Travel

Norwegian joins many cruise lines to require guests to be fully vaccinated

  • Last Updated:
  • Apr 10th, 2021 10:57 pm
Deal Guru
May 9, 2007
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PointsHubby wrote: The virus is still circulating
It’s looking for new hosts
** And it will mutate to make that happen
Viruses are not "looking for" anything. Viruses have no cognition or intentionality.

Viruses do not "mutate to make that happen". They have no ability to modify their genetics. The make up of some individual instances of a virus simply mutate randomly. That mutation might confer an evolutionary advantage or an evolutionary disadvantage. Those mutated instances that have an advantage are more likely to reproduce; those that have a disadvantage are less likely to reproduce.

A virus is less than a non-thinking lifeform. A virus is not even alive. It is a non-thinking non-lifeform.

Are viruses alive?
The usual answer to this question (and usually for the purpose of passing your Biology GCSEs) is that viruses are not alive, because they do not complete all of the seven life processes: Movement, Respiration, Sensitivity, Nutrition, Excretion, Reproduction and Growth.
A virus is not something evil seeking out human, or other, victims and outsmarting us.
Global warming will be exceeded during the 21st century unless deep reductions in carbon dioxide (CO2) and other greenhouse gas emissions occur (United Nations IPCC Report 2021)

Every disaster film starts with scientists being ignored
Deal Expert
Feb 7, 2017
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MexiCanuck wrote: Viruses are not "looking for" anything. Viruses have no cognition or intentionality.

Viruses do not "mutate to make that happen". They have no ability to modify their genetics. The make up of some individual instances of a virus simply mutate randomly. That mutation might confer an evolutionary advantage or an evolutionary disadvantage. Those mutated instances that have an advantage are more likely to reproduce; those that have a disadvantage are less likely to reproduce.

A virus is less than a non-thinking lifeform. A virus is not even alive. It is a non-thinking non-lifeform.

Are viruses alive?



A virus is not something evil seeking out human, or other, victims and outsmarting us.
A virus is most definitely a parasite ... seeking out a host. So your first & last statement is false.

Living organism vs not ... well that POV is debatable ...

https://www.newscientist.com/question/a ... ses-alive/
Viruses are microscopic parasites responsible for a host of familiar – and often fatal – diseases, including the flu, Ebola, measles and HIV. They are made up of DNA or RNA encapsulated in a protein shell and can only survive and replicate inside a living host, which could be any organism on earth. This means no life form is safe from infection by a virus.

So are viruses ‘alive’? The answer is not as straightforward as you may think.

Since viruses were first discovered in 1892 by Dmitri Ivanovsky, our ideas of what they are have shifted from poisons to biological chemicals. Some years after their discovery, scientists first raised the idea that viruses were living – albeit simple – organisms because they caused diseases like bacteria, which we know to be alive.
Deal Guru
May 9, 2007
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PointsHubby wrote: A virus is most definitely a parasite ... seeking out a host. So your first & last statement is false.
A virus has no means of mobility. A virus drifts wherever it is propelled by other forces. It cannot direct itself by appendages or other means. It is pushed about like a dandelion seed, or snow or smoke or dust or pollen. Help me to understand how something that has no ability to move itself or to direct its motion resulting from other forces, can “seek out” anything.
Global warming will be exceeded during the 21st century unless deep reductions in carbon dioxide (CO2) and other greenhouse gas emissions occur (United Nations IPCC Report 2021)

Every disaster film starts with scientists being ignored
Deal Addict
Jan 30, 2013
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IceBlueShoes wrote: The PM's comment on a vaccine passport was in regards to domestic matters, not international. We have no sovereignty or real say in the matters of other nations.
other countries like eu uk or japan can simply refuse entries to those who chose not to vaccinate
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Nov 13, 2013
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sponge5307 wrote: Well they won't be used in Canada as JT said that he had no plans to issue any Vaccine passport since he claims it is unfair for those who opt not to take the vaccine.

I feel if people don't want to take it is their business but it just means they just can't travel to place that require prof they have the vaccine. By refusing to provide any doc to show we who have taken the vaccine is really unfair for us. Why should the rest of us suffer?
I Think that quote is old. It will be forced on us if others, especially the US, start requiring them. I think as it’s official use will be borders it would be a federal product rather than provincial.

