Ongoing Deal Discussion

[Lenovo Canada] ThinkPad & IdeaPad - EPP Discounted

Newbie
May 24, 2018
62 posts
13 upvotes
tb06mar wrote: Do you buy warranty for thinkpad? I bought T400 and W520 and it never needs the warranty services even I bought 2 or 3 year warranty with W520. I read from different forums people complaints about the quality of lenovo. For X1C/X1E, what's your opinions and suggestions? How many years you bought or are you planning to buy? What kind of warranty you bought? Thanks for any input.

Lenovo is miles ahead of Dell in terms of their QA with their laptops. I've had my Y580 from 2012 and its still going strong after 6-7 years, albeit the inevitable wear and tear of the chasis and keys broken through the years.

It had served me well for so long and now that it's time to replace it, I'll be sure to get another Lenovo laptop. I'm deciding between X1E or P1, something like 70/30 at the moment.
Newbie
Dec 30, 2017
9 posts
5 upvotes
Also interested in X1E. Can you please let me know if you see any deal this month.

Have the same opinion that a Thinkpad would last longer than a Dell. My current laptop is 6.5 years old. Previous laptop before that died after 10 years just 2 months ago, bought in 2008.
Last edited by mailzee on Sep 5th, 2018 1:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Newbie
Dec 30, 2017
9 posts
5 upvotes
tb06mar wrote: Do you buy warranty for thinkpad? I bought T400 and W520 and it never needs the warranty services even I bought 2 or 3 year warranty with W520. I read from different forums people complaints about the quality of lenovo. For X1C/X1E, what's your opinions and suggestions? How many years you bought or are you planning to buy? What kind of warranty you bought? Thanks for any input.
Bought W520 with 3 years onsite warranty. There was a display issue which occurred after 6 months. Lived with it for 2.5 years. Eventually Lenovo replaced W520 with W530 after changing the mother board on site 3 times. Since warranty was used, feel like its worth it. Having the on-site next business day is definitely a peace of mind.
Deal Addict
User avatar
Nov 7, 2007
1046 posts
793 upvotes
Portage la Prairie
tb06mar wrote: Do you buy warranty for thinkpad? I bought T400 and W520 and it never needs the warranty services even I bought 2 or 3 year warranty with W520. I read from different forums people complaints about the quality of lenovo. For X1C/X1E, what's your opinions and suggestions? How many years you bought or are you planning to buy? What kind of warranty you bought? Thanks for any input.
I purchased 3yr. Onsite with W520, and also with T480s that I just got.
The 520 had speaker issues and they came and fixed it right on my kitchen table, can't beat that.
For me, it's definitely worth the extra $130.
Deal Addict
Jul 21, 2001
4312 posts
403 upvotes
Calgary
Warranty is one of those things that varies from person to person. For almost $300 I can get 3yr warranty, 3yr accidental, 3yr battery replacement. On a $3000 laptop, that's 10% for insurance and peace of mind, I find that number justifiable. On a $2000 laptop with the same $300 insurance, I am more willing to risk it and pocket the difference, and if it so happens to die on me after the 1yr warranty is up, I'd use the $300 towards another $2000 laptop, $1700 out of pocket. With IBM/Lenovo my two previous purchases were solid up to the point I sold them a few years later. So I did exactly that, on the $3k order I purchased 3yr warranty, on the $2k purchase I did without it.

On another note, there's supposedly new 2TB NVMe PCIE SSDs coming out, wonder if it may work on the X1 and X1E. The max official support I believe is 1TB per M.2 slot in the X1E. Wish there were a 2.5" slot so I can slap on a cheap 2TB SATA3 SSD as well. $900 for 2TB sticks is the supposed going rate, perhaps 3-4yrs down the road it'll get down to $350ish.

BTW, did I mention the QHD HDR screen is absolutely gorgeous on the X1C? Smiling Face With Open Mouth
"i love my girl friend and my girl friend loves me ok so you cant love me"
Deal Addict
Apr 2, 2006
1276 posts
183 upvotes
Was excited to get my XPS 15 9570 yesterday but after some basic testing already very disappointed in a supposedly premium laptop. The supplied 512GB SSD is Hynix and CrystalMark numbers are low, as well the Wifi Killer card is just plain garbage. I got 10 mbps down after BIOS, driver updates and reading online for hours on complaints about the wifi card and various fixes. My Lenovo E570 gets 55mbps+ easy. Not going to waste any more time trying to optimize it. Back to Dell it goes. Hope There will be some decent deals on Lenovo X or P series come Black Friday.
Member
Jun 24, 2010
299 posts
84 upvotes
crustydragon wrote: Was excited to get my XPS 15 9570 yesterday but after some basic testing already very disappointed in a supposedly premium laptop. The supplied 512GB SSD is Hynix and CrystalMark numbers are low, as well the Wifi Killer card is just plain garbage. I got 10 mbps down after BIOS, driver updates and reading online for hours on complaints about the wifi card and various fixes. My Lenovo E570 gets 55mbps+ easy. Not going to waste any more time trying to optimize it. Back to Dell it goes. Hope There will be some decent deals on Lenovo X or P series come Black Friday.
Yeah, pretty much my same experience with the 9570. The specs look impressive, but the actual components used are not top notch. Don't expect a fast NVMe SSD, ever. Plus, the Killer Wifi cards have crashed my router as soon as I switched the wifi on. Dell technical support tried to log into my router to change some settings to make it work, but that makes zero sense because it still crashes in a coffee shop or even a friend's house. Is Dell going to change the router settings at every coffee shop I visit? :facepalm:

The reviews for the 9570 show that the laptop can adequately cool the 8th gen i5 quad core, but struggles alot with an i7. This doesn't surprise me because the cooling solution has not really changed since the XPS 9550, which was when CPUs were quad core, like the newest i5 today. I would expect an i7 with 2 more cores to output ~50% more heat under load. That thermal design was just never designed for 6 cores, and I think Dell knows, but won't fix it until they refresh the laptop with say, the new Geforce RTX GPUs.

Here is a picture of the heatpipe solution shared by the GPU and CPU on the 9570 I had. This is supposed to cool a 6 core i7 with a GTX1050Ti? I bought my 9570 with i7, 512GB SSD, and 4K screen for $2100 taxes in. It's a lot cheaper than other offerings out there, but it's not really a great laptop. The upside is that there are tons of people who want the XPS. Mine is already gone.

Image
Deal Addict
Apr 2, 2006
1276 posts
183 upvotes
perpetuus wrote: Yeah, pretty much my same experience with the 9570. The specs look impressive, but the actual components used are not top notch. Don't expect a fast NVMe SSD, ever. Plus, the Killer Wifi cards have crashed my router as soon as I switched the wifi on. Dell technical support tried to log into my router to change some settings to make it work, but that makes zero sense because it still crashes in a coffee shop or even a friend's house. Is Dell going to change the router settings at every coffee shop I visit? :facepalm:

The reviews for the 9570 show that the laptop can adequately cool the 8th gen i5 quad core, but struggles alot with an i7. This doesn't surprise me because the cooling solution has not really changed since the XPS 9550, which was when CPUs were quad core, like the newest i5 today. I would expect an i7 with 2 more cores to output ~50% more heat under load. That thermal design was just never designed for 6 cores, and I think Dell knows, but won't fix it until they refresh the laptop with say, the new Geforce RTX GPUs.

Here is a picture of the heatpipe solution shared by the GPU and CPU on the 9570 I had. This is supposed to cool a 6 core i7 with a GTX1050Ti? I bought my 9570 with i7, 512GB SSD, and 4K screen for $2100 taxes in. It's a lot cheaper than other offerings out there, but it's not really a great laptop. The upside is that there are tons of people who want the XPS. Mine is already gone.

Image
I couldn't agree more. On paper it looks great and I went with it instead of waiting for a similarly configured P1 because it was substantially less with Dell's regular 'sales'. I guess it's true what they say, you get what you pay for. May be a good idea to shell out more money for a better designed and equipped Lenovo or maybe settle for a P52s instead. Hoping there will be some decent deals coming up closer to Black Friday!
Newbie
May 24, 2018
62 posts
13 upvotes
perpetuus wrote: Speakers on the X1 Carbon are clear, but not great for music (not great bass, etc.). The headphone jack is decent.

Dell XPS 15 throttles and reaches 95C easily (after 5-10 seconds in intel XTU benchmarking) with i7/8750H and the GTX1050 Ti, so you're not getting the full i7 performance out of it. The speakers and headphone jack are basic, not really better than the X1 Carbon. I expect the same throttling on the X1 extreme. There just isn't enough cooling with two fans and 2 heatpipes. In fact, the X1 Carbon has 2 heatpipes too, but it ran fairly well with the i7-8650u, which has less cores and consumes less power. Reduced performance is the price for portability.

The only version of the XPS 15 that can perform well without throttling is the business oriented Precision 5530. XPS prices do not apply, but you get the exact same laptop, but outfitted with the Core i9-derived Xeon 2176M at 4.4ghz and 12MB cache and Quadro P2000 gpu. Runs cooler and faster. Xeon chips are specially picked for stability and efficiency because they are expected to run 24/7 without issues. My friend ended up with the Xeon Precision 5530 because the XPS ran hot and throttles like mad.

