Health & Wellness

[Merged] laser eye surgery

Poll: Mid twenties a good age to get it done?

  • Total votes: 376. You have voted on this poll.
Yes
 
198
53%
No
 
58
15%
Pizza is yummy
 
120
32%
Member
Dec 11, 2007
239 posts
5 upvotes
Toronto
multimut wrote: Not sure why you say "leaning towards Herzig to help with ICL as they seem to like to be more on the safer side". Not sure why that is more on the safer side.
It seems Boechner also does ICL and said that is an option, but they recommend PRK as that is less invasive on the eye. Whereas for another poster (Post #3304), both Boechner and Herzig thought ICL was the better choice for their measurements.
So it seems to me that based on your measurements, Boechner believes PRK is suitable, and PRK is less invasive on the eye than ICL (oh, and PRK costs less than ICL -- why would Boechner recommend a lower fee option when they can do ICL too?).

PRK has a long history and the procedure has been refined and perfected. PRK has a longer recovery period than Lasik (which you may not be eligible for anyways), but has lower risk of long-term complications.
iCL is still a relatively new procedure (with relatively few long term studies), but it is more invasive.

Some links for you
From the American Academy of ophthalmology - a neutral piece that highlights pros and cons (and there are cons): https://eyewiki.aao.org/Implantable_Collamer_Lens
For a more negative perspective, this one focuses on the cons only: https://lasikcomplications.com/implanta ... ations.htm
Hey! Thanks for your response.

Herzig mentioned that doing PRK would make me more prone to infections and more corrections. Anything that happens is irreversible and it is unpredictable as to what will happen if I do get PRK.
Although I don't have my measurements.... he said its extremely high that he doesn't see this often. I just remember that one of the scans they did, showed a wider display of yellow colour on the bottom of my right eye than my left.
ICL is better because if there are signs of complications, this would be irreversible.

When Bochner recommended PRK, they mentioned that there aren't any long-term complications and it would be less invasive on my eyes.

It is true that Bochner recommended PRK which is cheaper, but Money isn't an issue, I just want to choose the safest route for my eyes. You only get one pair~!


Thank you for sharing the informative links as well!
Deal Addict
Aug 17, 2008
1080 posts
492 upvotes
Silverhack wrote: Hey! Thanks for your response.

Herzig mentioned that doing PRK would make me more prone to infections and more corrections. Anything that happens is irreversible and it is unpredictable as to what will happen if I do get PRK.
Although I don't have my measurements.... he said its extremely high that he doesn't see this often. I just remember that one of the scans they did, showed a wider display of yellow colour on the bottom of my right eye than my left.
ICL is better because if there are signs of complications, this would be irreversible.

When Bochner recommended PRK, they mentioned that there aren't any long-term complications and it would be less invasive on my eyes.

It is true that Bochner recommended PRK which is cheaper, but Money isn't an issue, I just want to choose the safest route for my eyes. You only get one pair~!


Thank you for sharing the informative links as well!
I guess my point on money is not really the cost to you, but that Boechner recommending the lower fee option seems to suggest that their recommendation is clearly not motivated by maximizing their revenue. So they must really believe that for your measurements, PRK will provide good results and is the more conservative and safer long-term option for your situation. Herzig gave you some good reasons why they think ICL is the better option, but you still have to wonder, if the higher fee from ICL at least partially influences their recommendation.
I think if you have options, it is generally better to go with the least invasive option, and PRK is less invasive. Maybe ask a few more questions now of both clinics.
Member
Sep 10, 2017
231 posts
170 upvotes
Pandemic has me in a yolo mindset so I've decided to pursue laser eye surgery. Mainly astigmatism with mild myopia, I've settled on the SMiLE procedure because the idea of a flap makes me uncomfortable (contact sports) and I like the reduced risk of dryness.

I've consulted at a few places but only these two offer SMiLE, at Herzig by Dr. Herzig and at Clearview by Dr. Kranemann. I have friends who speak very highly of Dr. Herzig and I was lucky enough to meet Dr. Kranemann at my consult.

Both places seem like professional operations. While I'm not looking to cheap out on my eyes, Clearview is offering the procedure for $1400 less (that's with a referral discount to Herzig).

Any one with strong recommendations for either?
Deal Expert
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Oct 28, 2004
21155 posts
2493 upvotes
Toronto
blckmntn wrote: Pandemic has me in a yolo mindset so I've decided to pursue laser eye surgery. Mainly astigmatism with mild myopia, I've settled on the SMiLE procedure because the idea of a flap makes me uncomfortable (contact sports) and I like the reduced risk of dryness.

I've consulted at a few places but only these two offer SMiLE, at Herzig by Dr. Herzig and at Clearview by Dr. Kranemann. I have friends who speak very highly of Dr. Herzig and I was lucky enough to meet Dr. Kranemann at my consult.

Both places seem like professional operations. While I'm not looking to cheap out on my eyes, Clearview is offering the procedure for $1400 less (that's with a referral discount to Herzig).

Any one with strong recommendations for either?
wow, just happened to see this thread while browsing........I actually did my laser eye surgery with the Herzig office back in July 2010!!! And the surgery was performed by Dr Herzig himself!!

