how to spot unfinished basement water issues?

That definitely looks like efflorescence from water infiltration. Probably the earth around the home isn't sloped properly and the rain gutters aren't draining away from the house, saturating the foundation.
Ideal fix is to seal the outside of the foundation from water, which is a big job.

engineered wrote: ↑ That definitely looks like efflorescence from water infiltration. Probably the earth around the home isn't sloped properly and the rain gutters aren't draining away from the house, saturating the foundation.
Ideal fix is to seal the outside of the foundation from water, which is a big job.

So you would take that to mean there is an existing issue and the foundation is essentially getting waterlogged at times... the outside of the house appears quite flat but I'll definitely look for any slope issues. The footprint of the house is large so having to dig up and seal it would likely be a huge job and cost... Any idea how much the cost would be? I'm guessing the footprint is about 44x60'... the garage corner wouldn't need to be done... but that is still a lot of exterior foundation... I just can't imagine it would be worth it for a little bit of water occasionally - but also bad enough to make finishing the basement a bad idea.

Oh well... this was a promising house option, but I don't want to take on a potentially huge issue. I guess there is a chance this is an old issue, but it may not be... Ironically, if the basement was finished, I may never have seen/known about this. They have put in a couple finished rooms in the basement, but most of it is not finished.

It's a common issue with houses, so you have accept some things, but if you don't know the history, it could be a bad problem. If it's just the efflorescence, and no water accumulation, then I'd say that's not bad, and could probably be dealt with by improving grading or water roof water management.
If your house hunting, I wouldn't write off a house just for that, but it would be something to consider.
You're right, I might be more afraid of a house with a finished basement, since at least you know what you're getting.
All the seller has to do is clean up that efflorescence and you'd never know.

I would keep looking if it were me. This seems like a potentially huge issue to fix.

Chickinvic wrote: ↑ I would keep looking if it were me. This seems like a potentially huge issue to fix.

I hear ya. It seems unusual for basements to not be finished nowadays (after 15+ years)... so it had me wondering why they never did it. But then again, there is 2700 sqft elsewhere in the house so maybe they just didn't need to finish the basement (they did stick one room in the basement). The cost to finish such a large basement may have just prevented them from finishing the space... but I looked harder and noticed the efflorescence and now I'm a bit spooked. Not sure what my final decision will be yet.... If it really has known water issues, they could have scrubbed it off and done a good job hiding it I'd think. If my wife doesn't like the rest of the house, it won't matter... LOL... But if she does... I'd love to have the project to finish the basement in my vision...

I would move on quickly if it wasn't a unicorn. It's in a niche spot in the market where we may have a wait a long time for anything similar to show up again.

engineered wrote: ↑ It's a common issue with houses, so you have accept some things, but if you don't know the history, it could be a bad problem. If it's just the efflorescence, and no water accumulation, then I'd say that's not bad, and could probably be dealt with by improving grading or water roof water management.
If your house hunting, I wouldn't write off a house just for that, but it would be something to consider.
You're right, I might be more afraid of a house with a finished basement, since at least you know what you're getting.
All the seller has to do is clean up that efflorescence and you'd never know.

This! I have "efflorescence" in my garage -- clearly I am not fussed about it and wouldn't bother cleaning it up - even if I'm selling the house. Why would I? I can explain why... And if the buyer doesn't want my explanation, then so be it - I'm sure there's others who will not be fussed... (Now I know you're fussed about a basement, and it is different, but my point is -- is it really that big a deal?)

Personally, on an unfinished basement, it'll most likely be a similar case...It's hard to compare "apples to apples" of course on different houses/different issues etc - BUT as engineered said, what if it was a finished basement, then you wouldn't see it. Would/may have bought the house, and issues prop up (or not) later on, efflorescence doesn't mean you actually have a flood/walls get damaged immediately -- might take years, decades(?)...

Bottom line: there's no perfect house - if you spot "issues" before buying, well and good, use that to add to your information in making an informed decision... there'll be issues you wont spot now which will become issues later and then we're back to "square one". Unlike a car, houses aren't built by Fanuc robots so it's usually inevitable to have at least one problem - whether major or minor, is subjective...

Finally, as you said, if you guys want the house, and are concerned with it, then it's just truly a matter of price -- get it "fixed" (if it's an issue)if you want for whatever price $10-20k? 50K cut down on the seller's price and flag it as a concern? If the seller agrees, not only do you have peace of mind, you fixed it to your liking... if not, then it's a tougher choice... honestly, bottom line -- it's a matter of price vs want -- between the buyer and seller... Why do I say this? Well, there's just 2 houses that were sold on our street and there's been some house renovation companies both fixing stuff prior to the owner(s) moving in... I doubt these are all "perfect houses" to begin with and some even had probably roofing issues (as to whether there was a leak found or not, I don't know, but I think you get what I'm trying to say - I know bec this house always has had shingles blown off -- highest part on the street -- so whether there was a leak, or they are just fixing the roof to make it sturdier, I don't know and didn't bother asking)...

