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New Furnace / Central Air Conditioner Time??

[OP]
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Mar 13, 2004
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Ontario

New Furnace / Central Air Conditioner Time??

UPDATE On New Furnace: https://forums.redflagdeals.com/new-fur ... #p31618823

Hello All,

Furnace died yesterday and I think i have it diagnosed down to the Gas Valve, either way I have a tech coming by later today to confirm and provide a price to repair have also heard it could cost $500-$1,000 to replace the gas valve?

Assuming the price is high we may consider replacing our 11-12 year old York Affinity 9.S 80k btu. As it has given us a bunch of problems due to being oversized (1,200sq house) as the contractor Belcomfort who installed the unit had no idea what they were doing and improperly sized it for our home & then blamed it on vents and so on.

So IF we were to replace it I definitely will not go with York or Belcomfort again but wondering whats the average cost going around? Looking for a 2 stage, 60,000btu furnace. Was thinking Goodman possibly, also got to see what the tech will offer me later if we decide to replace it.

Thanks

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Last edited by sickcars on Mar 24th, 2022 5:15 pm, edited 5 times in total.
970 replies
Deal Fanatic
Mar 10, 2004
6958 posts
4573 upvotes
Another "happy" York customer.
I have a 95% efficiency 100K BTU modulating York Affinity furnace - I am in year 12 of ownership. So far the blower motor has been replaced twice (I am on my third) and the pressure switch has been replaced 3 times (I am on my 4th).
Would I buy another York HVAC product? Nope.
I am certainly getting my money's worth from the HVAC service plan.
[OP]
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User avatar
Mar 13, 2004
13227 posts
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Ontario
haha yup so happy!

I have done that pressure switch I think 3 times, Venting Motor once. & now maybe a gas valve or something else, who knows. But may change it out if its to expensive to fix this hunk of metal.
plymouthhater wrote: Another "happy" York customer.
I have a 95% efficiency 100K BTU modulating York Affinity furnace - I am in year 12 of ownership. So far the blower motor has been replaced twice (I am on my third) and the pressure switch has been replaced 3 times (I am on my 4th).
Would I buy another York HVAC product? Nope.
I am certainly getting my money's worth from the HVAC service plan.
Deal Expert
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Dec 12, 2009
25568 posts
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Toronto
I would go with the repair as new would likely be in the $4k or higher range. No point spending 4x more when there should be plenty of life left in the furnace. I just had the ECM motor replaced on my 11 year old furnace. It was rather painful but much less so than a new furnace.

Edit: I change my mind on the suggestion seeing how your furnace appears to be a bit of a lemon. In my case, I have only had a pressure switch replacement on warranty. I had to clean the flame sensor myself once.
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[OP]
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Mar 13, 2004
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Ontario
True it may be cheaper however after dealing with this thing for the past 11ish years it may not be worth it. In the winter we cant put the furnace past 72-73f because it will trip the high limit and turn off heat then we wake up with a freezing cold house. Furnace is over sized for the house causing issues.
will888 wrote: I would go with the repair as new would likely be in the $4k or higher range. No point spending 4x more when there should be plenty of life left in the furnace. I just had the ECM motor replaced on my 11 year old furnace. It was rather painful but much less so than a new furnace.

Edit: I change my mind on the suggestion seeing how your furnace appears to be a bit of a lemon. In my case, I have only had a pressure switch replacement on warranty. I had to clean the flame sensor myself once.
Deal Addict
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Aug 12, 2007
4685 posts
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Waterloo
sickcars wrote: True it may be cheaper however after dealing with this thing for the past 11ish years it may not be worth it. In the winter we cant put the furnace past 72-73f because it will trip the high limit and turn off heat then we wake up with a freezing cold house. Furnace is over sized for the house causing issues.
I might be wrong, but the high limit is tripping due to insufficient airflow.

Are you replacing your air filters regularly? or does it get clogged within a few days? If it gets clogged with in a few weeks see if you can switch to a bigger filter.
are you closing vents?

If your furnace is tripping high limit someone should have explained that its because of airflow issues.
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Sr. Member
Mar 7, 2008
721 posts
196 upvotes
Leask
I use three Lennox and one Bryan furnaces in my lifetime.

I would definitely go with Bryan over Lennox. That’s just me.

Goodman seems like a good affordable approach too.

York I would never buy... review is absolutely horrible.

