Shopping Discussion

The GST and PST will it ever go away?

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  • Jan 30th, 2009 7:03 pm
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Deal Expert
Mar 23, 2004
27627 posts
7976 upvotes
r00t_decision wrote: Never gonna happen? Sorry that's a little naive.
ROTFLMFAO. :lol: I'm the one being naive? Okay there n00b. :rolleyes: You cross your fingers and wait for ON's PST to be abolished. Good luck with that! :lol: You let me know how that works out for you.
[OP]
Member
Dec 9, 2008
352 posts
40 upvotes
ES_Revenge wrote: ROTFLMFAO. :lol: I'm the one being naive? Okay there n00b. :rolleyes: You cross your fingers and wait for ON's PST to be abolished. Good luck with that! :lol: You let me know how that works out for you.
Things are just flying over your head huh.I didn't say it would be abolished or hope it doesn't go away. I understand that the percentage of taxes go other things. Here let me answer like the other guy and call out my own pwnage.

Here I'll be just like everyone else on the internet. Here we go, it's coming, the response is there, almost ready............ here we go:
lulz, pure pwnage.
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Mar 12, 2005
9782 posts
1859 upvotes
Victoria
I think lowering the GST was a bad idea. It barely makes a dent in the avarge canadian's yearly income, but it makes a huge debt in government revenues. The liberals used to lowball their budgets, have huge surpluses, and repay the debt. The conservatives chipped away at those surpluses, cutting gst, a few spending initiatives here and there, lowering the ability for the budget to weather a bad economy (albeit they didn't do it nearly as bad as the US, Clinton left a surplus, but W ran it into a defecit, and they were running a defecit the whole time the economy was hot, which is really bad).

With the baby boomers close to retirement, alot of the borrowing will have to be paid back by gen x and y. I think its an unfair burden.. just my opinion.

Allthough if they wanted to raise income tax and abolish the gst/pst's i'd be for that. I'd like to go in a store and just pay what it says on the sign. If they want to forego sales tax, they'd have to make it somewhere else. I'd be cool if they just recovered it through income tax. It'd probably cost the government and companies less dollars to deal with one form of tax over 2 or 3.
Deal Expert
Mar 23, 2004
27627 posts
7976 upvotes
r00t_decision wrote: Things are just flying over your head huh.
:confused: Huh? No I said was in ON the PST is never going to go away (the question you asked in the thread title); then you told me that I was being naive :rolleyes: You are the one that asked if it will ever go away, not me. You keep holding your breath there dude. My money (if I was putting money on it) would definitely be on PST not going anywhere in this province.

So no things are not flying over my head they are just way above your level, clearly.

r00t_decision wrote: I didn't say it would be abolished or hope it doesn't go away. I understand that the percentage of taxes go other things. Here let me answer like the other guy and call out my own pwnage.

Here I'll be just like everyone else on the internet. Here we go, it's coming, the response is there, almost ready............ here we go:
lulz, pure pwnage.
I haven't got a clue WTF you're going on about but I'm just about through with this [extremely low] level of "conversation". It's a waste of my time and everyone else's and since you want to be a troll about it, I'll just add you to my ignore list.

I will wish you good luck with those taxes "going away".

Goodbye.
[OP]
Member
Dec 9, 2008
352 posts
40 upvotes
ES_Revenge wrote: :confused: Huh? No I said was in ON the PST is never going to go away (the question you asked in the thread title); then you told me that I was being naive :rolleyes: You are the one that asked if it will ever go away, not me. You keep holding your breath there dude. My money (if I was putting money on it) would definitely be on PST not going anywhere in this province.

So no things are not flying over my head they are just way above your level, clearly.

I haven't got a clue WTF you're going on about but I'm just about through with this [extremely low] level of "conversation". It's a waste of my time and everyone else's and since you want to be a troll about it, I'll just add you to my ignore list.

I will wish you good luck with those taxes "going away".

