Financial Independence, Retire Early (F.I.R.E)

Cash out of big cities e.g. GTA, GVA and move to a smaller town (but big enough for you to find similar work, even if lower pay but better work/life balance; e.g. 10 minute commute vs 75 minute)

faken wrote: ↑ Hi,

I'm wondering if anyone on this forum is doing this movement.

https://www.daveramsey.com/blog/what-is ... e-movement

The two years has really got me thinking about wanting to retire early. What are some methods some of you are doing to get to your goal quicker?

become the boss, work 2 hours a day, from wherever you want, golf everyday and in winters , spend half your day in RFD because you can't be in Florida.....never retire...but dont work either.

I have been at this life for over 6 years ..since I reached the age of 50

cardguy wrote: ↑ become the boss, work 2 hours a day, from wherever you want, golf everyday and in winters , spend half your day in RFD because you can't be in Florida.....never retire...but dont work either.

I have been at this life for over 6 years ..since I reached the age of 50

Wow..and congratulations. But do tell the secret formula for others to practise the same!

Find ways to enjoy cheap hobbies. Not only are you able to save money faster because you're not spending it, but you're lowering the amount of money you'd actually need in order to retire - you need less to maintain your lifestyle.

Even better, find ways to enjoy cheap hobbies that actually save you money. Example: if your hobby is gardening and you find ways to take pride in and enjoy growing amazing vegetables. So you're enjoying yourself spending very little and reducing your food budget.

Or you enjoy older cars and you do a bunch of the maintenance yourself. Granted, you can blow through some cash buying parts, but if you pick the right car the parts aren't even very expensive. Sure if you're not a master mechanic it might take you days or weeks to do a job that a shop could do in a few hours, but so what? If it's your hobby and you're working on a car you like, the fact that it takes you weeks to get anything done just sort of limits how much you can actually be spending on parts anyway.

Same thing but doing home improvements. Learn to do the work yourself (youtube) and figure out every step that goes into a job you need to do. Make sure you know it so well that you can do a good job of it. Instead of spending thousands hiring contractors and seeing the job magically done in a day, you spend weeks thinking about it, researching it, and working on it (time where you're too busy to spend money on other random crap) and in the end you do the job yourself and save thousands. Your house value goes up too because you did a good job of the project.

Do things for yourself, not for others. Don't be an NPC. Think about what you like and why you like it. Think about what you want to do and why you want to do it. Stop spending money on things you don't need/want to impress people you don't like. Stop spending money on things just because you see everyone else spending money on those things and everyone does it. What really matters to you? What really makes your life better in your own opinion? What brings you lasting satisfaction and happiness? Stop spending money on everything else, you don't need to. Ask yourself these sorts of questions, but don't just blurt out the first thing that comes to your mind (because that first thing is quite possibly the thing you've learned to say, not the thing that is actually true). I mean, don't be that guy that says they need millions because they want to do this list of <everything that everyone always says they need millions of dollars for> because if your list happens to be the same as what you see on TV all the time, what you hear from everyone else, etc then probably that's not really your list - you need to think longer and harder about your own list. Most of the stuff on your own real legitimate list probably isn't that expensive. Some things will be, but those things will be things that really matter to you, and if you spend less on everything else you'll be able to afford the couple of expensive things that you genuinely care about.

BTW, FIRE typically has one I

Much easier to accomplish if you find a partner with similar values. Splitting things like electricity, rent, car etc.. goes a long way.
Most of "Retirement Planning" depends on the lifestyle you want. Something else to consider is that if you leave the workforce, it will be difficult to come back and think you deserve a competitive salary. I would say the best way to achieve this is to
1) Split expenses with a partner
2) Become really good at something, where you can make 100k+ a year
3) Invest 100% of leftover money
4) Live well under your means, if you need a car buy a Toyota Camry, learn to enjoy the simple things in life.
5) Owning your property helps, as once it's paid off life becomes 50%+ cheaper
6) Don't be in a rush to pay off good debt. Ex, if you have a mortgage @ 1.5%, make minimum payments and invest the rest. If the rates increase to 5%+, then shift payments into reducing that debt

Quentin5 wrote: ↑ BTW, FIRE typically has one I

Good catch! lol. I was on my phone writing this.

faken wrote: ↑ Good catch! lol. I was on my phone writing this.

I was hoping you found a way to have double independence and would share that secret with us

The best way to do this is to learn to live cheap, cheaper, cheapest. Start today and start cutting as many of those frills and things that aren't needed. That is money that you can now save and you don't need to save for in the future and that you won't spend in the future.

The less you will spend in retirement, the less you need to have before you get there
The less you need, the less you have to save today, tomorrow, next month, next year, etc...and the less rate of return you need to earn.

Last thing you need and sometimes the most importance is LUCK.
Some of the ppl who are living this way were just lucky...right time, right place
>> working for a tech company and getting stock and holding that stock as it went up, up up.
>>inheritances, lottery, buying a house at the right time in the right place, buying the right stock and not getting scared to hold rather than selling early.

sprinter wrote: ↑ Wow..and congratulations. But do tell the secret formula for others to practise the same!

whatever job you choose to do, Just be a pro at it, from top to bottom, then, don't be afraid to move for an opportunity to be the boss...its all about number$,

porticoman2 wrote: ↑ what is there to say about FIRE that has not been said in hundreds of blogs.