Also, I would stick with the basic and go with two stage furnace with single speed fan. Ecm and variable gas valve just seems to go bad sooner.
Last edited by THINKPOD on Oct 18th, 2019 1:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
[OP]
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Mar 13, 2004
13227 posts
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Generally in the winter I cannot run an air filter because it does effect airflow and trips the high limit sooner. Its likely due to smaller duct sizes (older home) and oversized furnace. Our next furnace will be 2 stage 60k btu VS single stage 80k btu we have now, to help with this issue

We have opened up a larger air return & an exhaust which has helped but still have the issue.
Supahhh wrote: I might be wrong, but the high limit is tripping due to insufficient airflow.

Are you replacing your air filters regularly? or does it get clogged within a few days? If it gets clogged with in a few weeks see if you can switch to a bigger filter.
are you closing vents?

If your furnace is tripping high limit someone should have explained that its because of airflow issues.
Sr. Member
Aug 29, 2005
756 posts
256 upvotes
anyone has any idea about american standard furnace?
Deal Addict
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Aug 12, 2007
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sickcars wrote: Generally in the winter I cannot run an air filter because it does effect airflow and trips the high limit sooner. Its likely due to smaller duct sizes (older home) and oversized furnace. Our next furnace will be 2 stage 60k btu VS single stage 80k btu we have now, to help with this issue

We have opened up a larger air return & an exhaust which has helped but still have the issue.
:facepalm:

you never run a furnace without a filter. It leads to ..... buildup of debris on the heatexchanger leading to .... less efficient heat transfer... leading to high temperature tripping.

you need to get your furnace cleaned and replace your airfilter housing so it accepts a bigger filter. ( You would need to do replace your filter housing even if you get a new furnace )

When they refer to an oversized furnace, it means it would cycle more frequently on and off. it does not describe your situation and problems.
Your issue is an undersized filter assembly from what I can make out.
Last edited by Supahhh on Oct 18th, 2019 1:49 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Deal Expert
Jan 27, 2006
20742 posts
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Vancouver, BC
Supahhh wrote: :facepalm:

you never run a furnace without a filter. It leads to ..... buildup of debris on the heatexchanger leading to .... less efficient heat transfer... leading to high temperature tripping.

you need to get your furnace cleaned and replace your airfilter housing so it accepts a bigger filter.
Don't forget that the debris also builds up on the other components in the airflow as well such as the blower motors.
[OP]
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Mar 13, 2004
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Ontario
It also cycles on and off often.

Ever since we got the furnace from the beginning and it was brand new it was still hitting the high limit & short cycling. We run filters in the summer and currently have a filter currently in the furnace however once it gets really cold we run into issues and I remove it.
Supahhh wrote: :facepalm:

you never run a furnace without a filter. It leads to ..... buildup of debris on the heatexchanger leading to .... less efficient heat transfer... leading to high temperature tripping.

you need to get your furnace cleaned and replace your airfilter housing so it accepts a bigger filter. ( You would need to do replace your filter housing even if you get a new furnace )

When they refer to an oversized furnace, it means it would cycle more frequently on and off. it does not describe your situation and problems.
Your issue is an undersized filter assembly from what I can make out.
[OP]
Deal Guru
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Mar 13, 2004
13227 posts
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I check the blower yearly and its pretty clean. Not to dusty in our home.
craftsman wrote: Don't forget that the debris also builds up on the other components in the airflow as well such as the blower motors.
[OP]
Deal Guru
User avatar
Mar 13, 2004
13227 posts
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Ontario
Tech just left,

Tested it and said its the Gas Valve. It is getting the 24v & everything else looks good. he said he would get me an exact cost and let me know so he can order it.

After he left I was just wiping away some dust and also pushed in all the connectors on the motherboard then closed it up and turned on and now of course its working..... gonna keep an eye on it and see if it fails again.
Jr. Member
Jan 12, 2006
122 posts
33 upvotes
Toronto
Have a high efficiency American Standard (97%) for 11 years and no issues. The research I did before buying was indicating good reliability and so far it hasn't disappointed.
Deal Addict
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Aug 12, 2007
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Waterloo
sickcars wrote: Tech just left,

Tested it and said its the Gas Valve. It is getting the 24v & everything else looks good. he said he would get me an exact cost and let me know so he can order it.

After he left I was just wiping away some dust and also pushed in all the connectors on the motherboard then closed it up and turned on and now of course its working..... gonna keep an eye on it and see if it fails again.
ask him to give a quote on a bigger filter install.
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[OP]
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Mar 13, 2004
13227 posts
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Ontario
So furnace is acting up again, however I think its another issue. I think we may decide to replace the furnace.

