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[Merged] Windows/Doors

Newbie
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Feb 17, 2020
31 posts
1 upvote
Toronto
I am so upset that I forgot my question.
In order to save some money can I buy a Masonite or a Jen Weld door (full glass) from Home Depot, Lowes, etc ? It's the small 37" X 82" back door.
Are they decent ?

Thanks a lot !
Deal Addict
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Dec 24, 2006
3171 posts
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Barrie
Jerico wrote: You are the worst of all worlds…. Custom shaped transom (which in clear glass is already $3500+ for product only), custom slab for door (the 42”, which you should absolutely do) and then sidelites that arent a common 12/14/17”. $14k is not a surprise at all.
Well, that is ridiculous...hahahah...I can't fathom spending the cost of an entry-level brand-new car (2023 MITSUBISHI MIRAGE) on a front door. That is preposterous.
Deal Addict
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Apr 21, 2016
1233 posts
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GTA
Daniel4321 wrote: I am so upset that I forgot my question.
In order to save some money can I buy a Masonite or a Jen Weld door (full glass) from Home Depot, Lowes, etc ? It's the small 37" X 82" back door.
Are they decent ?

Thanks a lot !
The only place I'd install a Masonite door or a Jeld Wen door would be my garden shed or Timmins.

Having said that, I've installed both as favours. The Jeld Wen lasted 3 years before the seals failed and Masonite is going on 8 years and still looks fine.

A lot of the issues with both come down to finer details that the average homeowner wouldn't consider or even think about. I'll try to give you an overview though

Masonite
The frame on a Masonite is slightly thinner and is more prone to warping and distorting if you don't know what you are doing during an installation.
In addition, it is actually very fragile being held together at the top with 2 (usually poorly done) staples and a single screw and 2 staples at the bottom.
The door material itself is slightly thinner than a Novatech for example and therefore easier to dent
Some of their doors are still filled with styrofoam rather than low density foam
The hinges are cheap beyond belief
The door is actually slightly thinner (3/4 Vs 7/8) in depth than most other doors and their rail and stile configurations leave something to be desired.
Their frames are prone to rot at the bottom because most are shipped unchalked and have a really cheap primer applied at most.
Some of their frames are made of a wood product called "Sum Guard" which indicates that the frame itself is actually a coated MDF.
The inserts themselves leak and if your door is exposed to rain or snow, it has a tendency to get into the door and eventually the door will rot out at the bottom
The sweeps are dirt cheap, prone to failure and icing and are not fun to replace.

Jeld Wen
I have never seen a consumer purchase door pass 5 years without problems.
Newbie
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Feb 17, 2020
31 posts
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Toronto
OMG, it's very clear that those doors are garbage and very expensive for what they offer (is like changing the doors every 5 or 8 years)
The Inline fiberglass quote is roughly 15,000.00+tax, tho doors
68" * 81" 2 sidelites, full glass and 37" * 82" full glass
Deal Guru
Jan 25, 2007
12695 posts
7861 upvotes
Paris
RunnerForDeals wrote: Well, that is ridiculous...hahahah...I can't fathom spending the cost of an entry-level brand-new car (2023 MITSUBISHI MIRAGE) on a front door. That is preposterous.
And yet, it happens every day by the thousands.

I dont disagree that door prices are insane, but they are what they are. I looked back 2 years ago when door prices started to take off and a reasonable single front door painted and installed was $2200+HST in 2015. Same door mid 2020 was $3050+HST. We didnt change our install price from 2015 to 2020, so that was ALL increases in product pricing.

Every year window prices were going up 5-8% and door prices were climbing 15-20%. A white garden door with one side active and clear glass installed in 2015 was $2200, 2020 it was $4000.
Deal Addict
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Apr 21, 2016
1233 posts
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RunnerForDeals wrote: Are there any good exterior door manufacturers that are currently not gauging on pricing doe the north part of GTA?

