Banging Water Pipes - Please Help

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Mar 18th, 2022 9:26 pm

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Mar 14th, 2022 7:10 pm

Jagstyles [OP]: Deal Addict; Aug 7, 2013; 1610 posts; 509 upvotes; GTA

Mar 14th, 2022 7:10 pm

Banging Water Pipes - Please Help

I’m having some major banging pipes and it happens regardless of which toilet I flush or faucet and shower head I run.

For example, when I flush the toilet, the water starts filling back up and the pipe in the basement will start hammering like crazy. It seems to be coming from the supply line and it’s unrelated to heat expansion because it happens even when just flushing the toilet which only uses cold water.

The only time it doesn’t bang is when I’ve been running the water for several minutes. It eventually gets slower with the banging and goes away.

I have flushed all air from the pipes and even installed a water pressure reducer with it set at 45.

Here are links to the audio of what it sounds like, one is a bit more violent than the other but it gives you an idea of what it sounds like:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1IKnU-J ... p=drivesdk

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1iIRhxE ... p=drivesdk

There don’t seem to be any loose pipes anywhere. The crazy thing is I can hear the banging in the area of the furnace room where the pipes are running but there’s no moving pipes and I can’t pinpoint exactly where it’s coming from. It’s almost like it’s coming from inside the pipes themselves. So strange.

Had a Plummer come by and he even said he’s never heard anything like this. It sounds like water hammer but not your typical water hammer. To be clear, this happens while the water is running and not when you suddenly turn the water on or off.

Any ideas/suggestions? I also wonder if the random pop or bang noise I hear from the same area is also coming from the water pipes. I will be sitting watching tv with no water fixtures running and I hear a random pop or bang similar to one of the bangs you hear in the audio files above.

Thanks

16 replies

Mar 14th, 2022 7:46 pm

clutch31: Deal Addict; Mar 14, 2018; 1121 posts; 1116 upvotes; GTA

Mar 14th, 2022 7:46 pm

Could it be the vent stack rubbing against wood?

Try shutting off the water supply to your toilet and then flush it. If you still hear the noise, you can eliminate that it's not the supplies.

Mar 14th, 2022 8:00 pm

Jagstyles [OP]: Deal Addict; Aug 7, 2013; 1610 posts; 509 upvotes; GTA

Mar 14th, 2022 8:00 pm

clutch31 wrote: ↑ Could it be the vent stack rubbing against wood?

Try shutting off the water supply to your toilet and then flush it. If you still hear the noise, you can eliminate that it's not the supplies.

No noise when supply to toilet is shut off which makes sense because the banging noises come from the water supply line not the drain line.

So whenever there is water being supplied to any fixture, toilet or shower head, there is banging. If you turn off the supply line, no more banging.

In fact, one I turned the water back on to the toilet, all sorts of banging occurred. I don’t get it. It also sounds like it’s coming from multiple locations in the pipes.

Mar 14th, 2022 8:18 pm

MrFrugal1: Deal Addict; Jan 2, 2012; 4377 posts; 3551 upvotes; KINGSTON,ON

Mar 14th, 2022 8:18 pm

Locate your main shut off valve for your house. If it is a quarter turn valve like this with a handle, put it in the half way position between fully open and fully closed.
If you have a shut off valve with a round handle, open it two rotations.

Flush the toilet to see if the noise persists.

+2

Mar 15th, 2022 12:17 am

fergy: Deal Fanatic; Sep 27, 2006; 5179 posts; 2029 upvotes; Not so easy there Ma…

Mar 15th, 2022 12:17 am

Try turning off the water valve before your water heater then try flushing the toilet / running cold water and see if the noise is still there.

Is the water heater unit a water tank or tankless? Is there a mixing valve between the hot and cold lines near the water heater?

Another attempt to isolate would be to turn off the water valves to any appliances like the washing machine, dishwasher and the fridge if it has a water or ice dispenser.

I also wonder if it could be the water meter. Something amiss in it?

Mar 15th, 2022 3:44 pm

Jagstyles [OP]: Deal Addict; Aug 7, 2013; 1610 posts; 509 upvotes; GTA

Mar 15th, 2022 3:44 pm

fergy wrote: ↑ Try turning off the water valve before your water heater then try flushing the toilet / running cold water and see if the noise is still there.

Is the water heater unit a water tank or tankless? Is there a mixing valve between the hot and cold lines near the water heater?

Another attempt to isolate would be to turn off the water valves to any appliances like the washing machine, dishwasher and the fridge if it has a water or ice dispenser.

I also wonder if it could be the water meter. Something amiss in it?

