Real Estate

The Official Mortgage Rates Thread

Deal Addict
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Jun 24, 2020
1270 posts
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vincentlam86864 wrote: Hi TazZaide, it its 3.29%!
You have over $16,000 in savings if you switch now. If your penalty is accurate(which you should double check with the lender), you have a ton of savings up until May 2023 in interest/principal.
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Jun 24, 2020
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Mogambo720 wrote: Hello,

This is for renewal, please.

-How much is the mortgage owing? 280k
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property? 600k
-Which city is the property located in? Burnaby
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental? Owner Occupied
-Who is your current lender? CIBC
-Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage? No
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured? Yes
-When did you buy the property? 2013
-When is your renewal date? May 2021
1.44% five year fixed or 1.40% five year variable available.
Newbie
Mar 9, 2016
22 posts
18 upvotes
Hey broker gang,

This is for a new purchase:

-What is the purchase price? $507,500
-How much is the down payment? $101,500
-Where it the property located? Nanaimo, B.C.
-When is the closing date? April 1, 2021
-Will the property be owner-occupied or a rental? Owner occupied

Currently quoted 1.69% with Tangerine, but hoping for something better!

Thanks
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Jan 31, 2018
3530 posts
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AdnanS30330 wrote: Hello everyone,

Looking to renew before May 2021. I have been offered 1.75% 5 years fixed by my current mortgage provider. I Would like to see what's available out there

- How much is the mortgage owing? $448000
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property? 1.1 M
-Which city is the property located in? Mississauga, ON
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental? Owner-occupied
-Who is your current lender? CIBC
-Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage? NO
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured?
-When is your renewal date? MAY 2021

-25 years am

Thank you!
You can get 1.40% variable and 1.44% fixed 5 yr term

Phil
Phil Cragg
Mortgage Agent
Mortgage Outlet Inc Broker License #12628
Deal Addict
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Jan 31, 2018
3530 posts
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Mendani wrote: Hey broker gang,

This is for a new purchase:

-What is the purchase price? $507,500
-How much is the down payment? $101,500
-Where it the property located? Nanaimo, B.C.
-When is the closing date? April 1, 2021
-Will the property be owner-occupied or a rental? Owner occupied

Currently quoted 1.69% with Tangerine, but hoping for something better!

Thanks
You can do better 1.54% 5 yr fixed & 1.45% 5 yr variable

Phil
Phil Cragg
Mortgage Agent
Mortgage Outlet Inc Broker License #12628
Deal Addict
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Jan 31, 2018
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Mogambo720 wrote: Hello,

This is for renewal, please.

-How much is the mortgage owing? 280k
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property? 600k
-Which city is the property located in? Burnaby
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental? Owner Occupied
-Who is your current lender? CIBC
-Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage? No
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured? Yes
-When did you buy the property? 2013
-When is your renewal date? May 2021
You can get 1.40% variable and 1.44% fixed 5 yr term

Phil
Phil Cragg
Mortgage Agent
Mortgage Outlet Inc Broker License #12628
Member
Jan 21, 2010
243 posts
46 upvotes
YUL
Hi guys,

We've just sold our condo, and we're buying two other (smaller) condos. We need financing for both, and both will be with at least 20% downpayment:

1st condo:
closing date is 1st of May.
We bought on plan a condo that's ready only around October-November.
Details for the condo are:
Mortgage owing: 310K
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property? 350K
-Which city is the property located in? Montreal, QC
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental? Owner-occupied
Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage? NO
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured? NO
Closing date: october or november 2021
-25yrs am

2nd condo:
- How much is the mortgage owing? $320k
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property? $320k
-Which city is the property located in? Montreal, QC
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental? Owner-occupied
-Who is your current lender? N/A
-Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage? No
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured? No
-When is your renewal date? N/A
-Purchase date? February 2021
-25 years am

PM me for more infos.
thanks!
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Feb 24, 2012
2633 posts
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Toronto
Hello, would like to see if there are better alternatives to my quoted amount:
1.49% 4 year fixed, 30 yr ammort.
Last edited by ashihtaka on Jan 26th, 2021 8:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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ashihtaka wrote: Hello, would like to see if there are better alternatives to my quoted amount:
1.49% 4 year fixed, 30 yr ammort.

