Real Estate

The Official Mortgage Rates Thread

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Jan 31, 2018
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Blazin_Sunfire wrote: Hello all, may go another route. What is the best Heloc rate for a home in toronto. no mortgage, value 900,000. looking to have a heloc for as much as I can carry.

Thanks in advance!
Prime +.5% is the best thru the broker channel max 65% ltv
Phil Cragg
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loneranger72 wrote: Hi There,

I am looking for good rates for renewal of my mortgage. Details are below. TIA
-How much is the mortgage owing?
725K
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property?
1.3 mil
-Which city is the property located in?
Halton, Ontario
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental?
Owner
-Who is your current lender?
CIBC
-Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage?
Yes
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured?
No
-When did you buy the property?
2017
-When is your renewal date?
April
2.89% for a 5 yr fixed term
Full featured product

Phil
Last edited by rateconnect on Jan 23rd, 2020 11:29 am, edited 1 time in total.
Phil Cragg
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loneranger72 wrote: Hi There,

I am looking for good rates for renewal of my mortgage. Details are below. TIA
-How much is the mortgage owing?
725K
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property?
1.3 mil
-Which city is the property located in?
Halton, Ontario
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental?
Owner
-Who is your current lender?
CIBC
-Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage?
Yes
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured?
No
-When did you buy the property?
2017
-When is your renewal date?
April
Thanks for the info! The lowest 5 year fixed rate for your situation is 2.89%. Fully featured mortgage with no unusual terms or restrictions.
Paul Meredith
Mortgage Broker, Author
CityCan Financial Corp (lic. 10532)
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Jan 22, 2020
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I am looking for good rates for renewal of my mortgage. Details are below. TIA
-How much is the mortgage owing?
400K
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property?
700K
-Which city is the property located in?
Toronto
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental?
Owner
-Who is your current lender?
Streetcapital
-Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage?
No
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured?
Yes
-When did you buy the property?
2015
-When is your renewal date?
April
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ahlaker wrote: Goes without saying but whether it's better to keep the insured deal intact will wholly depend on the mix of interest rates between the insured and uninsured segments. You'd probably have to switch into a collateral charge mortgage in order to have multiple fixed loan segments. Big banks may be your best bet for that.
For sure. I think TD is one (maybe there's a couple more) that's both okay for 2nd position HELOCs and offers fixed-rates inside of HELOCs (2.xx% fixed terms). What I don't know yet is how my current mortgage already being collateral (registered for $600k, not the $480k owing at renewal) is going to impact that. If I switch it out to another lender, does the current collateral charge of $600k persist and limit what can go in 2nd position, unless with the same lender?
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nadda2020 wrote: I am looking for good rates for renewal of my mortgage. Details are below. TIA
-How much is the mortgage owing?
400K
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property?
700K
-Which city is the property located in?
Toronto
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental?
Owner
-Who is your current lender?
Streetcapital
-Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage?
No
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured?
Yes
-When did you buy the property?
2015
-When is your renewal date?
April
2.49% available on a 5 yr fixed
Full featured product 20/20 prepayments

Phil
Phil Cragg
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I'm looking for some clarification on Debt Service Ratio as it relates to getting approval for a mortgage.
Seems like the right experts are in this thread.

This info is posted on ratehub.ca ( https://www.ratehub.ca/debt-service-ratios )
For a house, not a condo:
1. Gross Dept Service Ratio (GDS) = (Mortgage payments + property taxes + heating costs)/Annual Income
It doesn't define annual income, but from reading discussions on line, I assume that is gross annual income, not net annual income after income tax is deducted - is that correct?

2. Total Debt Service Ratio (TDS) = (Housing expenses + Credit card interest + Car payments + Loan expenses) /Annual Income
The "Credit Card Interest" item is confusing for a number of reasons:
a. If I pay off my credit card monthly, which I do, there is no credit card interest, so that entry would be zero
b. In other discussion I see that this entry is supposed to be the minimum monthly payment. That is a number that does come up on my CC bill even if I pay the bill in full
c. Or should I take the "Credit card interest" at face value and calculate what the interest for the monthly cc charge would have been if I didn't pay it before the due date?
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Jan 31, 2018
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krs wrote: I'm looking for some clarification on Debt Service Ratio as it relates to getting approval for a mortgage.
Seems like the right experts are in this thread.

This info is posted on ratehub.ca ( https://www.ratehub.ca/debt-service-ratios )
For a house, not a condo:
1. Gross Dept Service Ratio (GDS) = (Mortgage payments + property taxes + heating costs)/Annual Income
It doesn't define annual income, but from reading discussions on line, I assume that is gross annual income, not net annual income after income tax is deducted - is that correct?

2. Total Debt Service Ratio (TDS) = (Housing expenses + Credit card interest + Car payments + Loan expenses) /Annual Income
The "Credit Card Interest" item is confusing for a number of reasons:
a. If I pay off my credit card monthly, which I do, there is no credit card interest, so that entry would be zero
b. In other discussion I see that this entry is supposed to be the minimum monthly payment. That is a number that does come up on my CC bill even if I pay the bill in full
c. Or should I take the "Credit card interest" at face value and calculate what the interest for the monthly cc charge would have been if I didn't pay it before the due date?
see responses below in CAPS

1. Gross Dept Service Ratio (GDS) = (Mortgage payments + property taxes + heating costs)/Annual Income
It doesn't define annual income, but from reading discussions on line, I assume that is gross annual income, not net annual income after income tax is deducted - is that correct?