Good luck house hunting...

Tiberius wrote: ↑ I hear ya. It seems unusual for basements to not be finished nowadays (after 15+ years)... so it had me wondering why they never did it. But then again, there is 2700 sqft elsewhere in the house so maybe they just didn't need to finish the basement (they did stick one room in the basement). The cost to finish such a large basement may have just prevented them from finishing the space... but I looked harder and noticed the efflorescence and now I'm a bit spooked. Not sure what my final decision will be yet.... If it really has known water issues, they could have scrubbed it off and done a good job hiding it I'd think. If my wife doesn't like the rest of the house, it won't matter... LOL... But if she does... I'd love to have the project to finish the basement in my vision...

I would move on quickly if it wasn't a unicorn. It's in a niche spot in the market where we may have a wait a long time for anything similar to show up again.

Just saw this after I typed my response already (See earlier post)... As mentioned, it's a matter of "want/price" - if 50k (heck 100k if that's what itll cost - i dunno haha) price reduction to fix this aint going to satisfy you, then you move on... if it does then problem solved... If the seller agrees, then you got the house to your liking (and fixed to you liking and reinforced to your liking)... If he doesn't, then I think the price he's asking is too high for what you want his house to be in (a more pristine condition)... pardon me for making it simplistic -- but that's how I am - hence in RFD haha... (my line of work is in the markets - hence I always believe in a "price" that will sell/buy) -

As engineered said, this seems to be a common occurrence as I've seen newer houses (eg 10 yrs old or younger) with dimpled water barriers on the bottom 2 inches for protection on what i would presume to be things like this given that houses that are newer are all built side by side with all their gutters pouring into one middle "channel") ...

golferbowl wrote: ↑ Just saw this after I typed my response already (See earlier post)... As mentioned, it's a matter of "want/price" - if 50k (heck 100k if that's what itll cost - i dunno haha) price reduction to fix this aint going to satisfy you, then you move on... if it does then problem solved... If the seller agrees, then you got the house to your liking (and fixed to you liking and reinforced to your liking)... If he doesn't, then I think the price he's asking is too high for what you want his house to be in (a more pristine condition)... pardon me for making it simplistic -- but that's how I am - hence in RFD haha... (my line of work is in the markets - hence I always believe in a "price" that will sell/buy) -

As engineered said, this seems to be a common occurrence as I've seen newer houses (eg 10 yrs old or younger) with dimpled water barriers on the bottom 2 inches for protection on what i would presume to be things like this given that houses that are newer are all built side by side with all their gutters pouring into one middle "channel") ...

Yeah… the negotiating thing is the way things should work… but it s a bidding war market right now. This house will have a bidding situation. I’m going to see if I can get a rough idea of how much it would cost to waterproof the foundation so I know the worst case scenario. The basement doesn’t even have a sump pump… it kinda implies there shouldn’t be an issue with water, but… it seems there is…

Tiberius wrote: ↑ Yeah… the negotiating thing is the way things should work… but it s a bidding war market right now. This house will have a bidding situation. I’m going to see if I can get a rough idea of how much it would cost to waterproof the foundation so I know the worst case scenario. The basement doesn’t even have a sump pump… it kinda implies there shouldn’t be an issue with water, but… it seems there is…

Wow sump pump? I was in agreement with engineered on excess water (eg downspout, efflorescence). not "flooding" water...

Again I'm just playing by ear here using "logic" as much as I can (eg if they wanna hide it they could've easily washed or brushed it out, as you guys already said). I don't claim I'm a basement waterproofing expert.

Either way, if it seems like it's a "wanted" house eg bidding war, then you are at least informed if you cost out either "waterproofing" (already a worst case scenario) or sump pump (I'm surprised it needs one after over 15 yrs?)... Good luck either way...

Frankly, the picture quality is terrible. Can't make out any detail. Try posting them directly onto RFD. When composing click the advanced button then the images tab.

That totally is efflorescence that shows that there once was water leakage. My current basement had that and we spent the money to get the basement waterproofed properly from the outside. Just to give you a rough estimate, it cost just under $200 / linear foot + tax, measuring the outside dimensions of the walls. We got the basement redone and did not want long term issues because we knew it already had issues years ago.

The picture with the blue patching was a feeble attempt at patching the crack that probably formed. At least you know and can "see" the issues, but if I were considering that house, I'd really want to go and give it the sniff test. If the basement smells musty or mouldy, you would know that is a recent issue or at least an ongoing one.

exrcoupe wrote: ↑ That totally is efflorescence that shows that there once was water leakage. My current basement had that and we spent the money to get the basement waterproofed properly from the outside. Just to give you a rough estimate, it cost just under $200 / linear foot + tax, measuring the outside dimensions of the walls. We got the basement redone and did not want long term issues because we knew it already had issues years ago.