Goodbye.
Such a typical response, honestly. And you weren't trolling with your latest post? I'm confusing you because you were saying stupid things, so I could only respond in a stupid fashion to you. I thought you were actually one of the normal ones, until you went "rofl on me" So spare me your bull. I'm not even attempting to converse with you in pure discussion because, you make it plainly obvious it's not worth time. Now post #48 is worth my time, because it adds value to the thread and discussion. How simple is that to understand or is that over your head or way above your level?

Honestly I don't even think you have followed other things I've said in this thread, other than going with the thread title or first post. I hope you ignore me, because you seem to be ignoring things I'm writing.
Deal Addict
User avatar
Sep 3, 2006
4590 posts
1573 upvotes
Sales tax should not be eliminated or reduced, they should be raised. They are based upon consumption.

Payroll taxes should be dropped significantly, therefore offsetting the increase.

Give sales tax credits to those in lower income brackets, and revel in a simplistic, easy to understand, tax code.
[OP]
Member
Dec 9, 2008
352 posts
40 upvotes
zod wrote: I think lowering the GST was a bad idea. It barely makes a dent in the avarge canadian's yearly income, but it makes a huge debt in government revenues. The liberals used to lowball their budgets, have huge surpluses, and repay the debt. The conservatives chipped away at those surpluses, cutting gst, a few spending initiatives here and there, lowering the ability for the budget to weather a bad economy (albeit they didn't do it nearly as bad as the US, Clinton left a surplus, but W ran it into a defecit, and they were running a defecit the whole time the economy was hot, which is really bad).

With the baby boomers close to retirement, alot of the borrowing will have to be paid back by gen x and y. I think its an unfair burden.. just my opinion.

Allthough if they wanted to raise income tax and abolish the gst/pst's i'd be for that. I'd like to go in a store and just pay what it says on the sign. If they want to forego sales tax, they'd have to make it somewhere else. I'd be cool if they just recovered it through income tax. It'd probably cost the government and companies less dollars to deal with one form of tax over 2 or 3.
jcon wrote: Sales tax should not be eliminated or reduced, they should be raised. They are based upon consumption.

Payroll taxes should be dropped significantly, therefore offsetting the increase.

Give sales tax credits to those in lower income brackets, and revel in a simplistic, easy to understand, tax code.
Thank you for your generous responses, and I concour. In the article I forwarded (this one here), they mention excise taxes like the GST has been lowered, and the only thing beneficial would be lowering income taxes.
Deal Expert
May 30, 2005
44550 posts
5115 upvotes
Richmond Hill
r00t_decision wrote: Thank you for your generous responses, and I concour. In the article I forwarded (this one here), they mention excise taxes like the GST has been lowered, and the only thing beneficial would be lowering income taxes.
But I thought you don't want sales tax?
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Sr. Member
Jan 25, 2007
925 posts
58 upvotes
"where the tax is absorbed in the price of goods."

aka: hidden. I'd rather know what tax I'm paying.

"I've been to third world countries. The spending and living can be better in most cases than Canada"

Please.

"You want to know where the money goes?

1. Education"

For some... not enough. (Sorry I had to!)

"I didn't exect (sic) this place to have trolls"

"Why are, we, as Canadians still be charged these stupid taxes?"

Yeah.... no TROLL here.

Nuff feeding the trolls.

What is Troll?

An Internet troll, or simply troll in Internet slang, is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum or chat room, with the intention of provoking other users into an emotional response[1] or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion.[2]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet)
Deal Addict
Dec 28, 2006
2373 posts
64 upvotes
Saskatoon
r00t_decision wrote: The US many be running deficits, but so do many other countries. The US also has a large reserve to help it. This critical point in time where they are, has been dealt before.
"reserve"? what reserve?

They haven't had a balanced budget since Clinton, and they only called it balanced because they "forgot" to include the unfunded liabilities in Social Security and Medicare/medicaid.