I need a new entry door (current one is builder grade and 13 years old and leaky) but was quoted $14k and fell off my chair...
Last thing you'll want to hear.

When I quickly run it through my systems I end up at 12.8K +tax based on 12" sidelights (S10) and a full door glass with all glass being sandblasted & multipoint locking system. Remove the transom and you drop to $9,960+tax
If you want to make it cheaper then you start looking at eliminating the transom by cladding it on the inside and drywalling over it on the inside.

And to add to your stress, door and windows both will be seeing price increases come January in the 8-10% range
Deal Guru
Jan 25, 2007
12695 posts
7861 upvotes
Paris
missymouse wrote:
Jeld Wen
I have never seen a consumer purchase door pass 5 years without problems.
Jeld Wen is the biggest joke of all the companies I have ever been involved with. Masonite is a close second.
Deal Guru
Jan 25, 2007
12695 posts
7861 upvotes
Paris
Daniel4321 wrote: I am so upset that I forgot my question.
In order to save some money can I buy a Masonite or a Jen Weld door (full glass) from Home Depot, Lowes, etc ? It's the small 37" X 82" back door.
Are they decent ?

Thanks a lot !
Dorplex makes a lower cost white only door. I compromised and used one one of the bottom of my shop as I couldnt bring myself to pay $1500 more for a 42” in black on a door I will never see.
Deal Addict
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Dec 24, 2006
3171 posts
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Barrie
Jerico wrote: And yet, it happens every day by the thousands.

I dont disagree that door prices are insane, but they are what they are. I looked back 2 years ago when door prices started to take off and a reasonable single front door painted and installed was $2200+HST in 2015. Same door mid 2020 was $3050+HST. We didnt change our install price from 2015 to 2020, so that was ALL increases in product pricing.

Every year window prices were going up 5-8% and door prices were climbing 15-20%. A white garden door with one side active and clear glass installed in 2015 was $2200, 2020 it was $4000.
missymouse wrote: Last thing you'll want to hear.

When I quickly run it through my systems I end up at 12.8K +tax based on 12" sidelights (S10) and a full door glass with all glass being sandblasted & multipoint locking system. Remove the transom and you drop to $9,960+tax
If you want to make it cheaper then you start looking at eliminating the transom by cladding it on the inside and drywalling over it on the inside.

And to add to your stress, door and windows both will be seeing price increases come January in the 8-10% range
Thank you both for the information. A new front door will not be in my future then.
Deal Guru
Jan 25, 2007
12695 posts
7861 upvotes
Paris
RunnerForDeals wrote: Thank you both for the information. A new front door will not be in my future then.
A note to you and anyone else reading this forum while house hunting… never buy a house with a shaped window.
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Apr 21, 2016
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Jerico wrote: A note to you and anyone else reading this forum while house hunting… never buy a house with a shaped window.
Or false windows
Deal Guru
Jan 25, 2007
12695 posts
7861 upvotes
Paris
missymouse wrote: Or false windows
Had a guy with 3 shaped false windows. What an expensive nightmare.
Newbie
User avatar
Feb 17, 2020
31 posts
1 upvote
Toronto
Thanks Jerico and Missymouse for the info.

I remember that people here don't have a good opinion about the fiberglass windows or door. Is a fiberglass door worth roughly $1,500.00-2,000.00 more than a metal one ?

I'm asking this because the metal door went from 6,500.00 last summer to 7,000-8,000 now which is totally absurd.

A fiberglass door has more glass surface than the metal ones, is that better or worst that a metal one in terms of insulation.

Thanks!
Deal Guru
Jan 25, 2007
12695 posts
7861 upvotes
Paris
Daniel4321 wrote: This is the fiberglass door that I want to get
https://postimg.cc/njCzkw3P
I dont know enough to answer your question to be honest. My take on fibreglass doors in the past has been non-favourable due to seasonal movement and extra expense. The only time I would do fibreglass is if someone wanted the wood stained look. All the fibreglass doors I have sold used standard window inserts that could also go into a steel door, or no glass at all.