In the news today: https://globalnews.ca/news/7740821/covi ... ada-rules/
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Aug 26, 2001
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StatsGuy wrote: interesting how they will enforce it as florida, texas which are all big cruise embarkation states banned vaccine passports
just another reason to avoid cruises going forward

a way to stop giving a share of my wallet to these QAnon anti-vaxxer states like Florida and Texas
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Nov 6, 2010
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Somewhat related, but I thought this video was super insightful in terms of understanding the logistics madness that the cruise companies went through during COVID and it does briefly speak of the the vaccination requirements towards the end. I never realized the logistics required to bring all their staff members back home after all the flights/borders were closed and what the needs were to keep the ships "in storage" until cruising could start again.

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goldenball wrote: other countries like eu uk or japan can simply refuse entries to those who chose not to vaccinate
Not a bad idea and something that I hope we would do as well.
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Jul 7, 2017
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uber_shnitz wrote: I'm overall in favor of vaccination passports, but it does open the door potentially to some stuff we've not really done so far.
Clinical vaccination and tourism are linked but rarely if ever enforced at the border. If you can make a case for COVID being infectious enough to warrant a check before entering a country, why wouldn't you also want it for other potentially harmful diseases? Will passports then just become a vaccination booklet? Will I not be allowed into a country if I haven't taken my malaria, HIV or other vaccination? It's probable they wouldn't go that far, but a precedent is a precedent and then you'd definitely have potentially ripple effects as countries like the US (or developing nations) that don't give free vaccinations to their population (or are only doing it for COVID) may negatively impact those people's abilities to travel for leisure or for new work opportunities.

The counter argument is that border officers are allowed to deny visas/access to their country to non-citizens for whatever reason they see fit (as non-citizens aren't entitled to a right to enter).
Not as contagious. In the past, vaccinations (yellow inoculation passport being the vaccine passport of its day) have been required (and were checked at borders) for highly-contagious diseases such as for small pox (until it was eradicated thanks to vaccination) and yellow fever (still required to this day but usually not checked until there's an outbreak somewhere). I was too young to recall polio (before my time, perhaps). SARS COVID 2 is being treated like one of these.
I smile when I see container ships sailing past my house laden with stuff made in China
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thriftshopper wrote: Not as contagious. In the past, vaccinations (yellow inoculation passport being the vaccine passport of its day) have been required (and were checked at borders) for highly-contagious diseases such as for small pox (until it was eradicated thanks to vaccination) and yellow fever (still required to this day but usually not checked until there's an outbreak somewhere). I was too young to recall polio (before my time, perhaps). SARS COVID 2 is being treated like one of these.
As long as they can agree on an international standard it could work and personally I would be all for it.
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Dec 1, 2020
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uber_shnitz wrote: Have there been any updates on a "standard" for vaccination confirmations globally?

Kind of similar to how most countries don't accept foreign IDs other than passports, I feel like if there isn't some form of standardization that fakes will start popping out all over the place and without a standard to verify against, it will be much more difficult to verify authenticity.
I agree. But if you have a yellow fever vaccine, you probably would be surprised that there is pretty much no security features and its official and could be faked easily. But that would be incredibly stupid....but possible.
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uber_shnitz wrote: As long as they can agree on an international standard it could work and personally I would be all for it.
No. It would easily be faked like the few international vaccine standards out there. I'm aware of only 1
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Jun 8, 2005
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smokescreen15 wrote: Internet Historian is god-level legend status.

IH and All Gas, No Brakes make the best content on Youtube.
Randomly went into this thread and randomly got a tip for IH. Thanks for the tip!

Shame about All Gas No Brakes, presumably the talent behind it will reform with a new name.
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Jun 12, 2007
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StatsGuy wrote: interesting how they will enforce it as florida, texas which are all big cruise embarkation states banned vaccine passports
Aren't cruise ships controlled under US federal law? While the port itself would be under state law, as soon as you step on board = federal law
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trane0 wrote: Randomly went into this thread and randomly got a tip for IH. Thanks for the tip!

Shame about All Gas No Brakes, presumably the talent behind it will reform with a new name.
I was wondering why new videos weren't posted. Sounds like he signed a raw deal (45k salary + with 20% profit sharing of patreon revenue).

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