Students

Does years of study matter for undergrad?

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[OP]
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Jun 16, 2017
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Does years of study matter for undergrad?

I'm starting my first year at UTM for CompSci and I was wondering if staying at school for, "7 years" for undergrad would be a problem for hiring and job application and, in total; future? Would any one question it and does it damage the quality of my resume?
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Dec 7, 2009
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Considering most employers seem to struggle with asking for simple proof of degree, I'd say no.
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Feb 16, 2013
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The longer you are in school the older you get without jumping into the workforce.
Also the larger your OSAP becomes if you are on OSAP.

At a certain point you have to ask yourself; is this a benefit to me, or the the school?
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maybenotbutok wrote: I'm starting my first year at UTM for CompSci and I was wondering if staying at school for, "7 years" for undergrad would be a problem for hiring and job application and, in total; future? Would any one question it and does it damage the quality of my resume?
If you can code well, it's not going to matter at all. If you can code well, you can walk into your Google interview looking like you just rolled out of your dorm bedroom and have aspergers and they'll still hire you.

Focus on your coding ability and building high quality, intriguing software. Don't do it just to complete assignments, but to pursue interesting engineering projects. Code well and elite companies don't care due to the fact that most people can't code well.
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It will of course depends on the reason why it takes you twice the time. If you have a good one I don't think it will be a problem.

On the other hand I don't think most employers will see it as a 'positive'. An extra year is pretty common. Three extra years is a whole different story. Most employers can't help but to question whether you will handle your future job assignments the same way.

Time-to-market is the name of the game of today's industry. Most companies aren't investing in multi-years projects anymore. If it takes you significantly more time than others to deliver the same result (or even better result) you will have a hard time surviving in most high tech industries.
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When you graduate, you better have a good reason to explain to employers why it took 7 years. Your ability to learn would be in doubt.
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Aznsilvrboy wrote: When you graduate, you better have a good reason to explain to employers why it took 7 years. Your ability to learn would be in doubt.
Yes, come up with an elaborate explanation for the timeline, then watch in awe as they completely fail to do any sort of due diligence to prove you even have a degree.
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csi123 wrote: It will of course depends on the reason why it takes you twice the time. If you have a good one I don't think it will be a problem.

On the other hand I don't think most employers will see it as a 'positive'. An extra year is pretty common. Three extra years is a whole different story. Most employers can't help but to question whether you will handle your future job assignments the same way.

Time-to-market is the name of the game of today's industry. Most companies aren't investing in multi-years projects anymore. If it takes you significantly more time than others to deliver the same result (or even better result) you will have a hard time surviving in most high tech industries.
Aznsilvrboy wrote: When you graduate, you better have a good reason to explain to employers why it took 7 years. Your ability to learn would be in doubt.
It won't matter if he's a good programmer. A couple of impressive github projects, maybe a good rank on hackerrank, and it won't matter. I doubt it even comes up and if he does any excuse like, "I was discovering myself" would pass. Whether he passes or fails will depend on his technical interviewing ability. Unless he's a complete asshole, everything else won't matter at the top companies.
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[OP]
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Jun 16, 2017
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Thank you for your reply, but; do you know any real life cases/scenarios?
I'm asking this just to be sure and have total respect for your opinion, just so you know.
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Corner3 wrote: It won't matter if he's a good programmer. A couple of impressive github projects, maybe a good rank on hackerrank, and it won't matter. I doubt it even comes up and if he does any excuse like, "I was discovering myself" would pass. Whether he passes or fails will depend on his technical interviewing ability. Unless he's a complete *******, everything else won't matter at the top companies.
Good isn't good enough. Good programmers are plenty, and top companies don't just want good programmers. If he's so good and only goal is to get a job, he wouldn't need go to to university to begin with and then take 7 years to complete the program.
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Aznsilvrboy wrote: Good isn't good enough. Good programmers are plenty, and top companies don't just want good programmers. If he's so good and only goal is to get a job, he wouldn't need go to to university to begin with and then take 7 years to complete the program.
Good programmers are plenty? Not at all.

Amazon, Microsoft, Facebook, Google, Dropbox, Uber, Lyft have six digit job openings everyday (with great benefits and bonuses that take you over $200,000 if not far more after year 3, 4). The recruiters can't find enough qualified programmers to fill these spots.
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Corner3 wrote: Good programmers are plenty? Not at all.

Amazon, Microsoft, Facebook, Google, Dropbox, Uber, Lyft have six digit job openings everyday (with great benefits and bonuses that take you over $200,000 if not far more after year 3, 4). The recruiters can't find enough qualified programmers to fill these spots.
Those openings require more than just "good" which are few. Good is really just above average.
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Aznsilvrboy wrote: Those openings require more than just "good" which are few. Good is really just above average.
It's well known among those who conduct technical interviews that most people are just bad. Meaning, they can't even answer a simple fizzbuzz test. Some go even further and say most CS graduates can't program at all. https://blog.codinghorror.com/why-cant- ... s-program/
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Jan 14, 2010
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Many people just put the grad year on a resume, so a potential employer wouldn't even notice. For example:

Education
Bachelor of Science (Computer Science) 2025
University of Toronto
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As someone who used to do team lead/hiring for a small software development shop... Given two equal candidates, I'd lean towards the one who didn't take almost twice as long to complete their degree. If there wasn't a good reason for it, it would demonstrate a potential lack of focus, work ethic, interest, etc. Strong CS skills are good, but software development projects have more than enough issues meeting deadlines without throwing in a developer who can't stay on task.

Having a good reason may be having to work while going to school, family issues, even taking a semester or two off to travel. Going slow because you can't keep up or can't be bothered to put in an effort would not be a good reason.

Just my $0.02. Oh, and yes, most people just seem to put in the graduation year. But for people looking for a job just out of university, your transcripts are also important (since you don't have any real work experience, typically), and they will show the timeline.

C
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CNeufeld wrote: As someone who used to do team lead/hiring for a small software development shop... Given two equal candidates, I'd lean towards the one who didn't take almost twice as long to complete their degree. If there wasn't a good reason for it, it would demonstrate a potential lack of focus, work ethic, interest, etc. Strong CS skills are good, but software development projects have more than enough issues meeting deadlines without throwing in a developer who can't stay on task.

Having a good reason may be having to work while going to school, family issues, even taking a semester or two off to travel. Going slow because you can't keep up or can't be bothered to put in an effort would not be a good reason.

Just my $0.02. Oh, and yes, most people just seem to put in the graduation year. But for people looking for a job just out of university, your transcripts are also important (since you don't have any real work experience, typically), and they will show the timeline.

C
I wouldn't know about small Canadian software development shops. I worked at a Fortune 50 company that does not recruit out of Canadian universities and a major, and a tech/software company with market cap of over $20 billion.

Neither one asked me for my transcript. I've interviewed at other similar companies and none of them did. Some of my friends have been asked for their transcripts at similarly situated companies (after being hired, for data collection purposes). I know 1 person that went from a Fortune 50 tech company to a small software development company (would be considered large in Canada), and they asked for her grades and she refused, and they offered her anyways (she refused the offer).

Small software firms are full of nepotism anyways. They probably don't even have a real HR department.

If you've been asked for your transcript, you probably didn't do so well on your interview. If you did well on your technical interview, you shouldn't have to worry about that.
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