Thanks for the suggestions.

1. Tried turning off the water valve before the heater, still banging.
2. Didn't see a mixing valve between the hot/cold lines near the water heater, but must admit, not sure what it would really look like but all I see is the cold water pipe going into the heater and hot water pipe going out of the heater.
3. Tried turning the master shut off valve a quarter turn, still banging.
4. Water pressure is current set to 45, so that's not an issue
5. Tried turning off the water valves to all major appliances and then flushing the toilet for example, pipes still banging.

I'm really at a loss for what this could be. It happens while the water is running and the only time it goes away is if you're having a shower and the water has been running for 2-3 minutes, it eventually goes away. But then once you haven't used the water for some time, it'll start banging again.

Mar 15th, 2022 3:44 pm

Jagstyles [OP]: Deal Addict; Aug 7, 2013; 1610 posts; 509 upvotes; GTA

Mar 15th, 2022 3:44 pm

MrFrugal1 wrote: ↑ Locate your main shut off valve for your house. If it is a quarter turn valve like this with a handle, put it in the half way position between fully open and fully closed.
If you have a shut off valve with a round handle, open it two rotations.

Flush the toilet to see if the noise persists.

Tried this, same issue. Wouldn't turning the shut-off valve half way closed effectively be the same thing as a water pressure reducer which I already have installed?

Mar 15th, 2022 4:14 pm

sherwoodRFD: Sr. Member; Aug 22, 2012; 533 posts; 547 upvotes; Mark Town

Mar 15th, 2022 4:14 pm

Solder a piece of dead end pipe along the line and the hammer will be gone.

Mar 15th, 2022 4:16 pm

MrFrugal1: Deal Addict; Jan 2, 2012; 4377 posts; 3551 upvotes; KINGSTON,ON

Mar 15th, 2022 4:16 pm

Jagstyles wrote: ↑ Tried this, same issue. Wouldn't turning the shut-off valve half way closed effectively be the same thing as a water pressure reducer which I already have installed?

The pressure would initially be the same until you opened a faucet.
I suggested this because my mother-in-law had a similar issue with her hot water tank anti-scald mixing valve. Two seperate plumbers couldn't figure it out, and I solved it by partially closing the shut off valve on the mixer.

Last edited by MrFrugal1 on Mar 15th, 2022 4:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Mar 15th, 2022 4:17 pm

Jagstyles [OP]: Deal Addict; Aug 7, 2013; 1610 posts; 509 upvotes; GTA

Mar 15th, 2022 4:17 pm

sherwoodRFD wrote: ↑ Solder a piece of dead end pipe along the line and the hammer will be gone.

Will this be to create some form of air chamber? What's the purpose of doing this and does it matter where it's done along that pipe e.g. before the water heater or after the water heater?

Mar 16th, 2022 10:51 am

Rick007: Deal Addict; Oct 14, 2010; 1741 posts; 1211 upvotes; Barrie ON

Mar 16th, 2022 10:51 am

Your water supply should come from the basement floor and into the water meter. After leaving the water meter, the water will split. One path will feed all the cold water fixtures in the house, and the other path will go to the water heater, and then onwards to feed all the hot water fixtures.

Since the noise occurs with both hot and cold water flow, it would seem that the noise must be originating between the point where the water enters from the floor, and the point where it splits to the hot water heater. That doesn't leave much except the main shutoff valve and the meter, and the pipes themselves.

You describe the noise as banging, and you have taken steps to reduce any effects of water hammer. When I listen to the recording it sound more like a ticking sound which I can hear from my own water meter (at a very reduced level).

I suppose that if a washer or something was deteriorating in the main shutoff that it might also cause a noise when water flows.

Does the noise change in frequency as water flow increases? I suppose that if you installed a pressure reducer, you already confirmed that the main valve is working properly.

Try using a mechanics stethoscope to locate the source of the sound ($15 at Princess Auto). A wooden dowel also works well as a stethoscope, although it may require twisting your head in an awkward position.

+1

Mar 16th, 2022 11:12 am

Jagstyles [OP]: Deal Addict; Aug 7, 2013; 1610 posts; 509 upvotes; GTA

Mar 16th, 2022 11:12 am

Rick007 wrote: ↑ You describe the noise as banging, and you have taken steps to reduce any effects of water hammer. When I listen to the recording it sound more like a ticking sound which I can hear from my own water meter (at a very reduced level).

I suppose that if a washer or something was deteriorating in the main shutoff that it might also cause a noise when water flows.

