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Has anyone applied to CSIS for intelligence Officer?

Newbie
Sep 13, 2019
11 posts
13 upvotes
burnt69 wrote: I remember talking to the recruiter for CSIS, and they started people out all at the same salary, no matter if they did a 3-year Arts degree, or a full-fledged engineering degree. Whether they brought special language skills to the table (ie: Arabic, etc.) or not.
There was no flexibility whatsoever.

Can't believe that cr*p-show received 40,000 resumes. Must be a lot of naive kids out there.

It's worse. A 24 year old university Arts grad will get the same starting salary and early career progression timeline as a 40 year old with an MBA and 10+ years of management experience. While waiting 1-2 years to be hired. Any other career track other than IO is a dead end relegated to support roles. Then both will have to learn french and retest (every 5 years?) even though they will never use it.
Newbie
Sep 13, 2019
11 posts
13 upvotes
burnt69 wrote: I remember talking to the recruiter for CSIS, and they started people out all at the same salary, no matter if they did a 3-year Arts degree, or a full-fledged engineering degree. Whether they brought special language skills to the table (ie: Arabic, etc.) or not.
There was no flexibility whatsoever.

Can't believe that cr*p-show received 40,000 resumes. Must be a lot of naive kids out there.

Unfortunately, It seems the account of Twitter contributor @csisprocess has been unceremoniously disappeared (This account doesn’t exist).

Something or Someone must have Spooked @csisprocess.

Just as he or she was getting to the juicy details of the outcome of their interview. Perhaps he or she was finally hired and had to suddenly delete their account. Or perhaps he or she said a bit too much...

You can see what little is left of it in the cached version:

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s ... sisprocess
Penalty Box
Jul 13, 2012
7251 posts
983 upvotes
Ottawa
1990sTech wrote: Interesting older article. Not much (if anything) has changed since...just posting it here in case it disappears.

CSIS urged to end polygraph testing
Andrew Mitrovica
Toronto
Published June 12, 2000
Updated April 3, 2018

Canada's intelligence service should abolish the use of polygraph testing because the device is unreliable and has lost its scientific credibility, says the former head of the agency's polygraph unit.

"I agree it should be abolished if it is not done properly and I am not convinced that it is being done properly just about anywhere, including at CSIS," said Brian Lynch, a former chief psychologist at the Canadian Security Intelligence Service.

Mr. Lynch said last week in an interview with The Globe and Mail that CSIS managers pressed him to divulge employees' confidential medical and psychological information.

One of the agencies acting as a watchdog for Canada's intelligence service says the allegations are a grave matter which could trigger a formal inquiry.

"It's obviously a very serious allegation to make," Maurice Archdeacon, the Canadian Security Intelligence Service's Inspector-General, said in a recent interview.

Mr. Archdeacon, who reports to Solicitor-General Lawrence MacAuley, said that, if true, the allegations may be investigated "more seriously."

Dr. John Service, executive-director of the Canadian Psychological Association, said the allegations were "troubling" and he would welcome any probe that would "get to the bottom" of the issue.

"We hold the confidentiality of client information very dear. It's very important," Dr. Service said.

Both men were responding to accusations made by Mr. Lynch who left CSIS in 1996 after spending 12 years at the service. He suggested last week that the pressure from some CSIS managers to provide the sensitive information became so untenable that he chose to leave the agency rather than agree to hand it over.

CSIS denies the allegation.

Mr. Lynch joined CSIS in 1984 and set up the new civilian intelligence service's combined polygraph testing and psychological assessment programs.
He said the agency uses polygraph testing simply as a "pretense for interrogation."

The use of polygraph testing is a source of considerable friction between CSIS and its watchdog, the Security Intelligence Review Committee. SIRC has repeatedly urged CSIS to abolish the use of polygraph testing because it also believes it is unreliable.

Indeed, in seven consecutive annual reports from 1985-1986 to 1991-92, SIRC demanded that the solicitor-general and CSIS dump the polygraph, once even suggesting the device be thrown onto the "scrap-heap."

In its reports, SIRC said it had "grave doubts" about the use of the polygraph, pointing out that "even defenders of polygraph examinations admit that their results are sometimes are wrong 10 per cent of the time or more."

SIRC chairwoman Paule Gauthier reiterated the watchdog's desire to see CSIS abandon polygraph testing.

The only concession CSIS has made was to end mandatory testing for employees in the mid-1980s. However, SIRC noted in its 1986-87 report, anyone reluctant to take such a test "would inevitably be suspected of having something to hide."

Mr. Lynch said that polygraph testing was used on all new CSIS recruits and even occasionally for operational purposes.

"It was driven by the police community originally, historically and still primarily. It does not have the academic substance. It doesn't enjoy the kind of reliability that is inherent in most psychological tests," he said.

Mr. Lynch said that while he was head of polygraph testing, the device was not used to determine whether potential recruits were lying or being truthful, but rather to gauge physiological reactions that may warrant further "exploration."

The device "does not allow you to infer mendacity or outright lying," said Mr. Lynch, who is now a senior adviser at the Public Service Commission of Canada.

However, polygraph testing reverted to a tool of "interrogation" when responsibility for the program was assumed by the agency's internal security division in 1989, Mr. Lynch said.

"I thought it was a very bad move. It was being administered by non-psychologists. I thought that was not the way to go," he said.

Mr. Lynch said that despite its unreliability, polygraph testing was increasingly used at CSIS to "scope people out."

A CSIS spokesman refused a request for an interview.


Source: https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/na ... le1040471/
I have mixed feelings about this. Let's say that it was accurate only 90% of the time. I would be ok with using that as part of the hiring process. However, given that many people who initially take polygraphs to get their job have to pass them every X number of years, I would be concerned about 10% of people losing their jobs because of an inaccurate one.
Deal Addict
Oct 6, 2015
2463 posts
1367 upvotes
ConsoleWatcher wrote: I have mixed feelings about this. Let's say that it was accurate only 90% of the time. I would be ok with using that as part of the hiring process. However, given that many people who initially take polygraphs to get their job have to pass them every X number of years, I would be concerned about 10% of people losing their jobs because of an inaccurate one.
Yup, those salaries do not incorporate really any risk premium for that. And if they do fire you, the circumstances involved may very well be classified, so it could actually be a crime to discuss anything related to such with a future potential employer. Nothing like being 50 years old, with a family, end up falsely accused of something, and have no effective redress, nor the legal ability to even talk about it.

As flawed as it is perhaps, at least the Canadian Armed Forces has the Court Martial system where one can have an actual trial before they kick you out. Some kangaroo polygraph CSIS process....

Quite frankly, I think Canadians would be better off if CSIS re-merged with the RCMP. Its been a disaster of an a joke of an agency throughout its existence.

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