The picture with the blue patching was a feeble attempt at patching the crack that probably formed. At least you know and can "see" the issues, but if I were considering that house, I'd really want to go and give it the sniff test. If the basement smells musty or mouldy, you would know that is a recent issue or at least an ongoing one.

Yikes… could be 200 linear feet… 40 grand…

The sniff test passed… the walls that are framed in the basement don’t seem to have water damage on the sill plates… but maybe they haven’t been up long.

New info: I also noted cracks in the basement floor. No real sign of water ever coming through the cracks… but they ran at 90 degree angles out from a support post. I may not have really noticed them if I wasn’t looking so hard for possible issues… but they were not just cosmetic.

Also - the outside foundation appears to have been parged, and it’s failing in spots. I snapped a pic of one spot… but it looks like the cement on the outside may have been looking suspect or else I don’t see why they would parge. It also looks like there may be an issue where the brick meets the foundation….it looks like the mortar was flaking away.

My wife really liked the house…. But it does seem the outside foundation was taking water damage… and the inside shows signs of issues too… it appears we would have to budget 50k just in case doing some grading fixes isn’t enough…

Water is the true enemy of houses…

There's certainly more foundation cracking and parging issues than on a typical 15 to 20 year old house. You could put a conditional offer in contingent on a satisfactory foundation engineer's report.

The cracks in the floor provide an entry point for water if the ground gets saturated. It's possible, though I think the chances are low here that there's foam insulation with a plastic vapor barrier on top underneath the cement floor.

In the first post you said something about possible cracking or a disconnect, between the walls and floor but the photos in that post are too low resolution to see.

I wondered if the basement floor looked original or has a repour been done?

That concrete looks very new for a 15-20 year old house so I'd be suspect on it.

fergy wrote: ↑ There's certainly more foundation cracking and parging issues than on a typical 15 to 20 year old house. You could put a conditional offer in contingent on a satisfactory foundation engineer's report.

The cracks in the floor provide an entry point for water if the ground gets saturated. It's possible, though I think the chances are low here that there's foam insulation with a plastic vapor barrier on top underneath the cement floor.

In the first post you said something about possible cracking or a disconnect, between the walls and floor but the photos in that post are too low resolution to see.

I wondered if the basement floor looked original or has a repour been done?

Very interesting re the repour question! I noticed that the sill for the walls in the basement seemed to be slightly lower than the concrete surface and thought that was strange. If more concrete was poured after those walls were framed…. Maybe there would be signs around the furnace - I imagine it would still be sitting on an original surface?

Tiberius wrote: ↑ Very interesting re the repour question! I noticed that the sill for the walls in the basement seemed to be slightly lower than the concrete surface and thought that was strange. If more concrete was poured after those walls were framed…. Maybe there would be signs around the furnace - I imagine it would still be sitting on an original surface?

Hard to see, but it looks like the 2x4 wall sole plate is blow the concrete. If so, they may have poured new concrete over the old to level it (or to cover something up). Still, pretty strange to do that. You would think they'd take the wall out to pour the concrete.
If I'm not mistaken, you can ask the seller question on what was done, or if there were any issues. If they lie, and you can prove it later, they would be responsible for corrective action.

Tiberius shared the link to the home.

It would seem two walls have the efflorescence along most of the length and part of a third. Looking at the photography as best i can tell, this home and the two beside it, the downspouts are connected to what appears to be piping running down towards the footings. If the water from the eavesdropping is routed to the sewer, in big rainfall events it may back up causing the ground to be saturated. Disconnecting the downspouts and directing the water away as already suggested could be key here.

The furnace is sitting on a concrete paver, shimmed to level it. The furnace looks like a Reliance rental, that could potentially indicate the central A/C, and the water softener are also rental. Sometimes people put in rental air cleaners and humidifiers too. It should be easy to get info on that if not already disclosed.

Its at the limits of the photo resolution but I think the down spouts look similar to this.

Just a thought, I wonder if the downspouts connection near the footings could be poorly done causing water to accumulate at the footings during heavy rainfall and also under the floor, which might have resulted in the floor cracking more than typical and some of the cracks to appear around the parging as well? Essentially causing more settling than usual?

The furnace had a lot of paperwork on it with some handwritten notes on top. Maybe if you're in again have a look.

I don t see a big issue personally. I m sure there are plenty of finished basements with this issue including my cinder block foundation house. Because its unfinished at least you can plan for it. For ex a raised subfloor will make sure there s no damage to the flooring. Installing a dehumidifier.