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Buying/selling without realtor?

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Dec 10, 2008
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Dealmaker1945 wrote: To make it worse, the folks that are confident enough to buy without an agent are also financially savvy and want to save the commission that you were planning to put in your own pocket! I did it twice but next time I will consider an agent again.
Ah yes, my favorite: the unrepped "financially savvy" buyer who analyzes my house like it's a mission to the moon. Countless emails and measurements. Only for the wife to torpedo the deal on the first walk-through because she doesn't like the kitchen cabinets.
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Feb 17, 2015
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There are agents who charges 1% commission, of course less services. I would probably go that route than paying the full 2.5% commission.
Newbie
Aug 9, 2020
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Thanks for all your input!! man, i dont know what to do. You all made good points! I think cause i am not savvy with this, I will either do the buyer/seller realtor and just ask them to work for me(whatever house I chose) or look for a realtor for 1-2 %. My gf , the realtor i used for my current home, made 15000 off of me and she did absolutely nothing besides the paperwork afterwards. I found the listings and I chose the price ( she even almost got me paying 20 k more) . I am not saying realtors dont deserve the money but sorry, most of them dont nowadays and this is from seeing what my realtor friends do!! Anyways thanks for the input ! Why is buying a house in the GTA a bigger nightmare then ever before??
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Feb 25, 2004
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ESLL1226 wrote: Thanks for all your input!! man, i dont know what to do. You all made good points! I think cause i am not savvy with this, I will either do the buyer/seller realtor and just ask them to work for me(whatever house I chose) or look for a realtor for 1-2 %. My gf , the realtor i used for my current home, made 15000 off of me and she did absolutely nothing besides the paperwork afterwards. I found the listings and I chose the price ( she even almost got me paying 20 k more) . I am not saying realtors dont deserve the money but sorry, most of them dont nowadays and this is from seeing what my realtor friends do!! Anyways thanks for the input ! Why is buying a house in the GTA a bigger nightmare then ever before??
Your girlfriend is a realtor and made 15k off you? It might be time to re-think your relationship Winking Face
Try not! Do or do not, there is no try...
Deal Addict
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Jan 22, 2009
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You need a lawyer, instead of a salesman/realtor.

Back in the days maybe you need a realtor to access their "secret" DB. but now, these info are free.
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Oct 23, 2017
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RCGA wrote: Ah yes, my favorite: the unrepped "financially savvy" buyer who analyzes my house like it's a mission to the moon. Countless emails and measurements. Only for the wife to torpedo the deal on the first walk-through because she doesn't like the kitchen cabinets.
Yeah, been there. At my last private sale the buyers wanted an eleventh hour warranty on the stove which was only a few years old and pristine. I suggested they just turn on all the burners to verify they worked. They had a list of things like this suggested by their lawyer.

But one thing a private buyer is sure to have in mind is saving some or all of the commission for himself, by getting a lower price. I have been a private buyer as well as a private seller and that is certainly my mindset.

Sometimes the private seller has been so screwed around by agents and low ballers that he just wants to sell and prove to himself that he could do it. I once got a really good deal that way.
Newbie
Aug 9, 2020
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I actually didn't know you can negotiate percentage. Yes i am just that dumb when it comes to this crazy housing market. If I had, I would have asked for 2 at least. She did buy me a tv :) lol Shes generous so if i had to chose a friend to give that money too, it would be her..... but i would have liked it in my pocket more :) lol
Deal Guru
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Nov 18, 2005
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Kingston
Seller commissions should be something like
0.5% of the expected MV
+ 4% of any amount above that.
Buyers compensate their own agent.

The current system rewards the realtors for getting ANY deal done. A selling realtor is almost as well rewarded for getting a shitty price as they are for getting a great price.
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Apr 8, 2013
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Toronto
A close family friend and a relative both sold their homes in the GTA without an agent. These were dated bungalows that ended up being sold to builders. It was fairly straight forward. My relative listed her house with a flat fee listing service (it was under $700) on MLS with the caveat that the house needed a lot of work.

Most of the real estate agents that visited her house were friendly and professional. There was on exception but that’s to be expected in most occupations.

My relative never encountered a single agent that tried to solicit her business after listing the property through MLS. A word of caution: make sure that you consult with a professional to ensure that your complaint with the Covid-19 measures (i.e. ensuring that everyone wears masks, gloves, all surfaces are properly disinfected after each visit) if you're going to list without an agent.

It might be a different story, however, if your home is in move-in-condition and doesn’t require any upgrades. A listing agent could certainly add value by staging, marketing the property. There are a number of listing agents that will accept a 1.5% commission. At the same time, you’re still looking at paying $40,000 on a $1,000,000 home (assuming a buyer's agent's commission of 2.5%). That’s a lot of money for the service that’s being provided.
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Dec 4, 2009
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F22Raptor wrote: At the same time, you’re still looking at paying $40,000 on a $1,000,000 home (assuming a buyer's agent's commission of 2.5%). That’s a lot of money for the service that’s being provided.
Yup, too much, imo.

