Expired Hot Deals

[Air Canada] Non-stop from Vancouver, Calgary or Edmonton, Canada to China from only $494 CAD roundtrip

  • Last Updated:
  • May 13th, 2019 11:07 am
Deal Addict
Oct 26, 2010
2255 posts
2382 upvotes
jaynefonda wrote:
May 9th, 2019 3:21 am
He probably doesn't even know what a carbon tax is, likely just repeating what he sees on idiot box like a good little boy
It was a joke, but okay.
I apologize for offending someone as smart and up to date with the carbon tax as yourself.
Koodo, Fido, Telus, Public Mobile, Virgin customer.
Sr. Member
Oct 17, 2009
666 posts
1232 upvotes
divx wrote:
May 9th, 2019 12:03 pm
actually carbon tax is meant to tax anything that generates carbon, which includes transportation of all kinds.
I'm aware, and airlines will undoubtedly pass that cost off to their customers. My point was that it hasn't happened, yet.
It's also not going to be an itemized line on our ticket, prepare for the airlines to blame a profit grab on this tax.
Member
Sep 22, 2016
233 posts
212 upvotes
I hate every flight thread related to China becomes a political discussion thread.
Truth is that if people who want to go probably know about the political situation. We shouldn't discuss it here. It's a deal forum after all.
Sr. Member
Jan 8, 2012
534 posts
243 upvotes
Williams Lake
Keep in mind, you can travel to various cities in China without a visa, provided that you travel through those cities to a third city outside of China. It's called a transit without visa.

Eg. a trip from Calgary, to Beijing, and then on to, say, Hong Kong. You can then return from Hong Kong to Calgary through Beijing.

As long as you don't stay longer than 144 hours in Beijing, either way.

The allowed hours vary by city, and the process is a bit complicated. But it does work, and if you're only planning to visit China once, it's a good way to avoid the expense of the 10 year visa.
Deal Addict
Jun 11, 2005
2589 posts
281 upvotes
MikoWilson wrote:
May 9th, 2019 3:09 am
Sure, depending on where you fly in America you could face a single option as well, that's life -- it happens. Popular routes have more competition, while less popular routes sometimes only have regional airline coverage.
The real issue with the price disparity vs distance flown is the inclusion of ultra-first class tickets that regional Canadian flights don't have :S
Here's a great breakdown on how airline economics work.
I take issue with your take on "ultra-first tickets".

First of all, there is no 1st class offered by AC or WS. You can get an Signature Class (formerly International Business) product from Air Canada but only where they are using an aircraft that needs to be positioned for international flights.

Secondly, YYZ-YEG does not use any of the B772/773, B787 or A330 series of planes. Yet YYZ-YEG and YYZ-YYC, which occasionally uses A330's and B763's, are priced almost identically. YYZ-YEG uses A320's and perhaps a couple of rouge 763's. The inclusion of a premium product on certain YYZ-YYC flights cannot explain why these two routes basically have the same price. Going by your theory, the premium paying passengers should be subsidizing the YYZ-YYC routes, but the prices are no lower than the YYZ-YEG route which has no such premium product. Personally, I would hardly consider a business class seat on the A320 series of aircrafts or the business class of any AC Rouge aircrafts to be anywhere close to "ultra-first class".

Another example would be comparing YYZ-ATL vs YYZ-MCO. Neither of these routes has a premium product in business class, and yet YYZ-ATL is almost always 1.5X to 2X the YYZ-MCO fares generally speaking.

So what does it boil down to? Definitely not "ultra-first class" tickets or service.
Deal Addict
Jun 11, 2005
2589 posts
281 upvotes
MikoWilson wrote:
May 9th, 2019 2:05 pm
I'm aware, and airlines will undoubtedly pass that cost off to their customers. My point was that it hasn't happened, yet.
It's also not going to be an itemized line on our ticket, prepare for the airlines to blame a profit grab on this tax.
What has not happened, yet? Are you saying that when an aircraft refuels in Ontario, the cost of the carbon tax has not passed that cost off to their customers, itemized or not?
Deal Addict
May 23, 2008
1826 posts
279 upvotes
Vaughan, Ontario
This never gonna happen at Toronto or Montreal.
Sr. Member
Oct 17, 2009
666 posts
1232 upvotes
mudd_stuffin wrote:
May 9th, 2019 5:34 pm
I take issue with your take on "ultra-first tickets".

First of all, there is no 1st class offered by AC or WS. You can get an Signature Class (formerly International Business) product from Air Canada but only where they are using an aircraft that needs to be positioned for international flights.

Secondly, YYZ-YEG does not use any of the B772/773, B787 or A330 series of planes. Yet YYZ-YEG and YYZ-YYC, which occasionally uses A330's and B763's, are priced almost identically. YYZ-YEG uses A320's and perhaps a couple of rouge 763's. The inclusion of a premium product on certain YYZ-YYC flights cannot explain why these two routes basically have the same price. Going by your theory, the premium paying passengers should be subsidizing the YYZ-YYC routes, but the prices are no lower than the YYZ-YEG route which has no such premium product. Personally, I would hardly consider a business class seat on the A320 series of aircrafts or the business class of any AC Rouge aircrafts to be anywhere close to "ultra-first class".

