Joys of testing new tech - Tesla Megapack blaze still burning

Looks like a design failure to properly cool the battery and have proper fire suppression built in.

As for harm, is the pollution from the fire any worse than a fossil fuel fire? Like the recent Sunrise propane explosion in Barrie? Or the Sunrise propane explosion in Toronto that killed people? Or the recent propane explosion in Russia? Or the BP oil rig fire in the Gulf? Or the other rig fire in the Gulf where the weather was on fire?

Yes, that is why I said "Going to be accidents with anything though I suppose..."
The toxicity of the lithium fires seems to be worse then the average car fire though, and most average vehicle fires don't burn near as long or need the resources to monitor and treat them overall.

Once batteries get lighter/safer/longer lasting they will take over for sure it seems, unless some company comes up fast with other (hydrogen etc) tech that will be feasible. Though anything new will still fall in the same infrastructure drawbacks that EVs are having right now. At least batteries have a jump on any other tech it seems so far in that aspect...

UrbanPoet wrote: ↑ Looks like youre getting a mini down vote party due to the disrespect to EV & Tesla!

First day though. Should pull up to -10 by weeks end unless the ICE crew helps out.

I think some of the things they are doing with batteries is amazing (it looks like it will be the future), so don't mean any disrespect to any crowd. I was just putting up an article to show the drawbacks to testing any kind of new tech that was interesting. Once some of these issues are minimized/solved batteries will take off for sure, but they do need to work on (charging) infrastructure to make it work ultimately...

Yeah. No point bringing any shortcomings up here. Tesla has no shortcomings.

Only thing better then a beige corolla is tesla. We should all drive a model 3

Helping OP out with the ICE crew

Good note - technology will always have a drawback. Remember when ICE VTEC was the Shizzle? Nobody complains about oil and gas fired at that time?

We have to take note of the advances in technology and as we progress we learn. It's all about timing and perspective.

This isn't an ICE vs EV thread. Read the original post.

IcarusLSC wrote: ↑ This isn't an ICE vs EV thread. Read the original post.

It will turn into one very soon. Be patient.

How is this even automotive related?

Rob_EV wrote: ↑ How is this even automotive related?

You do know where power wall tech from Teslas come from (Powerpacks which make up Megapacks), and how they want in part to use Megapacks for (or is your user name a pose?)? Heck I don't follow EV/battery engineering much and know this is related.

IcarusLSC wrote: ↑ This isn't an ICE vs EV thread. Read the original post.

You talked smack about tesla. I wish you luck.

KevinM56081 wrote: ↑ You talked smack about tesla. I wish you luck.

How do you figure? So many can't read/comprehend it seems.

These lithium fires are far more toxic then regular gasoline fires from all I've read, so I posted about it. As I mentioned they will probably fix these issues. Read.

IcarusLSC wrote: ↑ How do you figure? So many can't read/comprehend it seems.

These lithium fires are far more toxic then regular gasoline fires from all I've read, so I posted about it. As I mentioned they will probably fix these issues. Read.

I'm not engaging in this again. It's been hashed out in a previous thread regarding vehicle fires and the aspects that effect both ice and ev.

13 tonne shipping container size energy storage systems "ESS". This is much bigger market than EV. This is future energy grid infrastructure which will change the way we perceive, make, use, and store our energy.

That's quite a unit to go up in flames. Obviously better battery management systems (BMS) still need to be incorporated. Currently the IONIX Pro Titan industrial size ESS being developed has the AI tech to be able to shut down problematic cells/batteries before getting to a state where a fire starts and allows concise remote two way communication and control between user(s) and product(s).

IcarusLSC wrote: ↑ How do you figure? So many can't read/comprehend it seems.

These lithium fires are far more toxic then regular gasoline fires from all I've read, so I posted about it. As I mentioned they will probably fix these issues. Read.

I think the EV good are taking offence because your saying we need better batteries, but we don't see you posting fossil fuel fires like the recent explosion in Barrie and Russia calling for safer fossil fuels.

And where did you see that an EV fire is more toxic than an ICE vehicle fire? Personally I wouldn't want to be near either, but at least a battery fire starts slower so you have more time to get away.

EV fires are different then gasoline fires as we know. The electrolyte in lithium-ion batteries is flammable and also produce different types of fluoride gases. Fluoride gas emissions in EV fires are quite toxic and much more heat is released that isn't generally seen in gasoline fires. Because EV fires burn so much hotter, they can make the water molecules used in suppression separate into hydrogen and oxygen gases which increase the temps, lead to thermal run away etc. which also isn't usually seen in gasoline fires...

Its good to see companies spending so much in battery development to make it safer and longer lasting and cleaner...

They got the fire out it looks like (hopefully it won't reignite.) More then 3 days burning, they didn't do much of anything to put it out, but let it burn and try to keep it from spreading (which it did to a pack beside it.) About 150 firefighters, more then 30 fire trucks and support vehicles and a lot of water. They are leaving some to monitor it for a few days. At least the toxic smoke has dispersed they say...

I really want to get into the whole tribal warfare stuff. I just want to point out that while LiOn fires are scarier than ICE fires, there are other relevant considerations. First, they are much less common. Tesla's cars have had one fire per 330 million km, 91% fewer than the ICE average. Teslas tend to be pretty new, but on the other hand, LiOn car batteries and Tesla are both quite new, themselves. The industry will continue to improve designs - probably at a quick pace in the coming years. A single LiOn fire is more dangerous than a single ICE fire, but is it worse than 11 ICE fires? The battery in Moorabool is also 24x larger than the biggest Model 3 pack. That largest-in-the-world project is being assembled by hand in a totally custom configuration. No other mega Tesla battery has ever caught on fire like that, either. A direct comparison between an accident during construction of a unique power plant and a typical car accident is a stretch - like comparing the oil wells Saddam lit to a typical ICE fire. In the end, it's true that LiOn isn't perfect. I don't think there's any better options at the moment, but I agree that better would be... well, better!