Sometimes people want a more personal discussion rather than read google till your brain turns to mush.
Oh and Ramsay is not someone who i would want to idolize.

porticoman2 wrote: ↑ what is there to say about FIRE that has not been said or written in hundreds of blogs or media.

my two bits in a nutshell ... have enough non-investment income or a zillion dollars in your treasury that allows you to never ever punch a clock or be answerable to anyone .... including a partner/spouse.

with enough money or income that will last till you take your last breath.

in other words .... read every blog out there, find the bits that you can use, adapt them to your own FIRE ... its that easy & no, there isn't a one for all FIRE fit.

specifically on Dave Ramsey ... whatever he did to get to FIRE, copy it.

Dave's estimated net worth $475 US million

read this

https://www.nashvillescene.com/news/art ... ng-to-dave

Dave did not fire he runs quite a large business... I mean yeah he has f u money and does what he loves but he is not retired by any means.

Basically you want enough money to live on so you don't have to work again.

Many have stated that a 4% withdrawal rate would do it and if you reduce your expenses save up till you have 25x your expenses and your good to go.
Its not this simple. The market goes up and down and if you withdraw when its down you compound your loses.
25x may not be enough.

Cutting expenses is great but if after you cut to the bone you have unforeseen expenses that rise in time your screwed. Such as medical expenses, nursing home, kids, family, house repairs or moving and so forth. You need to plan a buffer. And if inflation does rise above your expected rate you can be screwed. Plus if you quit your skills get rusty and getting a job after being out of the market for years or decades is tricky.

That said FIRE is actually possible, but i would aim for a fair bit more than 25x, i would plan for higher inflation and i would invest very, very carefully. And you might consider part time or lateral career moves. Its great to not have to work but what will you do with your time. Its great to not live paycheck to paycheck but if you cut spending to the bone you give up on a lot of living. So so achieve FIRE i would look very carefully at all the facets and make a very safe plan, not to say you should not do it but don't go into it with rose coloured glasses.

And if you don't achieve FIRE you can still achieve a great deal, a more lavish regular retirement, not living paycheck to paycheck so if you lose you job you can take a sabbatical, you are not beholden to a toxic workplace or overwork, you can be choosy in what jobs you accept, you can not worry about debt because cutting expenses but not giving up on living means no worrying about the bills, you can buy cars and big expenses with cash and so forth.

So frankly everyone should aspire to FIRE, but don't jump the gun prematurely.

Make a plan. Follow plan.

Spiritwalker2222 wrote: ↑ Make a plan. Follow plan.

Many people plan to win the lottery. It is a surprisingly common yet very sad "retirement plan".
Is this good enough?

porticoman2 wrote: ↑ want or need ...

You could go homeless and become a breatharian but realistically you should aim for a reasonable standard of living.

have you reached FIRE yourself?

I have not, but being prudent is always good advice.

porticoman2 wrote: ↑ do you have a plan or target age when you will reach fire?

if so, would you care to share any of your specific plans/targets/goals?

I plan to win the lottery in 2022

But until then recommendations are to reduce spending, increase income and invest aggressively.

One needs to make sure they have an accounting of their spending, trimming the fat and many sources recommend investing 50-75% of your income while you are still working. I would suggest using your RRSPs and TFSAs. First then max out your RRSPs and put your most aggressive investments in your TFSAs. Which you would invest aggressively as well. That said one should always have some liquid low risk investments as well. Once you retire early start drawing from the RRSPs because your tax bracket will be lower while adding each year to your TFSAs. I would plan how much to withdraw each year to optimize taxation.

The reason you want to know your spending is not only to reduce spending so that you can bulk up your savings but to know where money goes, what the likely future levels will be and to plan for emergencies. And to plan recreational spending, reducing that to zero would make for a miserable life. Also artificially low spending can come back and bite you in the rear end. Many people seem to end up working part time or switching careers or volunteering after they FIRE, watching paint dry for the rest of your life is not much fun.

Also one has to take into account and plan for life changes, marriage, children, injury, disability etc.

IMO 4% is not the best withdrawal rate because the market is not entirely predictable plus after you retire your locked in and financial blows will hit twice as hard. Also one has to take into account inflation, which is a much bigger deal when your retired for longer than standard.

I seem to be writing a novel, perhaps i should author and publish the Quentin5 guide to FIRE planning

Does the OP have specific questions?

I feel like I'm "chicken fire" because I have enough savings to cover my very low expenses for 35 years if I don't make any returns (i.e. just capital). (Alternatively the 4% rule would be above that income figure, if there are any returns.) But I'd like to have a nice retirement and could have a pension at 55 so... it doesn't make sense to stop unless I hate my job. But if I lost my job, I'd be very tempted to do that.

Biggest one for me is to cooking at home instead of going out to eat. The ingredients needed to make something you might buy at a restaurant only makes up about 20-25% of the actual price you pay. That $15 pasta dish you might pay at a restaurant probably only cost max $3-$4 worth of ingredients. Think about what that might look like over a whole month if you eat out on average once a day. Could work out to be a few hundred bucks a month. Given the types of people who work as line cooks at these restaurant, really anyone can learn to do it themselves.