Another example would be comparing YYZ-ATL vs YYZ-MCO. Neither of these routes has a premium product in business class, and yet YYZ-ATL is almost always 1.5X to 2X the YYZ-MCO fares generally speaking.

So what does it boil down to? Definitely not "ultra-first class" tickets or service.
We were specifically talking about air canada vs. china airlines, who absolutely have massive jumbojets, allowing people in economy to fly to China for less than 500 bucks.
That's the only way you get those fares. They are subsidized.
There tons of reasons why specific routes have the fares that they do, and I'm not even going to attempt to cover them all. You can Google-fu it yourself.
Sr. Member
Oct 17, 2009
666 posts
1232 upvotes
mudd_stuffin wrote:
May 9th, 2019 5:38 pm
What has not happened, yet? Are you saying that when an aircraft refuels in Ontario, the cost of the carbon tax has not passed that cost off to their customers, itemized or not?
I'm saying that it's a business expense that has a real cost, and should be considered. I'm glad we're considering it.
Airlines shrug off a ton of pollution into the public sphere, and we all pay for it if we fly or not. When a town on the east coast is devastated by yet another "flood of the century" our tax dollars pay for their recovery. We're paying for that pollution one way or another.
Deal Addict
Jul 23, 2007
3708 posts
1479 upvotes
Fares are not all that bad from either Toronto or Montreal.

Same as out west, the lower fares begin in November.

Non-stop Montreal (YUL) to Shanghai (PVG) $649.

Non-stop Toronto (YYZ) to Shanghai (PVG) $693,

Non-stop Toronto (YYZ) to Beijing (PEK) $693.

------------------------
Departing Winnipeg $605 to Beijing or $599 return from Saskatoon.
Deal Addict
User avatar
Nov 28, 2007
2754 posts
697 upvotes
Whitehorse, YT
MikoWilson wrote:
May 9th, 2019 11:40 pm
We were specifically talking about air canada vs. china airlines, who absolutely have massive jumbojets, allowing people in economy to fly to China for less than 500 bucks.
That's the only way you get those fares. They are subsidized.
There tons of reasons why specific routes have the fares that they do, and I'm not even going to attempt to cover them all. You can Google-fu it yourself.
A plane load of Canadians is a lot heavier than a load of Chinese. Where does that come into the fare equation?
Sr. Member
Oct 17, 2009
666 posts
1232 upvotes
Haha, hell if I know :D It will certainly cost the airlines more. Weight is in direct correlation with fuel used, so it's a real cost.
With those European airlines considering weighing customers, it's only a matter of time before travelers are broken up into brackets (ie. 150+ pounds pay twenty dollars more)
Deal Addict
Jun 11, 2005
2589 posts
281 upvotes
MikoWilson wrote:
May 9th, 2019 11:40 pm
We were specifically talking about air canada vs. china airlines, who absolutely have massive jumbojets, allowing people in economy to fly to China for less than 500 bucks.
That's the only way you get those fares. They are subsidized.
There tons of reasons why specific routes have the fares that they do, and I'm not even going to attempt to cover them all. You can Google-fu it yourself.
What's a typical massive jumbojet you are talking about? Most airlines, whether it is AC or the Chinese carriers, use a B777 to fly trans-Pacific. The same aircrafts are used by mainline carriers to fly YYZ-CDG/FRA. Yet the fares are the same, despite how the YYZ-Europe flights are 1/2 the distance of YYZ-Asia flights. I am not talking about specific routes here - just YYZ to popular destinations in Europe.

Yes, there are tons of reasons why specific routes have the fares they do... no need to Google-fu it (and no need for you to tell me to Google-fu it). The "massive jumbojets" having F class is definitely not the main reason why people can fly from here to China for $500 because your "ultra F" argument completely breaks down when comparing prices with flights to Europe. This (https://jingtravel.com/international-ai ... ete-china/ or https://www.bbc.com/news/business-45168924), not your "ultra F" explanation, is the better explanation as to why we can fly to China for $500.
Last edited by mudd_stuffin on May 10th, 2019 10:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Deal Addict
Jun 11, 2005
2589 posts
281 upvotes
MikoWilson wrote:
May 9th, 2019 11:42 pm
I'm saying that it's a business expense that has a real cost, and should be considered. I'm glad we're considering it.
Airlines shrug off a ton of pollution into the public sphere, and we all pay for it if we fly or not. When a town on the east coast is devastated by yet another "flood of the century" our tax dollars pay for their recovery. We're paying for that pollution one way or another.
You said above that the costs are not being passed on by the airlines to their customers, yet. I questioned you on the validity of your statement.

That is not the same as "considering it".
Newbie
Mar 29, 2018
60 posts
30 upvotes
Until China stops acting like a child I can't recommend people visit them.

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