My post here:
merged-laser-eye-surgery-249780/47/#p11277481

Wow - I haven't kept up with the technology (mine was LASIK Wavefront (with Intralase)) - happy to say that my eyes are still good after the laser eye surgery, some slight dryness but nothing too serious.

However, old age is setting in for me and my eyes are no longer better than 20/20 (which it was after the surgery!)......

a little less than -1 in each eye is creeping back - optometrist says due to getting older.

My eyes are still great though and really happy with Dr. Herzig's work!

FS: Nothing at the moment
Heatware: 63-0-0
Member
Sep 10, 2017
231 posts
170 upvotes
ji2o0k wrote: wow, just happened to see this thread while browsing........I actually did my laser eye surgery with the Herzig office back in July 2010!!! And the surgery was performed by Dr Herzig himself!!

My post here:
merged-laser-eye-surgery-249780/47/#p11277481

Wow - I haven't kept up with the technology (mine was LASIK Wavefront (with Intralase)) - happy to say that my eyes are still good after the laser eye surgery, some slight dryness but nothing too serious.

However, old age is setting in for me and my eyes are no longer better than 20/20 (which it was after the surgery!)......

a little less than -1 in each eye is creeping back - optometrist says due to getting older.

My eyes are still great though and really happy with Dr. Herzig's work!
Wow, quick to the reply, thanks for the input! I think if we were discussing anything besides my eyes, I'm sure saving fourteen hundreds bucks would be a good idea.

I wish Canada Post was as fast as you guys.
Deal Addict
Aug 17, 2008
1080 posts
492 upvotes
blckmntn wrote: Pandemic has me in a yolo mindset so I've decided to pursue laser eye surgery. Mainly astigmatism with mild myopia, I've settled on the SMiLE procedure because the idea of a flap makes me uncomfortable (contact sports) and I like the reduced risk of dryness.

I've consulted at a few places but only these two offer SMiLE, at Herzig by Dr. Herzig and at Clearview by Dr. Kranemann. I have friends who speak very highly of Dr. Herzig and I was lucky enough to meet Dr. Kranemann at my consult.
You are wise to be concerned about the flap with LASIK, particularly if you play contact sports.

However, do your research on SMILE, as I think the reason that you only found two clinic in your area that offer SMILE is that while SMILE is "newer", most ophthalmologists do not believe that SMILE is superior to LASIK. Do your own research, do not rely on the marketing materials from clinics that have invested in SMILE equipment.
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Oct 28, 2004
21155 posts
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Toronto
Just a quick note about flap vs prk....

I did LASIK aka flap. Dr. Herzig explained to me that yes, while your eyes’ integrity is different due to the flap....the severity of the damage to your eye to cause the flap to be undone would be so great that your eye would be seriously damaged even if you didn’t have the flap.

That and PRK recovery is longer.....I decided to go with LASIK.

I don’t do contact sports like boxing anymore but I do play basketball, volleyball and tennis and have no worries about damaging my eyes through these sports.

I think PrK would be good for folks playing contact sports but I am chicken...lol!

FS: Nothing at the moment
Heatware: 63-0-0
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Aug 17, 2008
1080 posts
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One more comment on the flap in LASIK.

First, there is no doubt that the vast majority of people who get LASIK are very satisfied with the results, and LASIK has much shorter recovery time than PRK. But the concern is not if you are like the 96%+ who are happy with it, it's what are the risks. And the worst case scenario with LASIK is much worse than the worst case scenario wtih PRK (check out the site Lasik Complications). In particular, while very rare, LASIK has greater risk of damage to the nerves leading to ongoing pain. Of course the big negative with PRK is a longer recovery time, so many doctors and patients prefer LASIK if the cornea is thick enough. But isn't a longer recovery time worth it if it's safer in the long term?

Here's article on PRK vs LASIK:
https://www.healthline.com/health/eye-h ... -they-work

PRK : "The complete healing process lasts about a month. Your vision will slowly get better each day, and you’ll see your doctor regularly for checkups until your eye is fully healed."

LASIK: "You’ll probably see much more clearly right after LASIK than you could before, even without glasses or contacts. You may even have close to perfect vision the day after your surgery. You won’t experience much pain or discomfort as your eye heals. "

Both techniques are equally effective in permanently correcting your vision. The main difference is the recovery time.

LASIK takes a few days or less to see clearly while PRK takes about a month. The final results won’t differ between the two if the procedure is done properly by a licensed, experienced surgeon.

"Overall, PRK is considered to be safer and more effective in the long term because it doesn’t leave a flap in your cornea. The flap left behind by LASIK can be subject to greater damage or complications if your eye is injured


And another from an eye clinic (that does both):
https://www.allaboutvision.com/en-ca/vi ... rgery/prk/
PRK versus LASIK
Results of PRK surgery are comparable to LASIK outcomes, but initial PRK recovery is slower because it takes a few days for new epithelial cells to regenerate and cover the surface of the eye.

There also is a slightly increased risk of eye infection and haziness of vision in the first few days following PRK surgery.