-What is the purchase price? $1,810,000
-How much is the down payment? $810,000
-Where it the property located? Oakville, ON
-When is the closing date? April 22, 2021
-Will the property be owner-occupied or a rental? Owner occupied

1.49% from CIBC
1.54% five year fixed available from a major bank, definitely worth the extra year of lower rate savings.
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Sep 13, 2011
5568 posts
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Toronto
ashihtaka wrote: Hello, would like to see if there are better alternatives to my quoted amount:
1.49% 4 year fixed, 30 yr ammort.

-What is the purchase price? $1,810,000
-How much is the down payment? $810,000
-Where it the property located? Oakville, ON
-When is the closing date? April 22, 2021
-Will the property be owner-occupied or a rental? Owner occupied

1.49% from CIBC
That's the lowest fixed rate that you'll find anywhere, so you're doing pretty well from that standpoint. What are they offering you on a 5 year term? Ask yourself this as well:

Do you REALLY want the lowest rate?
Or do you want to save the most money?
Are you choosing the 4 year because it's at a lower rate?

There is a lot more to a mortgage than just rate, and choosing a mortgage based on rate is one of the biggest mistakes one can make. It can prove to be costly actually. Let me explain further.

The first thing you need to consider is how long you think this mortgage will suit your needs for. 5 years is 'standard' but that doesn't mean its right for everyone. For all we know, you could have a goal to pay this off in 4 years, in which case this might be the perfect mortgage product for you. Every situation is a bit different and there is no such thing as 'one size fits all' mortgage advice. If you think that chances are quite strong that you'll this mortgage will suit your needs for the foreseeable future, then you need to look at the rate difference between the 4 and 5 year terms. You should be able to get 1.59% (or lower) on a 5 year fixed for example. Now let's compare the two options.

One thing you need to ask yourself is where you think rates will be in four years. This is a long time, and no one can really say for sure. All we can do is look at what's happening now, and how things look moving forward. What we know for sure is that fixed mortgage rates have reached new historical lowest. Prior to 2020, fixed rates below 2% were just a fantasy. Starting 2021, rates have dropped quite a bit lower than 2% of course. I'm thinking that we'll have these historically low rates for much of 2021 (probably all of it). But rates will not always be this low. Once the pandemic is over (whenever that may be), rates will increase. While we can't predict the exact end of the pandemic, I think it's a reasonable expectation to think that it will be well behind us in four years, which means that it's a reasonable expectation that mortgage rates will also be higher in four years.

The break even rate between a 4 year term of 1.49% and a 5 year term of 1.59% is 2.04% (or 2.0394% if there are any engineers reading that prefer to see pinpoint accuracy :) ) This means that at the end of your four year term, the 1 year fixed rate (which brings us up to 5 years) would need to be lower than 2.04% for the four year fixed to have been the better choice for you. If rates are higher, then you would have come out ahead by choosing the 5 year fixed at 1.59% from the beginning. For all we know, rates could be back up over 3% by that time, which is not out of the question. You could end up getting to the end of the four year term and might be wishing that you had the extra year.

No one knows for sure and anything can happen of course. Your circumstances could change you may end up breaking before the end of the 5 year (or 4) term. It can be easy to think a mortgage will suit your needs for the next five years, but sometimes life throws you curveballs that may result in you being forced to break your mortgage early. Things like job loss, disability, death, divorce, etc. We don't plan on anything bad happening, but sometimes life has other plans for us. Keep in mind also that the penalty to break a fixed rate mortgage with a major bank can be as much as 900% higher than most of the non-bank lenders, such as MCAP, First National, RFA, etc. Not saying there WILL be this much difference, but it can be. That being said, the non-bank lenders are no where near as competitive as the major banks are on properties valued at over $1 million, so I wouldn't necessarily call them a better option in this case.