If former Comptroller General David Walker is right, by the time current college grads retire the only thing the US gov't will be able to afford is Social Security and some Medicare. Nothing else. No national defence, no infrastructure, nothing.

$10 trillion in debt plus the unfunded liabilities gets you about $50 trillion.


The US debt to GDP ratio is just slightly lower than Canada's, but only because they don't include the unfunded liabilities.


As long as there is deficit spending and/or national debt, tax cuts today are nothing more than a deferred tax increase.
[OP]
Member
Dec 9, 2008
352 posts
40 upvotes
Jon Lai wrote: But I thought you don't want sales tax?
I mention that's what the article says. However, I will comprise if our Income taxes our lower, since it's been a while since they have been lowered.
ghostryder wrote: "reserve"? what reserve?

If former Comptroller General David Walker is right, by the time current college grads retire the only thing the US gov't will be able to afford is Social Security and some Medicare. Nothing else. No national defence, no infrastructure, nothing.
Here
(Particularly read it's mission goal and it's criticism) It it was for the reserve, there would be no bail outs, and the US would be in a financially more distraught scenario then they are now.
"If he..." You can throw that out with all the other "If.. " scenario's I heard.

How about this if........ "If someone predicted this economic downturn of late `08"
Deal Addict
Aug 5, 2004
1030 posts
18 upvotes
Riffer wrote: Personally, I would rather have higher excise taxes and lower income taxes. PST and GST penalize spending, while income tax penalizes working and saving.
Yes, Canada has very high income taxes AND sales taxes.
Deal Addict
Aug 5, 2004
1030 posts
18 upvotes
xstatik wrote: I would actually prefer the European system where the tax is absorbed in the price of goods. Makes calculations easier and I find that many cases, manufacturers and retailers will end up absorbing some of the tax in the prices they charge.
You must be young. Canada had tits version of the VAT until about 15 years ago. It was sales taxed placed on goods at the manufacturing level. I think it was 9% or something. And yeah, you never saw it because it was built into the price.

The problem is that because a tax like that is invisible, the government can easily raise wit without causing public furor. Proponents of the GST correctly wanted a tax that was 100% visible, so everyone would know exactly what the government was extracting from them. I agree with this philosophy. No hidden VAT, please.
Deal Addict
Aug 5, 2004
1030 posts
18 upvotes
ghostryder wrote:
As long as there is deficit spending and/or national debt, tax cuts today are nothing more than a deferred tax increase.
Typical NDP think. The government knows better what top do with your money than you do. And lets take more money out of the economy when it might be spent productively and waste it on nonproductive projects like bilingualism, multiculturslism, summer camps for abused women and the other pantheon of do-gooder projects.

And let's penalize people for working hard and taking risk and trying to get ahead. I used to make extra money working extra hours but gave up when I discovered at after the various taxes I had to pay I was actually taking home 33% of what I made.
Deal Addict
Mar 14, 2005
1793 posts
40 upvotes
Eyeman wrote: You must be young. Canada had tits version of the VAT until about 15 years ago. It was sales taxed placed on goods at the manufacturing level. I think it was 9% or something. And yeah, you never saw it because it was built into the price.

The problem is that because a tax like that is invisible, the government can easily raise wit without causing public furor. Proponents of the GST correctly wanted a tax that was 100% visible, so everyone would know exactly what the government was extracting from them. I agree with this philosophy. No hidden VAT, please.
What I've noticed is that at European based stores in Canada (Zara for example), many items have prices ticketed in Euro and Cdn $, what I've noticed is that the Euro price once converted to the Canadian price, tends to be the same. The differnce however, is that the Euro price includes the VAT while the Canadian price, of course you have to add GST and PST on it.

I've also noticed this in comparision shopping in going to Europe and comparing to Canadian prices (after accounting for exchange rate of course)

By including the GST and PST in pricing, there is more of a tendancy for retailers and manufacturers to swallow part of the cost in their course of competitive business, with the tax being separate, the retailers and manufacturers won't touch it as it's not their problem.

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