The idea is to start getting quotes for a 60,000btu, 2 stage furnace. I think with a ECM motor? That is the one that can detect/compensate for undersized duct work and so on correct?
Also now we need to decide on a decent reliable brand that hopefully does not have super expensive parts. From my research I'm leaning toward Goodman since its also the same company as Amana which is supposed to be pretty good but without the name/higher price.
Sr. Member
Aug 8, 2007
669 posts
519 upvotes
There are Kijiji ads on GTA to install a 60k two stage ecm Goodman for $2k cash. Goodman was not much if any better than York a few years ago but I have heard they are much better now but not a long track record to really confirm. Not many differences between Amana and Goodman except for warranty and name plate and the warranty for both depends on the model so may not be different. If you go with one of the $2k guys I would like to know how it went as it mostly depends on the installer so getting a guy in a small shop who knows what they are doing vs a big shop that outsources can make a big difference in satisfaction.
[OP]
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Mar 13, 2004
13227 posts
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Ontario
Yes from my research and a few techs that I talked to now goodman is pretty much the same as Amana and the quality is much better then what it used to be 10 years ago.

So I got my new furnace installed almost a week ago, I ended up getting 7 different quotes from companies and in the end I went with a company called Fair Deal Heating & Air Conditioning - https://homestars.com/companies/2876286 ... nditioning the owner is actually on RFD for anybody who is interested in a quote.

So after calling a bunch of companies he was the only company that answered all my questions (multiple ones), I actually had some companies stop replying after 1 or 2 questions which may reflect their customer service when I have an issue. Then I had 1 or 2 companies bashing goodman and trying to push their own brand they sold which I think was very unprofessional.

So after going through these companies I called in Fair Deal Heating & Air Conditioning & Ash came by the same day I asked him to so he could view our setup. Now at this point I was set on a 2 stage 60,000btu furnace (Coming from an 80,000btu furnace which was very over sized for our home and lots of issues) Once he was over he had a look at our current setup, measured some duct work and explained to me he highly recommends going with a 40,000btu due to restricted/small duct work in our home which is another reason why we had been having lots of issues with our old furnace. At first I was reluctant to drop down to 40,000btu thinking our home would not heat up enough and be cold however after he explained it all he made sense and I agreed. Also after talking some more we decided to add a new humidifier (since ours never worked) & new filter box.

Ash was ready to send his 2 workers 2 days later to install our new furnace however I threw an odd request at him, I needed the old furnace removed the night before so I could parge the wall around it with cement & add some insulation since its going to be the last time for many years where we will have the chance to do this. That night his crew passed by and removed the old furnace for us without any questions at no extra cost!. The next day they showed up in the morning when they said they would and installed the new furnace and did some custom duct work. While installing they noticed the old HVAC company that was here did not even glue some of the joints in the intake and exhaust pipes it clearly shows that the prior company Belcomfort did not care or want to fully resolve all the issues we had and always made excuses.

In the end the furnace was installed properly, we ran it on stage 2 for about 45min without any issues, where our old one would of cut heat after 15min or so. The crew cleaned up after themselves, took all the garbage & ash even came out a few days later to fully inspect and check over the install & to answer any questions and make sure we were satisfied with everything. I was very happy with this experience & would highly recommend Fair Deal Heating & Air Conditioning one of the few guys that actually had proper customer service & sized the furnace properly to our home. I would much rather support a smaller HVAC company like this that takes their time and does it properly then these bigger guys who dont reply or down talk other brands.

As for warranty I paid a little extra for 10yr parts & Labor from Goodman, I can call the installer or I can call any other Goodman tech and they will bill goodman for everything which is great. This was not the cheapest company I could of gone with they were also not the most expensive & I did not want that as installation is most important and I feel they did a great job.

EYEAM2COOL4U wrote: There are Kijiji ads on GTA to install a 60k two stage ecm Goodman for $2k cash. Goodman was not much if any better than York a few years ago but I have heard they are much better now but not a long track record to really confirm. Not many differences between Amana and Goodman except for warranty and name plate and the warranty for both depends on the model so may not be different. If you go with one of the $2k guys I would like to know how it went as it mostly depends on the installer so getting a guy in a small shop who knows what they are doing vs a big shop that outsources can make a big difference in satisfaction.
Last edited by sickcars on Apr 7th, 2020 5:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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