Real Estate

The Official Mortgage Rates Thread

Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Feb 2, 2014
7569 posts
2022 upvotes
Toronto
QWTYLP wrote: I'm starting to shop for a mortage right now and have a few questions.

1. I'm getting told by one of the brokers I'm shopping around with that I can normally get a better rate with a shorter rate hold. Is this normal industry practice?

2. I'm being quoted 2.29% rate for a 60 day hold from one broker, and a 2.34% rate for a 120 day hold from another broker. Unfortunately, my closing date is still up in the air and may be slightly beyond 120 days. My purchase is part of a multi-building strata with my building closing last, and my closing date depend on the other buildings not having any problems in the closing process. Even with this in mind, the marketer is asking me to secure a mortgage and lawyer now. Is this a good advice or is it too early for me to try to secure a rate hold?

3. unfortunately, I am looking for a smallish mortgage and don't qualify for the absolute lowest being touted around such as 2.18/2.19%. Would it make sense for me to commit to the higher 2.34% rate now for 120 days rolling forward, or should I wait until it is less than 60 days from my closing and try to get the lowest rate possible (assuming question 1 is correct)? I don't foresee rates going up in the near future, but I suppose anything can happen since the US seems to be looking to raise interest rates. Bank of Canada may follow.

Any help is appreciated.
1. Yes, shorter terms to carry lower rates, as the interest rate yield curve is higher in later years.
2. How far away is your closing date? Are you signing the purchase agreement now? If so, a pre-approval should suffice. You won't get a rate hold (at least at competitive rates) now if the closing date is far in advance.
3. How much is the mortgage amount and when is the closing date?
Kevin Somnauth, CFA
Principal Broker - First Toronto Mortgage - MA (Ontario #13176, BC #X301007)
Real Estate Salesperson - Century 21 Innovative
Deal Addict
User avatar
Dec 1, 2015
1966 posts
918 upvotes
Etobicoke, ON
1 - While not the norm, some lenders indeed offer slightly lower rates for shorter rate guarantee periods. So, Industrial Alliance for example will offer a certain rate for 30 days, or a higher rate for 90 days. ICICI has a better rate for deals closing in 60 days than a deal closing in 120 days. Some lenders will give you 90 or 120 days on their best rate.
2 - Depending on your location, you may get 2.24% valid for 120 days. If the closing date ends up being past that mark, you can get a new approval later on.
3 - Very few lenders will demand higher mortgage amounts in order to offer low rates... often, I see certain brokers using misleading offers and creating those limitations themselves. A lender with a 90 days rate guarantee at 2.19% today has a minimum $50k mortgage.. any amount over $50k gets the same rate.
QWTYLP wrote: I'm starting to shop for a mortage right now and have a few questions.

1. I'm getting told by one of the brokers I'm shopping around with that I can normally get a better rate with a shorter rate hold. Is this normal industry practice?

2. I'm being quoted 2.29% rate for a 60 day hold from one broker, and a 2.34% rate for a 120 day hold from another broker. Unfortunately, my closing date is still up in the air and may be slightly beyond 120 days. My purchase is part of a multi-building strata with my building closing last, and my closing date depend on the other buildings not having any problems in the closing process. Even with this in mind, the marketer is asking me to secure a mortgage and lawyer now. Is this a good advice or is it too early for me to try to secure a rate hold?

3. unfortunately, I am looking for a smallish mortgage and don't qualify for the absolute lowest being touted around such as 2.18/2.19%. Would it make sense for me to commit to the higher 2.34% rate now for 120 days rolling forward, or should I wait until it is less than 60 days from my closing and try to get the lowest rate possible (assuming question 1 is correct)? I don't foresee rates going up in the near future, but I suppose anything can happen since the US seems to be looking to raise interest rates. Bank of Canada may follow.

Any help is appreciated.
Andre Oliveira - Mortgage Agent at Valuemortgage
2018 Top 20 National - Mortgage Intelligence
FSCO # 10428
Newbie
Sep 15, 2016
9 posts
halifax
Has anyone watched different lenders and how their variable rates react to Bank of Canada lending rate changes?

