission".

DelusionalDiva wrote: ↑ The schools should also get sanctioned for being complicit in this. I can't believe (or maybe I can believe) that schools are acting like they have been a victim in all this.

Are you serious? The people who were colluding have been punished; the ones caught anyway They acted on their own accord there is no proof that the whole institutions fiduciary knew about it.

I'm not shocked at all about this and neither should anyone else. We all know money buys favours. Hell even buys life in matters of life and death. Everyone has a monetary value.

thelefteyeguy wrote: ↑ ...so 50 out of 325M ppl...ok.

Actually Singer claimed to help 971 parents since 2010. I'm sure the 50 he flipped over to the feds are wealthiest and most high profile. The other 921 - not so much but still paid the bribes. Besides... US census says only 16 MIL peeps in america are enrolled in colleges each year, not 325 MIL. That includes loser schools like DeVry all the way up to Ivy Leagues.

aviador wrote: ↑ Color me shocked! It's always been this way and everybody knows it.

For instance:

The Story Behind Jared Kushner’s Curious Acceptance Into Harvard -- Propublica, Nov. 18, 2016
ProPublica editor Daniel Golden wrote a book a decade ago about how the rich buy their children access to elite colleges. One student he covered is now poised to become one of the most powerful figures in the country.

How is this different than Chump and his rag tag spawns?? It's pretty much known the ONLY reason he got into Wharton was his older brother (who later died from alcoholism) was dating an admissions chic and got Chumpster in. Why do you think he's sealed his HS and U of Penn grades and threatens to sue anyone who releases them?? Cuz Chump got in now the rest of his fam are legacy applicants... which explains how Eric, Don Jr and Ivanka all went there. It's a complete joke. If all colleges want to be fair and based on meritocracy then 1) eliminate legacy applicants 2) anyone making a donation to a college shud not expect quid pro quo and 3) eliminate affirmative action. All applications shud have their name, race, ethnicity and sex hidden upon submission to the database. Run the filters and whichever student code/name pops out so be it. But of course they wont do that. Harvard enjoys their $40 BIL endowment too much. The irony is Wharton endorsed Clinton over Chump during the 2016 election. *welp*

This happens when parents are wealthy and their kids are a bunch of lazy layabouts with no drive/ambition or smarts.

In many places in the world (I am thinking India/Pakistan, and I am sure China), children would work their @sses off to get into good schools and Parents would sacrifice a lot to do so.

hightech wrote: ↑ This happens when parents are wealthy and their kids are a bunch of lazy layabouts with no drive/ambition or smarts.

In many places in the world (I am thinking India/Pakistan, and I am sure China), children would work their @sses off to get into good schools and Parents would sacrifice a lot to do so.

LOL, mos definitely NOT China. Bribery and money changes hands like water in a bucket from a lake - keep scooping, a never ending supply. TONS of bribery occurs in china in all facets of life. The top uni's in China are much like the Ivy Leagues. It's all marketing and so "hard" to get in... but once you do it's pretty much coasting thru 4 yrs. They have a standardized test as well for HS applicants. Same bullshit... cheating, bribery, whatnot. If their kids are not smart enuff to get in to a top uni like Beijing U, they bribe their way to 2nd or even 3rd tier colleges. Hell some of them fools will pay up to $50k USD to just to get into those foreign student "International schools" for bragging rights. TONS of them in Toronto alone. Many are privately owned and I know teachers have said it's a joke. Owners tell them to pass a certain student cuz the parents made a high contribution (aka bribe). I know a foreign teacher at a ShenZhen high school in China. He was really putting the pressure on a failing student - always late, never does homework, doesnt pay attention in class, piss poor marks, etc. Owner pulls him aside and said he better pass this kid cuz his dad made a large "donation". Lolz. And if he doesnt - HE will get fired. So he passed him. *welp*

aznnorth wrote: ↑ The top uni's in China are much like the Ivy Leagues. It's all marketing and so "hard" to get in... but once you do it's pretty much coasting thru 4 yrs.

No. Look up news on students who commits suicide in top Chinese universities.

https://blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/201 ... -suicides/

Schools in Asia are cut throat. My older siblings would study all night for exams... not university exams, not high school exams, but elementary school exams. When I was 6 years old, in grade 1, my science exam was on photosethesis (Calvin cycle, C3 etc) and cell division (mitosis, meiosis, and cytokinesis etc)... after I moved to Canada, I didn't learn about those things until high school. There was also a grade school entrance exam where the examiner asked me, who just turned 6 at the time, the historical and cultural significance of Qu Yuan, who was a Chinese poet and minister who lived during the Warring States period of ancient China.

At least people in the west don't care about their grades enough to commit suicide.

Statistics101 wrote: ↑ No. Look up news on students who commits suicide in top Chinese universities.

https://blogs.wsj.com/chinarealtime/201 ... -suicides/

Schools in Asia are cut throat. My older siblings would study all night for exams... not university exams, not high school exams, but elementary school exams. When I was 6 years old, in grade 1, my science exam was on photosethesis (Calvin cycle, carbon concentration etc) and cell division (mitosis, meiosis, and cytokinesis etc).

At least people in the west don't care about their grades enough to commit suicide.

Not all kids parents are rich and can afford donations and bribes in china. I didnt say EVERY1 bribes and cheats but the prevalence is much greater than in the US. And it is TRUE, once you pass that college exam entrance to uni's in china... university is more coasting thru (although like I said there are Ivy leagues like Beijing U). Why peeps commit suicide in china has to do with parental and family pressure. In many poor families (vast majority in china) , getting that college admission is life and death. They may come from generations of poor factory workers and farmers going back generations. Now you have a child who is smart and can get him and his family out of poverty. The pressure is immense. If he cant pass it's all over. China doesnt have safety nets like western countries. He cant get welfare, loans, alternative schools, etc to get back in the game. You're done and face the same hardships as your parents and those before. For some the only way out is death.

U.S. Schools Expelled 8,000 Chinese Students, The Wall Street Journal.May, 2015

According to an estimate by a U.S. education company, some 8,000 Chinese students were expelled from American universities last year alone – and the main reasons were poor grades and cheating.

Stacked up against the huge numbers of Chinese students who go to American universities every year, the failure rate isn’t so bad, WholeRen said, though it does suggest a change in the once-shining image of students from China.

“Chinese students used to be considered top-notch but over the past five years their image has changed completely -- wealthy kids who cheat,” said Chen Hang, chief development officer at WholeRen, which is based in Pittsburgh, Pa.

Chinese students among thousands ‘falsely accused’ of cheating UK language tests, then ordered to leave, SCMP, 2018.

Some 40,000 students have been ordered to leave the UK after being accused of cheating on English-language tests. But thousands are believed to have been falsely accused.

Cheating has become the rule rather than an exception.

Just fresh off CP24 News, students who were denied admission to Stanford, Harvard and Georgetown even while possessing top grades are organizing a class-action lawsuit against these ivory institutions.

MusicBox wrote: ↑ Just fresh off CP24 News, students who were denied admission to Stanford, Harvard and Georgetown even while possessing top grades are organizing a class-action lawsuit against these ivory institutions.

Can you blame them? i'd be pissed too.

MusicBox wrote: ↑ Just fresh off CP24 News, students who were denied admission to Stanford, Harvard and Georgetown even while possessing top grades are organizing a class-action lawsuit against these ivory institutions.

Good.