What you may want to consider is a variable rate mortgage, which can be a great alternative. The penalty to break a fixed rate mortgage is an unknown factor, and can sometimes present quite a surprise (and not the kind we like). The penalty on a variable rate is only three months interest, so you know exactly what to expect. No surprises. The lowest rate for your situation would be 1.35% - 1.40%. The Bank of Canada is not expecting to increase the prime rate until sometime in 2023 (personally I wouldn't be surprised if they held it longer). It's also likely that the Bank of Canada will lower their rate further, which may happen as early as tomorrow. A smaller than usual move can be expected. 0.10% to 0.15%, which would bring the variable rates down even further. If it doesn't happen tomorrow, then it can be expected to happen on March 10th, which is the next scheduled rate announcement from the BOC.

You asked if there are lower rates available and i've given you a full analysis. Hope you find this helpful. :)

Paul
Paul Meredith
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What happens if you get a mortgage at an owner-occupied rate but you decide to rent it out?
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d0rksterr wrote: What happens if you get a mortgage at an owner-occupied rate but you decide to rent it out?
As long as you're planning to occupy the property on closing, you're good!

We all know people's situations can change within 5 years, and a property may be rented out.
Kevin Somnauth, CFA
Principal Broker - First Toronto Mortgage - MA (Ontario #13176, BC #X301007)
Real Estate Salesperson - Century 21 Innovative
Newbie
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Jan 25, 2013
3 posts
So I bought a new home. $2m
Current home Mortgage $110000 remaining and 28 months remain of 25/yr amortization.
New home will have $900000 mortgage from same bank (Scotia).
So to payoff the mortgage on the first home the bank wants a prepayment charge of roughly $3500.

My Lawyers were like "this is odd. Your bank is taking advantage of you. They should waive this since you're getting a way higher mortgage...etc."

Do they not waive this anymore?
Jr. Member
Apr 22, 2004
168 posts
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Vancouver
My primary residence mortgage is currently with Scotia and my work has a group home program with Scotia and RBC. Looking at a rental property and would like to leverage the group home mortgage program by staying with Scotia or RBC.

-What is the purchase price? $700K
-How much is the down payment? $300K
-Where it the property located? Burnaby, BC
-When is the closing date? April 2021
-Will the property be owner-occupied or a rental? Rental

What are the current 5 year fixed rates at Scotia and RBC?
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Sep 13, 2011
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jackleverm wrote: So I bought a new home. $2m
Current home Mortgage $110000 remaining and 28 months remain of 25/yr amortization.
New home will have $900000 mortgage from same bank (Scotia).
So to payoff the mortgage on the first home the bank wants a prepayment charge of roughly $3500.

My Lawyers were like "this is odd. Your bank is taking advantage of you. They should waive this since you're getting a way higher mortgage...etc."

Do they not waive this anymore?
Not odd at all, and very common. It depends on how the new mortgage is set up. Most lenders will be able to do a blended rate, which is where they take the rate that you're paying on the current money owed ($100K in this case) and then blend it together with today's rate on the new money required. This eliminates the penalty, but doesn't always work out to be the most cost effective option as you usually won't get a 'deal' on the new money needed. Scotia however stopped doing blended rates a few years ago, so they wouldn't have been able to do this for you (I believe they are the only lender that doesn't offer them). What they would do now is add a second component to your mortgage for the new money needed, while keeping your current mortgage balance and rate intact. It's a little messy as you would then have two different maturity dates, which means that you'll never be able to leave them without paying a penalty. In many cases, it works out to being cheaper to pay the penalty, and get an entirely new mortgage. Every situation can be a bit different, and the best choice is obviously the one that would save you the most money.

These two scenarios are the only ways in which lenders will waive your penalty. For the way your mortgage is set up, Scotia should be giving you a 20% discount on the penalty, so I would reach out to them to ensure this was applied.

Hope this helps make a bit more sense of your situation. :)

Paul
Paul Meredith
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(lic. 10532)
Newbie
Feb 10, 2019
4 posts
Hi all,

Within 120 days of my renewal, so looking for some renewal rates. Will consider fixed or variable, 2 to 5 year terms.

Thanks in advance!