Charts show that the last two .25% drops in the BoC overnight rates corresponded with maybe .12-.15% drops in prime mortgage lending rates.

So if someone has a variable rate mortgage that is prime -.7% at the beginning of the term, how will the variable rate react to say a .25% BoC interest rate increase or decrease? Would it automatically increase or decrease .25% or would it move according to whatever your lender decided?

Also lets say your lender's normal rate through brokers was 2.09% but they buy it down to 1.99%, so a .1% discount, would the variable interest rate keep that discount the entire time (a little redundant question, but a slight difference).

Also, when the end of the terms comes around and it comes time to renew what rate can you generally offered from lenders? I ask out of concern for transfer or discharge fees. Let's say I am with a lender. I got my mortgage from them through a broker who got me a .2% discount on their rate. So 2.19% instead of 2.39%. Let's say at the end of the term the lender's rates are still the same and the lender sends me directly an offer to renew at 2.39% and they won't budge, so I approach a broker who gets me a 2.19% rate with the same lender (the same as got at the beginning of the term). Is that a typical situation? In that case are there discharge fees involved? The situation doesn't make sense to me since the lender could avoid the broker fees and give the discounted rate in the first place but I have heard strange stories while reading about mortgages.

Thanks for any input.

Also, what are the better/best rates I should look for on a 2 or 3 year fixed or variable mortgage (20% down)?
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Sep 13, 2011
5168 posts
2056 upvotes
Toronto
redkulat wrote: Meridian seems to be offering the lowest rate for a 5 year fixed mortgage (2.44%). Any one have experiences with Meridian?
Not even close to being the lowest actually. You can get a 5 year fixed at 2.19% through any regular posting broker on this board.
Paul Meredith
Mortgage Broker, Author
CityCan Financial Corp (lic. 10532)
Deal Addict
User avatar
Feb 1, 2009
3154 posts
1931 upvotes
Toronto
PaulMeredith wrote:
redkulat wrote: Meridian seems to be offering the lowest rate for a 5 year fixed mortgage (2.44%). Any one have experiences with Meridian?
Not even close to being the lowest actually. You can get a 5 year fixed at 2.19% through any regular posting broker on this board.
Damn! That's pretty awesome, any insight who the mortgage would be with?
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Sep 13, 2011
5168 posts
2056 upvotes
Toronto
redkulat wrote:
PaulMeredith wrote:
redkulat wrote: Meridian seems to be offering the lowest rate for a 5 year fixed mortgage (2.44%). Any one have experiences with Meridian?
Not even close to being the lowest actually. You can get a 5 year fixed at 2.19% through any regular posting broker on this board.
Damn! That's pretty awesome, any insight who the mortgage would be with?
Yes of course. It's with MCAP and has full 20% prepayment privileges. You get get more info from any of the mortgage brokers on here (Valuemortgage, cdnrealestateguy, or myself)
Paul Meredith
Mortgage Broker, Author
CityCan Financial Corp (lic. 10532)
Newbie
Sep 27, 2016
2 posts
CdnRealEstateGuy wrote: 1. Yes, shorter terms to carry lower rates, as the interest rate yield curve is higher in later years.
2. How far away is your closing date? Are you signing the purchase agreement now? If so, a pre-approval should suffice. You won't get a rate hold (at least at competitive rates) now if the closing date is far in advance.
3. How much is the mortgage amount and when is the closing date?
I already purchased a pre-sale and it is supposed to be done early next year. I was told orientations would start in January, so I am expecting closing would be a few weeks after that. Although, again it could be delayed if orientation and inspections for the other buildings uncover problems that need resolving.
PaulMeredith wrote: Not even close to being the lowest actually. You can get a 5 year fixed at 2.19% through any regular posting broker on this board.
valuemortgage wrote: 3 - Very few lenders will demand higher mortgage amounts in order to offer low rates... often, I see certain brokers using misleading offers and creating those limitations themselves. A lender with a 90 days rate guarantee at 2.19% today has a minimum $50k mortgage.. any amount over $50k gets the same rate.
I'm interested in obtaining this 2.19% rate. I'm looking for a 100k mortgage in Vancouver, I see MCAP has a local office here, but the rates on their website are nowhere near this low. Which brokerage should I go through to obtain this rate? Can I work with one of the 3 of you on this thread? It seems you are all based out of Ontario.
Newbie
Sep 15, 2016
9 posts
halifax
Hi,