Does the noise change in frequency as water flow increases? I suppose that if you installed a pressure reducer, you already confirmed that the main valve is working properly.

Try using a mechanics stethoscope to locate the source of the sound ($15 at Princess Auto). A wooden dowel also works well as a stethoscope, although it may require twisting your head in an awkward position.

It's definitely not a ticking noise from the water meter. This is a banging noise that can get quite violent at times. It's extremely loud and can be heard from upstairs too. As the water flow continues for a minute or two, the banging eventually stops. For example, if running a shower, it'll bang for the first 2-3 minutes and then stop banging. I'm starting to wonder if perhaps one of the supply line pipes is leaning on a heating duct that may change the temperate of that section of the pipe so that when cold water comes in from the city line there's such a difference in temperature that it would cause the banging? I'm grasping at straws here but something is definitely off.

The timing between each bang noise starts slow and as the water continues to flow the banging gets progressively faster until which point you sometimes here a pop and then it settles down. For example, let's say you flushed a toilet, the initial 5-10 seconds you here a bang every 3-4 seconds and then they become rapid fire. This is the strangest frigging thing I've ever heard in my life - even the plumber was dumbfounded.

I could be wrong but I think there's only one main water line from the meter in my house (where it comes in from the street) directly to the hot water tank and then it gets distributed from there. The reason I suspect this as the case is that I notice a 3/4" copper pipe that supplies water to the water heater (it's t'd off there) and this 3/4" pipe runs for maybe another few feet past the water heater and transitions to a 1/2" copper pipe. I then have PEX piping that distributes it to various areas of the house.

Mar 16th, 2022 2:48 pm

Motopp: Jr. Member; Sep 3, 2020; 175 posts; 252 upvotes; Ontario

Mar 16th, 2022 2:48 pm

We've had and have similar issues where I thought it was water hammer but a dozen times of closing main and flushing air does not solve.

Noise was limited to two bathrooms on second floor and happened from toilet, sink or tub.

So bathroom A was resolved by changing shower cartridge in tub. Seemed it was original and causing noises from tub as well as from sink and toilet... pipes intermixed??

However bathroom B not fully resolved. Did change shower cartridge and that has helped tub but not toilet or sink.
The toilet makes noise after flushing larger refuse but not if flush just liquids. Thought perhaps it was toilet drain but seemed stable after removed toilet to check BUT not ruled out toilet drain rubbing against wood/drywall. AND maybe it is pipes but strange that only make noise when larger refuse flushed.
In same bathroom the sink pipes make tick tick sound when first run. Initially only hot water so expansion due to hot water made sense as noise went away after few minutes of running water but now cold water as well sometimes so perhaps pipes loose??

Not expensive so trying changing shower cartridge(s) first.

Another thought is that even though flushed air the hot water tank was not fully emptied so perhaps that needs to be?? Not sure if advisable to do that??

+1

Mar 16th, 2022 8:47 pm

GSD: Deal Addict; Jul 5, 2005; 3850 posts; 1724 upvotes; Toronto

Mar 16th, 2022 8:47 pm

I had a similar issue with an air lock in the shower mixing valve once

Mar 18th, 2022 1:55 pm

Motopp: Jr. Member; Sep 3, 2020; 175 posts; 252 upvotes; Ontario

Mar 18th, 2022 1:55 pm

MrFrugal1 wrote: ↑ Locate your main shut off valve for your house. If it is a quarter turn valve like this with a handle, put it in the half way position between fully open and fully closed.
If you have a shut off valve with a round handle, open it two rotations.

Flush the toilet to see if the noise persists.

Have the round handle.

Normally valve would be fully open or fully closed.

If partially close is there increased risk from doing this [bursting, leaking, etc.]?

Mar 18th, 2022 4:21 pm

DoorCrasher: Penalty Box; Nov 21, 2013; 8128 posts; 9304 upvotes; Montréal

Mar 18th, 2022 4:21 pm

We had this issue last year. I had a hard time to find it. Called a plumber, and he found within 30 minutes a defective valve on the hot water line. Those hold valve that you turn and have a gasket inside

Mar 18th, 2022 9:26 pm

MrFrugal1: Deal Addict; Jan 2, 2012; 4377 posts; 3551 upvotes; KINGSTON,ON

Mar 18th, 2022 9:26 pm

Motopp wrote: ↑
If partially close is there increased risk from doing this [bursting, leaking, etc.]?

No. It'll only restrict the volume of water flowing to your fixtures and appliances.
However, there is a possibility that the main shut off will leak around the valve stem (the part that is attached to the handle) if it hasn't been turned off and on regularly.

+1

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