-How much is the mortgage owing?
450k
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property?
1.2M
-Which city is the property located in?
Toronto
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental?
Owner occupied
-Who is your current lender?
Meridian CU
-Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage?
No
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured?
No
-When did you buy the property?
May 2016
-When is your renewal date?
May 9, 2021
Newbie
Jan 18, 2021
2 posts
First time poster here but finding the reading very informative. Not sure I can read through all the posts to find answers to my questions so may repeat previously asked ones.
  • Costs involved in changing lenders?
  • How to compare penalties and terms (things other than just the rates) between the existing offer and potential new lender?
  • Retired couple, any issues with obtaining financing? Excellent credit rating from what I've been told.
  • Special concerns as we're not sure if we'll even be at our current location in 5 years or downsized to smaller place and impact of having to end mortgage early
  • Considering rates will likely go up in the next few years - once Covid is under control - what's the thoughts on locking in now or going variable with plans to lock in when rates start to rise?
  • Other things we should consider?
Never dealt with a broker before, little wary of moving into a new sandbox. RBC has had our business for almost 40 years but they are offering us 1.82% on a 5 year fixed, 30 yr amortization which is actually higher than the rate we got 5 years ago (although that was a variable)! So much for loyalty.

How much is the mortgage owing? $219k
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property? Likely in the $900k - $950k range
-Which city is the property located in? Bowmanville ON (waterfront)
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental? O/O
-Who is your current lender? RBC
-Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage? Not sure? Homeline Plan has credit line included. New mortgage will consolidate outstanding mortgage and credit line for better rate on LOC
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured? No
-When did you buy the property? 2016
-When is your renewal date? March 9, 2021

Thanks in advance for any responses.
Newbie
User avatar
Jan 25, 2013
3 posts
PaulMeredith wrote: Not odd at all, and very common. It depends on how the new mortgage is set up. Most lenders will be able to do a blended rate, which is where they take the rate that you're paying on the current money owed ($100K in this case) and then blend it together with today's rate on the new money required. This eliminates the penalty, but doesn't always work out to be the most cost effective option as you usually won't get a 'deal' on the new money needed. Scotia however stopped doing blended rates a few years ago, so they wouldn't have been able to do this for you (I believe they are the only lender that doesn't offer them). What they would do now is add a second component to your mortgage for the new money needed, while keeping your current mortgage balance and rate intact. It's a little messy as you would then have two different maturity dates, which means that you'll never be able to leave them without paying a penalty. In many cases, it works out to being cheaper to pay the penalty, and get an entirely new mortgage. Every situation can be a bit different, and the best choice is obviously the one that would save you the most money.

These two scenarios are the only ways in which lenders will waive your penalty. For the way your mortgage is set up, Scotia should be giving you a 20% discount on the penalty, so I would reach out to them to ensure this was applied.

Hope this helps make a bit more sense of your situation. :)

Paul
Thanks Paul. I've brought this up with my bank and they are looking into options.
Why would they give me a 20% rebate on the prepayment? I shouldn't have to ask for that should I? It should be in good faith right?

Nothing like being with a bank for 40+ years to have them nickel and dime me to pay them more.
Newbie
Jan 11, 2021
3 posts
Curious to know why none of the experienced brokers on this thread are recommending the longer term 7yr fixed-closed mortgage option?

I understand the IRD penalty risk (with the longer term fixed tenure) but wouldn't a 7yr fixed-closed conventional (non-collateral) mortgage option at say 1.6%-1.7% compare favorably against a 5-year fixed @1.44% or even a variable @ Prime - ~ 1%+ discount rate?
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Feb 2, 2014
8575 posts
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Toronto
dubsadan wrote: Hi all,

Within 120 days of my renewal, so looking for some renewal rates. Will consider fixed or variable, 2 to 5 year terms.

Thanks in advance!

-How much is the mortgage owing?
450k
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property?
1.2M
-Which city is the property located in?
Toronto
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental?
Owner occupied
-Who is your current lender?
Meridian CU
-Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage?
No
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured?
No
-When did you buy the property?
May 2016
-When is your renewal date?
May 9, 2021
1.44% 5-year fixed and 1.40% 5-year variable with legal and appraisal fees covered!
Kevin Somnauth, CFA
Principal Broker - First Toronto Mortgage - MA (Ontario #13176, BC #X301007)
Real Estate Salesperson - Century 21 Innovative

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