I will say that door doesnt look like it has enough frame to be your daily opener. It looks like one of those moderate climate doors from California where their temp swings arent -40 to +40
Newbie
User avatar
Feb 17, 2020
31 posts
1 upvote
Toronto
Thanks,
That image was a photoshop exercise to figure out how's gonna look.
Here's a real door from the showroom, the frames are thin indeed, which looks better than a metal door, but that's a matter of taste.
https://postimg.cc/ZvzVdLyv
Deal Guru
Jan 25, 2007
12695 posts
7861 upvotes
Paris
Daniel4321 wrote: Thanks,
That image was a photoshop exercise to figure out how's gonna look.
Here's a real door from the showroom, the frames are thin indeed, which looks better than a metal door, but that's a matter of taste.
https://postimg.cc/ZvzVdLyv
Ah. That looks a lot like the swing doors from Sunview that are based on patio door hardware. I have not heard good things, but they are vinyl.
Deal Guru
Jan 25, 2007
12695 posts
7861 upvotes
Paris
Daniel4321 wrote: Thanks,
That image was a photoshop exercise to figure out how's gonna look.
Here's a real door from the showroom, the frames are thin indeed, which looks better than a metal door, but that's a matter of taste.
https://postimg.cc/ZvzVdLyv
Ah. That looks a lot like the swing doors from Sunview that are based on patio door hardware. I have not heard good things, but they are vinyl.
Deal Addict
User avatar
Apr 21, 2016
1233 posts
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GTA
Daniel4321 wrote: Thanks Jerico and Missymouse for the info.

I remember that people here don't have a good opinion about the fiberglass windows or door. Is a fiberglass door worth roughly $1,500.00-2,000.00 more than a metal one ?

I'm asking this because the metal door went from 6,500.00 last summer to 7,000-8,000 now which is totally absurd.

A fiberglass door has more glass surface than the metal ones, is that better or worst that a metal one in terms of insulation.

Thanks!
This always seems like a repeat of Ground Hog Day.

First, when I go and take a look through their online gallery I'm seeing Novatech and Masonite slabs. The same for the glass they display, it's Novatech, Trimlight, Fusion and maybe Milanio.

The "wish" [pictures are a no go and I would be amazed if they were actually real doors. Take a look at the bottom rails, there is absolutely no strength there period. This door would twist and fail within weeks.

Onto the next thing the insulation factor. For a start, steel and fibreglass share the same U-factor ratings for full, 3/4 half glass units and sidelights. There is no difference. You get NO increased insulation from a fibreglass door whatsoever.
Then let's look at "why you should spend more on fibreglass. "Because it doesn't dent." That's about it. But it does chip and scratch and warp. As a matter of fact, most door manufacturers still insist on a multipoint lock system on a fibreglass door specifically because it warps. Then you have the "acceptable warpage" factor before replacement under warranty. That number is twice for fibreglass over steel.

But even after all that, you missed the simplest check. What is the warranty on their doors compared to the rest of the industry? Well, it's half.

So why is fibreglass pushed? Cheaper to transport, lighter, and fewer accidents in the plant. easier to cut and shape. No chance of water damage on unfinished products. When 1st introduced they were hand stained a tedious 3-day process and now it's a spray-on finish whether wood grained or solid.

If you want a fibreglass door I will sell you one and thank you as will my bank account. Are you getting a superior product? Not in my opinion
Jr. Member
Nov 10, 2021
137 posts
22 upvotes
Hi Windowguy,

Read your earlier posts from 2009; hope you are still in this forum.
I am looking to replace my windows in spring; is it too early to start getting quotations now?
What is the average cost per window in Toronto?
What should I be looking for in good windows? R value, energy star , wood vs aluminium, etc?

Any value for money companies that you could recommend?

Thanks very much!

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