Dead/Malfunctioning APC Backup or Dead Battery?

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Jan 5th, 2017 2:01 pm

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Dec 29th, 2016 11:51 am

ChubChub [OP]: Deal Addict; Oct 9, 2010; 3153 posts; 1339 upvotes; Windsor

Dec 29th, 2016 11:51 am

Dead/Malfunctioning APC Backup or Dead Battery?

I bought a BR700G (says RS700 on the front, so it might be a "Pro" one, whatever that means) a lot of years ago; maybe 5-8? It works, but battery life is seemingly greatly diminished. Today I had a power outage of about 5 minutes, and it wasn't able to keep my PC, which draws about 30w, operating the whole time (LCD claims 38 minutes of runtime, presumably based off expected battery capacity).

Now, I was just going to get a new battery, since it's obviously due, but I've heard people replace the batteries, and it's just the unit that's dead. Is there a way to check if the unit is faulty? The replacement battery is around $35 all-in, where a replacement unit is around $180 all-in.

When power went out, the unit ran for maybe 4 minutes, then made some weird beeps, and quit. When power came back up, I started the PC, and battery capacity was indicated as being 12% or 15% or something like this. Since then, it's been a pretty steady climb, and it's at 59% right now.

The unit passes "self-test", but it isn't bitching about battery capacity, so I'm guessing it's self-test is pretty limited in it's diagnostic abilities.

One who is offended by truth, has no place among those who seek wisdom.

9 replies

Dec 29th, 2016 12:06 pm

doradxplorer: Sr. Member; Oct 1, 2009; 678 posts; 341 upvotes; West coast

Dec 29th, 2016 12:06 pm

You already answered your question. It's the batteries. They typically last 3-4 years to provide full backup.

Dec 29th, 2016 12:18 pm

ChubChub [OP]: Deal Addict; Oct 9, 2010; 3153 posts; 1339 upvotes; Windsor

Dec 29th, 2016 12:18 pm

doradxplorer wrote: ↑ You already answered your question. It's the batteries. They typically last 3-4 years to provide full backup.

Well, it seems like people have make the same conclusion as me: "power goes out, battery backup doesn't run long enough, needs a new battery", then after battery replacement, the unit still doesn't work. However, I've not read of anyone that tried to ensure the charging unit was operational before bothering to replace the battery (maybe most of these units don't indicate battery charge levels?).

What really makes me wonder is the fact that self-test is AOK. Self-test cuts the power, and sees if the battery keeps the PC running, and then comes back on. In that ~10 seconds, the battery level would drop a few % if my battery sucks, which I'd imagine the self-test could surmise "30w in 10 seconds drops the power by (say) 2%; battery capacity must be brutal", but it's not doing that. Maybe if I had a larger load on the device, it'd drop a lot more, and would trigger a fail.

One who is offended by truth, has no place among those who seek wisdom.

Dec 29th, 2016 1:44 pm

mrweather: Deal Guru; Aug 29, 2011; 11277 posts; 8466 upvotes; Mississauga

Dec 29th, 2016 1:44 pm

May be cheaper just to buy a whole ups.

Dec 31st, 2016 3:56 am

doradxplorer: Sr. Member; Oct 1, 2009; 678 posts; 341 upvotes; West coast

Dec 31st, 2016 3:56 am

Self test are not very precise. TRue battery test means a calling breasted meter, known load value, time and battery manufacturers specs. Usually battery cells (usually 6 per 12v block) show their fangs under stress. For all i know, your ups might only be reading voltage and if it is a percentage off, it could still consider it good.

Dec 31st, 2016 10:11 am

Faith24: Deal Addict; Feb 29, 2012; 2653 posts; 1461 upvotes; Richmond

Dec 31st, 2016 10:11 am

The battery will definitely be toast after "5-8" years, and the symptoms match that, so you don't really need to look for other causes. It's a routine-replacement item.

You don't have to replace the old battery with the exact same item. Sometimes you can fit a higher-capacity battery in the internal space available, as long as it's the same voltage and same type and will fit physically (even if you have to modify some plastic spacer tabs in the case). It will take longer to charge fully, but the charger is just a slow trickle-charger anyway, so the battery capacity doesn't matter over a wide range. The only concern would be that some UPS models are barely able to handle the internal heat buildup for the < 10 minutes they can provide full power, and extending that even to 15 minutes could be more heat buildup than they can take. Consider how close you are to using maximum power output in your scenario before upping the battery capacity.

Dec 31st, 2016 11:05 am

ROYinTO: Deal Fanatic; Dec 12, 2009; 6904 posts; 4213 upvotes; Toronto

Dec 31st, 2016 11:05 am

ChubChub wrote: ↑ Is there a way to check if the unit is faulty?

There is, not sure what it is though. I brought a unit to upsforless and they tested it while I was there. Said the inverter was gone.

When power went out, the unit ran for maybe 4 minutes, then made some weird beeps, and quit. When power came back up, I started the PC, and battery capacity was indicated as being 12% or 15% or something like this. Since then, it's been a pretty steady climb, and it's at 59% right now.

The unit passes "self-test", but it isn't bitching about battery capacity, so I'm guessing it's self-test is pretty limited in it's diagnostic abilities.

Your run times on battery might be preset. Have you looked at the settings in the powerchute software?
A drained battery can take up to 8 hours to fully charge.
If you are testing the battery before it is fully charged you may be shortening its lifespan.

FS 4 Mounted 245/65R17 Hakkapeliita R3 SUV on Honda Steelies with TPMS & more $650

Dec 31st, 2016 11:52 am

rageking: Deal Fanatic; Sep 4, 2009; 6575 posts; 726 upvotes

Dec 31st, 2016 11:52 am

The ups will recalibrate your battery's capacity every 2 weeks or so. Including if capacity went down. I don't believe your ups is broken - it's almost certainly the battery dying a slow death. When your battery completely fails to charge your unit will make a beeping sound, and likely a flashing light near the power button will turn on.

Jan 1st, 2017 1:07 pm

death_hawk: Deal Expert; Aug 22, 2006; 31370 posts; 17557 upvotes

Jan 1st, 2017 1:07 pm

ChubChub wrote: ↑ I bought a BR700G (says RS700 on the front, so it might be a "Pro" one, whatever that means) a lot of years ago; maybe 5-8?

Yeesh. 8 years?
I go through 4 battery changes in that time frame.

Do you not have anything else to do rather than argue with strangers on the internet

Nope. That's why I'm on the internet arguing with strangers. If I had anything better to do I'd probably be doing it.

Jan 5th, 2017 2:01 pm

ChubChub [OP]: Deal Addict; Oct 9, 2010; 3153 posts; 1339 upvotes; Windsor

Jan 5th, 2017 2:01 pm

Old battery was 7 or 8Ah, new one is apparently 9Ah. I pre-charged the battery with a trickle charger, installed it, and unplugged the battery backup from the wall. Got ~30 minutes of run time out of it, and it claimed 60% capacity still (not sure if it actually knows based on power usage and the theoretically-known battery capacity, or if it was based on Vdroop, so I've set my PC to turn off at 40% for now); fantastic!

I set a notification to replace the battery 3 years from now, so this won't happen again. Thanks everyone.

Previous battery replacement date was 11/21/2009 ... so just over 7 years; woops

One who is offended by truth, has no place among those who seek wisdom.

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