LASIK patients generally have less discomfort, and their vision stabilizes more quickly, whereas vision improvement with PRK is gradual and the final outcome can take several weeks.

PRK does, however, offer some distinct benefits.

Because no LASIK-style corneal flap (which contains both epithelial and the deeper stromal tissues) is created during PRK, more corneal thickness is available for treatment. This is beneficial if your corneas are too thin for LASIK.

There also is no risk of flap complications, and the risk of removing too much of the cornea with the excimer laser is reduced.


It's easy to see why LASIK is more popular. It's much easier for the doctor (don't have to deal with follow-ups and complaints during recovery) and for the patient. But if you are willig to endure some discomfort initially, and a longer recovery, PRK is safer.
Newbie
Apr 8, 2019
14 posts
5 upvotes
Endeav wrote: Dr. Machat moved to TLC Yonge Eglinton, give them a call at 416-733-2020. I was told that Dr. Machat's nvision patients were adopted by TLC and given lifetime warranties. I had lasik at nvision on December 20th, and I have a prk enhancement scheduled for April 23rd at TLC, by Dr. Machat.
Sorry to dig up an old post. Can you confirm that you were actually transferred to TLC at Yonge & Eglinton? I called them today (after a year of procrastinating) and they said nothing would be covered if I needed a touch-up, but Machat is still there. Wondering if it was only for patients who had surgeries scheduled after closure, not previous patients - I had PRK in May 2018.

Nvision at the time of the Toronto clinic said the warranty is still valid but I'd have to travel to the USA for treatment. I guess I'm learning a lesson about "lifetime" warranties...
Newbie
Jan 5, 2012
23 posts
10 upvotes
Brampton
robody wrote: Sorry to dig up an old post. Can you confirm that you were actually transferred to TLC at Yonge & Eglinton? I called them today (after a year of procrastinating) and they said nothing would be covered if I needed a touch-up, but Machat is still there. Wondering if it was only for patients who had surgeries scheduled after closure, not previous patients - I had PRK in May 2018.

Nvision at the time of the Toronto clinic said the warranty is still valid but I'd have to travel to the USA for treatment. I guess I'm learning a lesson about "lifetime" warranties...
Yes I can confirm that I was transferred to TLC Yonge Eglinton. At the time, I called Nvision and they were closed, I was directed to call TLC Yonge Eglinton and the director there said that they were adopting Machat's Nvision patients. I did indeed have my enhancement done on April 23rd 2019, however I've not followed up to see if I would still be covered for a touch-up in the future. Maybe you should try to speak to Dr. Machat? Were you an Nvision or Crystal clear patient?
Member
Dec 11, 2007
239 posts
5 upvotes
Toronto
Hey guys just an update:

Decided to do PRK for the long-term benefits! Will be doing it sometime next month! :).

Am very, super excited but nervous too!
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Apr 3, 2006
2597 posts
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I'm just past the 6 month mark now with my surgery and I have noticed that I am experiencing quite a bit of floaters - particularly when there is a lot of light or when staring at a screen. Has anyone else had this issue?
Newbie
Jul 26, 2020
1 posts
I found this post when searching for information about TPRK surgery at LaserVue. It's been a couple months since your surgery, how do you feel now?
jaychee wrote: I'm booked at LaserVue in Montreal for end-of-month March for TPRK (SmartSurfACE).

My reasons for choosing LaserVue over PLEC (no criticisms intended)
  • Location is closer to me for any (hopefully none) follow up visits and lower travel costs.
  • included lifetime retreatment at LaserVue
  • Lower cost than PLEC for remote patients.
  • More responsive pre-op service / communication / scheduling than PLEC. Especially LaserVue's Refractive Coordinator "Danielle".

The Con's of LaserVue in comparison to PLEC
  • LaserVue laser is 1/2 the speed of PLEC, w/o "predictive tracking (7th Dimension). but sampling rate is the same.
  • LaserVue probably does fewer surgeries.
  • LaserVue's surgeons' reputations are not quite as publicly burnished as PLECs. They didn't help design the laser, still have a strong relationship w/ Schwind.
  • LaserVue's pre/post protocols seem a bit less conservative than PLECs

I'm taking my fish oil now.
I'm excited about this after 30 years of RGPs, dust, mucus, falling off the pupil, starbursts, and halos.

I'll update here with any new information from my experience.
Ideally, my next update is "everything went as expected and I am able to see!".
Newbie
Apr 8, 2019
14 posts
5 upvotes
Endeav wrote: Yes I can confirm that I was transferred to TLC Yonge Eglinton. At the time, I called Nvision and they were closed, I was directed to call TLC Yonge Eglinton and the director there said that they were adopting Machat's Nvision patients. I did indeed have my enhancement done on April 23rd 2019, however I've not followed up to see if I would still be covered for a touch-up in the future. Maybe you should try to speak to Dr. Machat? Were you an Nvision or Crystal clear patient?
Thanks for the reply and info. I was an Nvision patient but the documentation I received still had the Crystal Clear branding.

I'll dig a little further with TLC, not sure if I'll find a direct contact for Dr. Machat though. No issues with my vision at the moment, just want to know where I stand in future.

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