A few questions about variable rate mortgages and 2-3 year fixed mortgages.

What rates are around for these? They vary greatly looking online and are not really mentioned since everyone looks for the 5 yr fixed.

Also, when you sign a variable rate at prime -.8%, say, then is it locked in at prime -8% the entire term? Or does it move up and down according to the Bank of Canada rate moves (i.e. BOC lowers rates .25% or ups rates .25%, does the mortgage rate move up and down based on BOC moves or based on prime rate movement?)

At the end of a term when you are looking to renew (I have not been in this position yet) and your lender sends you an offer, is it generally what you can get through a brokerage? Let's say I go with an MCAP mortgage through value mortgage and he buys down .2% off the MCAP rate of 2.39%. I pay 2.19% for 5 years. Let's say MCAPs rates do not change. At the end of the term is MCAP going to send me a renewal offer for 2.39%? Let's say they won't move the rate down and that I can once again go to value mortgage and get 2.19% for the MCAP product. Will that incur discharge fees since I didn't renew directly through MCAP?

Thanks for the info everyone.
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Sep 13, 2011
5168 posts
2056 upvotes
Toronto
cilantrosanchez wrote: Hi,

A few questions about variable rate mortgages and 2-3 year fixed mortgages.

What rates are around for these? They vary greatly looking online and are not really mentioned since everyone looks for the 5 yr fixed.

Also, when you sign a variable rate at prime -.8%, say, then is it locked in at prime -8% the entire term? Or does it move up and down according to the Bank of Canada rate moves (i.e. BOC lowers rates .25% or ups rates .25%, does the mortgage rate move up and down based on BOC moves or based on prime rate movement?)

At the end of a term when you are looking to renew (I have not been in this position yet) and your lender sends you an offer, is it generally what you can get through a brokerage? Let's say I go with an MCAP mortgage through value mortgage and he buys down .2% off the MCAP rate of 2.39%. I pay 2.19% for 5 years. Let's say MCAPs rates do not change. At the end of the term is MCAP going to send me a renewal offer for 2.39%? Let's say they won't move the rate down and that I can once again go to value mortgage and get 2.19% for the MCAP product. Will that incur discharge fees since I didn't renew directly through MCAP?

Thanks for the info everyone.
Lowest variable is prime -0.65% (2.05%) and lowest 3 year fixed is 2.10%. With an adjustable rate mortgage, your rate and payment will change with prime rate. So if prime goes up, so does your rate and payment. The classic variable rate mortgages where the payment remains the same for the term and the amortization changes are quite rare these days.

MCAP would likely send you the renewal documents at their regular rate, which is 2.39%. You can then try to negotiate with them from there, or you can switch to a different lender. A broker cannot help you at renewal if you are staying with the same lender. Only if you are switching to a different one.
Paul Meredith
Mortgage Broker, Author
CityCan Financial Corp (lic. 10532)
Deal Addict
Apr 26, 2004
2114 posts
101 upvotes
GTA
Great news. Anyone closing within the next 30 days, the 5 year fixed rate at a major bank is between 2.20-2.22% with cash back that doesn't need to be paid back.

As an example you can get that rate on a 500k mortgage and 2400$ cash back.
Mortgage Specialist in the GTA
Newbie
Sep 15, 2016
9 posts
halifax
Who is the 3 year fixed with? Is it for a standard or high ratio mortgage?