If you care about audio performance, the MSI GS65 is fantastic, both in terms of its speakers and the headphone jack. It has 24bit/192khz decoding with the excellent ESS Sabre chip. Fantastic sound, lightweight at 4lbs only, and generally does not throttle. Other than the screen not having 4K, it's perfect. I didn't keep mine because I need a 100% Adobe rgb gamut display and I don't game.
Thanks. I see that MSI has HiFi audio as you mentioned. The only deal breaker is that it only has 4 hours of battery life. And I'm now convinced not to get the XPS 15 9570 after all the horror stories regarding their QA.
I am wondering, between the X1 Extreme and Surface Book 2, which one would you choose? And for audio quality, which one you think is better?
Sr. Member
Mar 8, 2004
533 posts
103 upvotes
I'm in the same boat as the posts above. I just dropped off my new XPS 9570 at Purolator. I had two main issues with mine. Rubbing of one of the fans against the housing and the CAPS lock slanted to one side. Not a huge deal as I know the tech would come to the house to fix it but wasn't willing to go through the process. Also, I wasn't a huge fan of the webcam placement as I will be using the machine for frequent Skype business calls.

I'll be looking at the X1 Extreme, P1 or perhaps the P52s.
Member
Jun 24, 2010
299 posts
84 upvotes
mon369 wrote: Thanks. I see that MSI has HiFi audio as you mentioned. The only deal breaker is that it only has 4 hours of battery life. And I'm now convinced not to get the XPS 15 9570 after all the horror stories regarding their QA.
I am wondering, between the X1 Extreme and Surface Book 2, which one would you choose? And for audio quality, which one you think is better?
That's a good question. I had a Surface Book 2 15" in January. I was so excited about it that I almost went to the US just to pick one up ahead of the Canadian launch.

The Book 2 is great in many ways as a productivity machine. I liked its 15" screen in a very generous 3:2 ratio. This meant that the screen area was actually closer to a 16:9 ratio screen that is something like 16" in size. It was a pleasure to use. Great keyboard, capable speakers, sharp and big screen, and that GTX1060 is perfectly usable. But the real draw of the device is the pen input and tablet usability.

Plus, in real use, I was easily getting 10+ hours of battery life. I could game with it and I could edit photos with it, and there isn't anything else as capable in that category.

However, I don't need the tablet functionality because I genuinely couldn't find the Windows 10 operating system as a great choice for tablet use. (I have an iPad for reading magazines). I also wish it had a 6 core processor, but for something so thin and light, it would never happen. I have a need for a 100% Adobe RGB gamut screen, and the Book 2 was only 100% sRGB, so it was almost perfect, but not quite. The biggest problem though is that my early batch Book 2 had random stuttering and freezing issues. In Performance mode, the laptop would actually lag more than on power saver mode, so something was very wrong with it, and Microsoft didn't know how to fix it. I went through 2 Book 2's and they both had the same problem for me. That was when I finally looked elsewhere.

Other things to note:
1) If you lose either the tablet ("clipboard") or the keyboard, Microsoft would not sell either of those pieces to you separately.
2) A dead battery in either the tablet or the keyboard base costs $500+ to replace when out of warranty. Due to the complexity of the device, Microsoft does not actually replace the batteries, but gives you a new Book 2 with a fresh battery.
3) The weight is reasonably light, but the footprint is quite big because of the 3:2 aspect ratio.
4) If you don't need to use it as a tablet or to draw on it, there are better choices for less money
5) The built-in Samsung SSD is not fast for today's standards. Less than 500 mb/s for the 256GB version I had.

X1 Extreme is too new for me to formulate a good opinnion on. However, since Lenovo has designed this new laptop specifically for the 6 core CPUs (unlike Dell with its XPS 9570), I am hopeful that it should perform better than the XPS does today in terms of performance. Also, it's lighter than the Book 2 and has a better screen (100% Adobe RGB with HDR) and a 6 core i7 CPU. It's an excellent package altogether.

For audio quality - since I never heard of any good quality sound from Thinkpads, I believe the Book 2 is better.

If you don't need a 6 core CPU or dedicated graphics, I really really liked the X1 Carbon with HDR. If I didn't need more power for photo editing and more RAM, then it's the perfect laptop. I believe the screen is even nicer than the new X1 Extreme because it has an even higher contrast ratio. Did I mention it weighs just 2.5 lbs? That's almost half of what a Book 2 or even X1 Extreme with the HDR display.
Deal Addict
Apr 2, 2006
1276 posts
183 upvotes
perpetuus wrote: That's a good question. I had a Surface Book 2 15" in January. I was so excited about it that I almost went to the US just to pick one up ahead of the Canadian launch.

