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Edward Snowden is the NSA whistleblower

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Jimbobs wrote: I absolutely agree with everything you've written after "It kind of does ..." but it has absolutely nothing to do with "right" or "left". In reality, there are many shades across the political spectrum and those who try to reduce it to "right" or "left" are just trying to prevent the voter from seeing, or analyzing, the nuances of the argument.

As far as I am concerned, Obama's failure to keep his promise to close the Guantanamo Bay Concentration Camp tells the full story about him and his ineptness.
While there are many shades to a political spectrum, it is reduced to right and left in the US. Theres only 2 names on the ballot.
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Feb 26, 2003
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Jimbobs wrote: I absolutely agree with everything you've written after "It kind of does ..." but it has absolutely nothing to do with "right" or "left". In reality, there are many shades across the political spectrum and those who try to reduce it to "right" or "left" are just trying to prevent the voter from seeing, or analyzing, the nuances of the argument.

As far as I am concerned, Obama's failure to keep his promise to close the Guantanamo Bay Concentration Camp tells the full story about him and his ineptness.
I don't think we're really disagreeing here. I just used the generic terms for the dems and repubs. The dems want your guns, the repubs want your porn, and they both want to know what you had for breakfast. Screw em both.
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The scumbags at fox news are now saying they need to bring back the death penalty for this case.

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Piro21 wrote: This started under Bush, and is being supported by both parties.
?

It started under Truman.
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stealth wrote: It kind of does...The American public were basically sold a bill of goods that Obama will be so very different from the previous regime..."Change" Hope" blah,blah, blah...and in turn they got someone who pretty much slammed Bush while campaigning but continues on in the same freedom-usurping ways. people should be angry about deception from their leaders.
All you had to do was have a look at his cabinet after the first election to realize it was very much more of the same.
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Jul 5, 2004
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I have a hard time caring about this for several reasons.

1. I have never assumed that any form of communication is secure, let alone e-mail. There's no such thing.
2. I've always assumed government snoop on us more than we will ever know
3. I'm a nobody to the US and Canadian governments and they don't give a crap what I write or who I talk to. I do nothing that would cause me to be on their radar.
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Dec 19, 2001
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I'm surprised this is even news. What did people think the NSA did? Even the MSM have been saying this is what they're up to. But hey, I finally have a facebook friend who's becoming famous, guess he'll be kicking me to "like" anyday now. ;)

Oh, this explains the benefit at around 4 minutes in:

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Aug 30, 2011
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I'm actually glad that no one sees this as a big deal.

In fact, I think that they should even take it one step further. We should have cameras in our homes and bedrooms, as well as wiretaps. This can prevent alot of domestic abuse cases, as well as, most importantly, child abuse. Of course, it will be just metadata, so it's not like CSIS will be looking at what you are doing in the bedroom, only if you are under suspicion. This can get rid of Child Assault overnight!

Personally, I have nothing to hide.
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Apr 4, 2004
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popcorneater wrote: I'm actually glad that no one sees this as a big deal.

In fact, I think that they should even take it one step further. We should have cameras in our homes and bedrooms, as well as wiretaps. This can prevent alot of domestic abuse cases, as well as, most importantly, child abuse. Of course, it will be just metadata, so it's not like CSIS will be looking at what you are doing in the bedroom, only if you are under suspicion. This can get rid of Child Assault overnight!

Personally, I have nothing to hide.
I flip flop on this all the time. On one hand, I want my children and loved one's to have the freedom to not fear predators/terrorists who may harm them. On the other hand, I want freedom to develop my own opinions of whatever observations I make without fear of the government punishing me. I don't care about having privacy to do whatever I want in the bedroom. Does that make me an exhibitionist? =)

I know I'm in the minority, but I think what Edward Snowden did was wrong. He was hired in good faith by his employer (NSA) and he knew full well what his job would entail. He reaped many benefits from this job and only gave it up when he finally decided to grow a conscience (or became disenchanted with his lifestyle). IMO, he should have voiced his opinions within the NSA (not in a manner to get shot of course) and tried to be a voice of reason within. Instead, he goes and does something illegal that simply provokes these organizations, in the process making a name for himself.

Oh, and yeah, there's no surprise with what he's disclosed.

btw, how does he know he can trust the food from room service?
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popcorneater wrote: I'm actually glad that no one sees this as a big deal.

In fact, I think that they should even take it one step further. We should have cameras in our homes and bedrooms, as well as wiretaps. This can prevent alot of domestic abuse cases, as well as, most importantly, child abuse. Of course, it will be just metadata, so it's not like CSIS will be looking at what you are doing in the bedroom, only if you are under suspicion. This can get rid of Child Assault overnight!

Personally, I have nothing to hide.
You have nothing to hide until someone misconstrues your words or actions then suddenly removes your frights/freedoms. In a perfect world, yes, surveillance shouldn't be a big deal, but the world (and law enforcement agencies etc) are far from perfect.
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rommelrommel wrote: I don't think we're really disagreeing here. I just used the generic terms for the dems and repubs. The dems want your guns, the repubs want your porn, and they both want to know what you had for breakfast. Screw em both.
haha well put.
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stealth wrote: You have nothing to hide until someone misconstrues your words or actions then suddenly removes your frights/freedoms. In a perfect world, yes, surveillance shouldn't be a big deal, but the world (and law enforcement agencies etc) are far from perfect.
lolz, so you're saying that I might be reported because someone saw me arguing with my wife, and that would be grounds for CSIS to look at the video of our private moments in our bedroom? That will never happen. It's just metadata. The government will use it responsibly and only after exhausting all other options. They are trust worthy people. Besides, if I was accused of anything, I would be given a fair trial to explain what happened. Not like they're going to detain me indefinitely!

Like I said I have nothing to hide. But I bet those Brownies and child abusers would be scared though to even THINK of commiting a crime.

Again, we need to email our MP's and let them know that we need this type of surveillance here. Especially in our own homes!
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mjl_toronto wrote: I know I'm in the minority, but I think what Edward Snowden did was wrong. He was hired in good faith by his employer (NSA) and he knew full well what his job would entail. He reaped many benefits from this job and only gave it up when he finally decided to grow a conscience (or became disenchanted with his lifestyle). IMO, he should have voiced his opinions within the NSA (not in a manner to get shot of course) and tried to be a voice of reason within. Instead, he goes and does something illegal that simply provokes these organizations, in the process making a name for himself.

Oh, and yeah, there's no surprise with what he's disclosed.
If there's no surprise and everyone knew it was going on but had no proof, then why do you think it was wrong that he provided proof to peoples' suspicions?

To assume that anyone can effectively address a possibly politically explosive practice only internally, whether it's within a tiny private business or gigantic intelligence organization, is very misguided. Anyone who's tried to reason with unethical or simply poor management decisions within an organization knows that at times this is simply not possible. We don't know if he didn't try to address it internally anyway. It's irrelevant, but we also don't know. All things considered, I think you're expecting an employee of only 3 months to achieve a massive change in philosophy with an incredibly powerful spy agency, what most people can't even achieve on a day-to-day basis with a normal employer. When he decided that he did not agree with their practices and would do something about it, he really had no choice but to become a whistleblower.

He likely broke the law as it currently stands in the US. However, it is wrong to not differentiate between morality and law. They are not necessarily in agreement, and very often conflict. It's irrelevant whether he broke the law. What matters is whether the practices of the NSA, CIA, et al are crushing freedoms and beginning on a path of societal control. Honestly, I don't know the answer to that, but I certainly do not think he did this to gain fame or fortune or out of vengeance. The only logical motive here is that he truly believed what he did was a "net benefit" to his country.

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