The reason I asked about the variable rate fluctuations is because of the disconnect between the BOC rate changes and the prime lending rate changes the last two two BOC drops. If the BOC drops rates by .25% but prime rates only end up down .15%, would the variable rates in a fixed mortgage drop by .25% or .15% (theoretically)? Or same with the upside?

Since the last two moves by the BOC have dropped the lending rate by .5% but the prime lending rate has only dropped by .25% then it seems like it would be important to know to know how the variable rate movement by the lender is determined.
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Sep 13, 2011
5168 posts
2056 upvotes
Toronto
cilantrosanchez wrote: Who is the 3 year fixed with? Is it for a standard or high ratio mortgage?

The reason I asked about the variable rate fluctuations is because of the disconnect between the BOC rate changes and the prime lending rate changes the last two two BOC drops. If the BOC drops rates by .25% but prime rates only end up down .15%, would the variable rates in a fixed mortgage drop by .25% or .15% (theoretically)? Or same with the upside?

Since the last two moves by the BOC have dropped the lending rate by .5% but the prime lending rate has only dropped by .25% then it seems like it would be important to know to know how the variable rate movement by the lender is determined.
All these rate quotes are for both high ratio and conventional mortgages. I personally don't typically post high ratio specials on here without specifically referring to it as such as I find it misleading considering most RFD'rs have 20% down on their purchases.

Variable rates fluctuate with prime rate, which is 'influenced' by the Bank of Canada movement. So if the BOC drops rates by 25 basis points, and banks only drop their prime by 15 points, then it would be the 15 point difference that you would see. Usually the movement to prime rate (following a BOC announcement) is started by one of the big banks. Then other banks follow, as well as all the non-bank lenders. Usually within a month, prime rate is the same among all lenders across the board. It would be an unprecedented event if any one specific lender did not follow everyone else.
Paul Meredith
Mortgage Broker, Author
CityCan Financial Corp (lic. 10532)
Sr. Member
Apr 1, 2005
653 posts
20 upvotes
Leslieville
are the rates the same with 30 or 25 years mortgages? ie. 2.05% variable 5 years ?
Deal Addict
User avatar
Dec 1, 2015
1966 posts
918 upvotes
Etobicoke, ON
Yes you can get that rate, and the mortgage professional could be in ON or BC.. no difference. All is done online these days.
QWTYLP wrote:
CdnRealEstateGuy wrote: 1. Yes, shorter terms to carry lower rates, as the interest rate yield curve is higher in later years.
2. How far away is your closing date? Are you signing the purchase agreement now? If so, a pre-approval should suffice. You won't get a rate hold (at least at competitive rates) now if the closing date is far in advance.
3. How much is the mortgage amount and when is the closing date?
I already purchased a pre-sale and it is supposed to be done early next year. I was told orientations would start in January, so I am expecting closing would be a few weeks after that. Although, again it could be delayed if orientation and inspections for the other buildings uncover problems that need resolving.
PaulMeredith wrote: Not even close to being the lowest actually. You can get a 5 year fixed at 2.19% through any regular posting broker on this board.
valuemortgage wrote: 3 - Very few lenders will demand higher mortgage amounts in order to offer low rates... often, I see certain brokers using misleading offers and creating those limitations themselves. A lender with a 90 days rate guarantee at 2.19% today has a minimum $50k mortgage.. any amount over $50k gets the same rate.
I'm interested in obtaining this 2.19% rate. I'm looking for a 100k mortgage in Vancouver, I see MCAP has a local office here, but the rates on their website are nowhere near this low. Which brokerage should I go through to obtain this rate? Can I work with one of the 3 of you on this thread? It seems you are all based out of Ontario.
Andre Oliveira - Mortgage Agent at Valuemortgage
2018 Top 20 National - Mortgage Intelligence
FSCO # 10428

Top

Thread Information

There are currently 7 users viewing this thread. (5 members and 2 guests)

Scared1, Jordanferras, Semp12, puscasuvasile636554926884440997, stunner416