The Book 2 is great in many ways as a productivity machine. I liked its 15" screen in a very generous 3:2 ratio. This meant that the screen area was actually closer to a 16:9 ratio screen that is something like 16" in size. It was a pleasure to use. Great keyboard, capable speakers, sharp and big screen, and that GTX1060 is perfectly usable. But the real draw of the device is the pen input and tablet usability.

Plus, in real use, I was easily getting 10+ hours of battery life. I could game with it and I could edit photos with it, and there isn't anything else as capable in that category.

However, I don't need the tablet functionality because I genuinely couldn't find the Windows 10 operating system as a great choice for tablet use. (I have an iPad for reading magazines). I also wish it had a 6 core processor, but for something so thin and light, it would never happen. I have a need for a 100% Adobe RGB gamut screen, and the Book 2 was only 100% sRGB, so it was almost perfect, but not quite. The biggest problem though is that my early batch Book 2 had random stuttering and freezing issues. In Performance mode, the laptop would actually lag more than on power saver mode, so something was very wrong with it, and Microsoft didn't know how to fix it. I went through 2 Book 2's and they both had the same problem for me. That was when I finally looked elsewhere.

Other things to note:
1) If you lose either the tablet ("clipboard") or the keyboard, Microsoft would not sell either of those pieces to you separately.
2) A dead battery in either the tablet or the keyboard base costs $500+ to replace when out of warranty. Due to the complexity of the device, Microsoft does not actually replace the batteries, but gives you a new Book 2 with a fresh battery.
3) The weight is reasonably light, but the footprint is quite big because of the 3:2 aspect ratio.
4) If you don't need to use it as a tablet or to draw on it, there are better choices for less money
5) The built-in Samsung SSD is not fast for today's standards. Less than 500 mb/s for the 256GB version I had.

X1 Extreme is too new for me to formulate a good opinnion on. However, since Lenovo has designed this new laptop specifically for the 6 core CPUs (unlike Dell with its XPS 9570), I am hopeful that it should perform better than the XPS does today in terms of performance. Also, it's lighter than the Book 2 and has a better screen (100% Adobe RGB with HDR) and a 6 core i7 CPU. It's an excellent package altogether.

For audio quality - since I never heard of any good quality sound from Thinkpads, I believe the Book 2 is better.

If you don't need a 6 core CPU or dedicated graphics, I really really liked the X1 Carbon with HDR. If I didn't need more power for photo editing and more RAM, then it's the perfect laptop. I believe the screen is even nicer than the new X1 Extreme because it has an even higher contrast ratio. Did I mention it weighs just 2.5 lbs? That's almost half of what a Book 2 or even X1 Extreme with the HDR display.
Excellent analysis. Too bad the X1 Carbon doesn’t come in a 15” version.
Deal Addict
Apr 2, 2006
1276 posts
183 upvotes
Gabriella wrote: I'm in the same boat as the posts above. I just dropped off my new XPS 9570 at Purolator. I had two main issues with mine. Rubbing of one of the fans against the housing and the CAPS lock slanted to one side. Not a huge deal as I know the tech would come to the house to fix it but wasn't willing to go through the process. Also, I wasn't a huge fan of the webcam placement as I will be using the machine for frequent Skype business calls.

I'll be looking at the X1 Extreme, P1 or perhaps the P52s.
My XPS 15 9570 is getting dropped off next week at Purolator. I almost pulled the trigger on the P52s when Lenovo had the Labour Day sale with extra 5% off but the P52s didn't have the best review so I am holding off until either the P1 or the X1E come further down in price.
Jr. Member
Jan 30, 2016
103 posts
28 upvotes
Westmount, QC
tb06mar wrote: Do you buy warranty for thinkpad? I bought T400 and W520 and it never needs the warranty services even I bought 2 or 3 year warranty with W520. I read from different forums people complaints about the quality of lenovo. For X1C/X1E, what's your opinions and suggestions? How many years you bought or are you planning to buy? What kind of warranty you bought? Thanks for any input.
I live in the Quebec province and the consumer protection laws are strong, so if my computer breaks in 1-3 years, I'll just go to the small claims to ask for a partial refund, fix or replacement.
Sr. Member
Aug 26, 2008
825 posts
335 upvotes
Montreal
broody wrote: I live in the Quebec province and the consumer protection laws are strong, so if my computer breaks in 1-3 years, I'll just go to the small claims to ask for a partial refund, fix or replacement.
Past the initial one year warranty, is it really worth the hassle? I find the Thinkpad warranty to be an excellent option. While Thinkpads are very robust and have full service manuals, and they support end-user maintenance, with all the systems I've had (and what I put them through) a few times things have gone wrong and they've always handled it well. I always buy their accident prevention insurance too, the combination makes resale easier.
Last edited by davidm on Sep 7th, 2018 7:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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