In todays market houses sell themselves, especially if you've got something decent. Compensation is out of whack.
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Lucky
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Feb 11, 2007
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CuriousJack wrote: There are agents who charges 1% commission, of course less services. I would probably go that route than paying the full 2.5% commission.
ESLL1226 wrote: I actually didn't know you can negotiate percentage. Yes i am just that dumb when it comes to this crazy housing market. If I had, I would have asked for 2 at least. She did buy me a tv :) lol Shes generous so if i had to chose a friend to give that money too, it would be her..... but i would have liked it in my pocket more :) lol
lol, she bought you a $500 TV with her $25k commission. I negotiated 1.5% for buying/selling agent on my last house sale, and the agent helped pack up the house and prep it for showing.
If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy.
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May 28, 2007
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Peterborough
Purchased our last 2 houses privately. No issues with either. Negotiations on both took no more then 20 minutes. We had a lawyer draw up the first one and we did the second one ourselves. Lawyers for both parties reviewed, gave their blessings, and the deals closed. We did try one other time but the seller seemed very shady when we presented our offer. We thanked him for his time and left. We are far from professional. These deals all took place over a 14 year period.
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Jul 7, 2017
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SW corner of the cou…
The amount of commissions a realtor has to pay to their agency is high. I think it is over half, possibly 60%, for a "normal" agency.

That's why a lot of realtors who can support themselves go with ReMax or some other umbrella that they have to pay less to.
I smile when I see container ships sailing past my house laden with stuff made in China
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Dec 4, 2009
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thriftshopper wrote: The amount of commissions a realtor has to pay to their agency is high. I think it is over half, possibly 60%, for a "normal" agency.

That's why a lot of realtors who can support themselves go with ReMax or some other umbrella that they have to pay less to.
Agreed, but 1.5% of $1mil is $15k.

40% of $15k is $6k.

$6k for what, 15-20hrs of work isn't commensurate with the effort involved. Houses are selling themselves these day ( and have been for many years now).

RE transaction payments need to switch to a flat fee arrangement. Try selling a house without offering the buyer agent their 2.5%. See how many walk-throughs you get. The system is rigged, and it's BS. Brokerages are a whole other level of BS.
"I'm a bit upset. I've been grab by the back without any alert and lubrification"
Lucky
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Jul 7, 2017
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Toukolou wrote: Agreed, but 1.5% of $1mil is $15k.

40% of $15k is $6k.

$6k for what, 15-20hrs of work isn't commensurate with the effort involved. Houses are selling themselves these day ( and have been for many years now).
it's like the other trades, have to support the back office, quoting work, travel time, time wasters (though I do believe fees should come down because people can use the internet to figure out what properties they want to see so realtors minimise show time) etc. Not least, a cartel that wants to protect its rates (look up the BC vet college witch hunt case against East Indian vets for fee cutting).
RE transaction payments need to switch to a flat fee arrangement. Try selling a house without offering the buyer agent their 2.5%. See how many walk-throughs you get. The system is rigged, and it's BS. Brokerages are a whole other level of BS.
Hence the "1%" outfits that offer some degree of advertising/marketing/promotion. Though sometimes you end up paying for poor service, whether expensive or "cheap".

Case in my for my most-recent house purchase.

It was an estate sale (though the brother of one of the owners was the executor). Listed with a high-end outfit (I think the original listing agent is just a pretty face) but didn't sell (or even get a nibble). Listed later, after some cosmetic and pest control work, with 1% (which, IRC, charges a minimum of $5k even for a dual agency), which we bought through (and yes, our agent wanted a higher fee, which he sort of earned - more later).

When doing the inspection, we were looking for water quality (house has a 10 tonne tank in the basement) as it was listed as having well (and trucked in) water. The stand-in (our agent was on a course) went next door and asked. Turns out the house only was using well water for a couple of years since completion (if at all) until municipal water was piped up the street, and it had municipal water for well over a decade at that time. If this was known to potential buyers, it probably would have sold on the first listing at the higher-original price.

Other inspection was the septic. Turns out the septic system, when we did the inspection, was not even connected and the sewage was just flowing down the hill. The seller (executor) didn't want to do the deal because he didn't want to negotiate on reduction for septic repair. Our realtor told him that since he knew there was an issue, he was now duty bound to disclose it (all the more so since the executor is a lawyer) so we managed to negotiate a reduction to the offer price amounting to 75% of the septic repair.
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Feb 25, 2004
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Toukolou wrote: RE transaction payments need to switch to a flat fee arrangement. Try selling a house without offering the buyer agent their 2.5%. See how many walk-throughs you get. The system is rigged, and it's BS. Brokerages are a whole other level of BS.
I could not agree more. The buyer realtor is supposed to work in the best interest of their clients but they won't show houses that won't get them a commission. So they work for their own interest first, the clients are secondary. On the other hand, you can't really expect them not get paid for their work.

On top of that, the buyer agent will show the house to their clients while it is the seller agent that actually knows all the details about the house.

The buyer realtor system is definitely broken. If buyer realtors were out of the system, it would start to get better (commissions still too high IMO but at least half of what they are).
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Dec 4, 2009
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I don't disagree, people absolutely have to be paid, and businesses need to make enough to cover their expenses.

But please, there isn't anywhere near $50k worth of work going into a $1mil sale, even combining both buying and selling sides. The realtors and brokerages that try to say otherwise are full of it.
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Lucky
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Dec 4, 2009
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Looking closer at the duties of brokerages, these places need to go the way of the dodo bird. If they were smart, they'd adjust to stay relevant, but I suspect greed will trump smarts.

There's no reason that agents can't do their job as independent contractors, without a brokerage affiliation.
"I'm a bit upset. I've been grab by the back without any alert and lubrification"
Lucky
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Aug 9, 2020
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Exactly. If i bought a home for 800 k, there is not enough work for them to do for 20k!! Sorry but 20 k could be a YEAR'S salary for a part timer or a person who cant find work. I am the one to look at listings and i will drive myself there and look at stats and get the lawyer, and the inspection done. What are they doing for 20k??? After talking to my husband, we are going to go for someone who offers a lower commission rate. We dont want to get ripped off or bypass important information. Plus we are selling our first home so we are clueless in that field too!

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