IT IS BASED ON YOUR GROSS ANNUAL INCOME

2. Total Debt Service Ratio (TDS) = (Housing expenses + Credit card interest + Car payments + Loan expenses) /Annual Income
The "Credit Card Interest" item is confusing for a number of reasons:

a. If I pay off my credit card monthly, which I do, there is no credit card interest, so that entry would be zero YES YOU WOULD NOT ADD ANYTHING TO LIABILITIES

b. In other discussion I see that this entry is supposed to be the minimum monthly payment. That is a number that does come up on my CC bill even if I pay the bill in full NO IF YOU DO NOT CARRY A BALANCE WE WOULD INDICATE TO THE LENDER THAT THE BALANCE (IF THERE IS ONE) ON THE CREDIT REPORT IS PAID IN FULL

c. Or should I take the "Credit card interest" at face value and calculate what the interest for the monthly cc charge would have been if I didn't pay it before the due date? AS ABOVE

TYPICALLY LENDERS USE A 39/44 GDS /TDS ALLOWANCE IF YOUR CREDIT IS ABOVE 680

IF YOU HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT QUALIFICATION REACH OUT TO ANY OF THE BROKERS ON THE FORUM TO LOOK AT YOUR FILE

HOPE THIS HELPS

Phil
Phil Cragg
Mortgage Broker
Mortgage Outlet Inc Broker License #12628
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Blazin_Sunfire wrote: Hello all, may go another route. What is the best Heloc rate for a home in toronto. no mortgage, value 900,000. looking to have a heloc for as much as I can carry.
Broker channel rates suck ass. Go talk to Motusbank and get p-0.2% or Tangerine at p-0.1%. Simplii also has a HELOC that'll cost only $150 to setup (rate unknown, but probably no worse than p+0.5%).
loneranger72 wrote: I am looking for good rates for renewal of my mortgage. Details are below. TIA
-How much is the mortgage owing? 725K
-Roughly, what is the current market value of the property? 1.3 mil
-Which city is the property located in? Halton, Ontario
-Is the property owner-occupied or a rental? Owner
-Who is your current lender? CIBC
-Do you have a HELOC tied to the mortgage? Yes
-Is the mortgage CMHC insured? No
-When did you buy the property? 2017
-When is your renewal date? April
I assume you paid > $1M for the house back in 2017 - if yes then goto Motusbank and get 2.79% for any fixed rate mortgage. They may make you pay fees to switch in, but YMMV with negotiating that away.
Mike15 wrote: What I don't know yet is how my current mortgage already being collateral (registered for $600k, not the $480k owing at renewal) is going to impact that. If I switch it out to another lender, does the current collateral charge of $600k persist and limit what can go in 2nd position, unless with the same lender?
Great question - again the big banks will be your best bet. You'd have to ask, but I think what they'll most likely do is switch over the amortizing (insured) loan and roll it up into a new collateral charge with a higher global limit. You can then get a 2nd amortizing loan under the same limit. The insurance should stay intact on the amortizing loan. I'd be interested to hear what RBC, CIBC, NBC and BMO have to say for this situation.
krs wrote: I'm looking for some clarification on Debt Service Ratio as it relates to getting approval for a mortgage.
1. Gross Dept Service Ratio (GDS) = (Mortgage payments + property taxes + heating costs)/Annual Income
It doesn't define annual income, but from reading discussions on line, I assume that is gross annual income, not net annual income after income tax is deducted - is that correct?
Gross income assuming you're an employee. Net income (with some potential addbacks) if you're a sole proprietor or if you've got a corporation.
krs wrote: 2. Total Debt Service Ratio (TDS) = (Housing expenses + Credit card interest + Car payments + Loan expenses) /Annual Income
The "Credit Card Interest" item is confusing for a number of reasons:
a. If I pay off my credit card monthly, which I do, there is no credit card interest, so that entry would be zero
b. In other discussion I see that this entry is supposed to be the minimum monthly payment. That is a number that does come up on my CC bill even if I pay the bill in full
c. Or should I take the "Credit card interest" at face value and calculate what the interest for the monthly cc charge would have been if I didn't pay it before the due date?
Your TDS will be unaffected, generally, if you pay off your entire credit card balance monthly. Some lenders take 3% of the limit on your revolving credit - most do not. I'm running into that problem right now: I've got $100k of available credit via various ULOCs and CCs and my credit union is taking 3% of that $100k and adding it to my TDS. It's not super common and most likely a credit union specific issue. Also - assuming you don't pay off a credit card, lenders will typically take the greater of $10 or 3% of the balance and add it to the TDS calc.
Nikola Alaica, CPA, CA | Tax, Accounting, Mortgages
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Mike15 wrote: For sure. I think TD is one (maybe there's a couple more) that's both okay for 2nd position HELOCs and offers fixed-rates inside of HELOCs (2.xx% fixed terms). What I don't know yet is how my current mortgage already being collateral (registered for $600k, not the $480k owing at renewal) is going to impact that. If I switch it out to another lender, does the current collateral charge of $600k persist and limit what can go in 2nd position, unless with the same lender?
The first mortgage will be registered as a standard mortgage once you transfer it. You can then get a 2nd position HELOC with the lender in first position (assuming they offer it) or a different lender (ie TD, Manulife...).
Kevin Somnauth, CFA
Principal Broker - First Toronto Mortgage - MA (Ontario #13176, BC #X301007)
Real Estate Salesperson - Century 21 Innovative
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Nov 24, 2013
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CdnRealEstateGuy wrote: The first mortgage will be registered as a standard mortgage once you transfer it. You can then get a 2nd position HELOC with the lender in first position (assuming they offer it) or a different lender (ie TD, Manulife...).
Thanks for the clarity!
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Mar 28, 2005
5697 posts
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Ontario / Quebec
Thanks for the reply
ahlaker wrote: Gross income assuming you're an employee. Net income (with some potential addbacks) if you're a sole proprietor or if you've got a corporation.
It's all pension income from various sources - so I assume it would be gross income
Your TDS will be unaffected, generally, if you pay off your entire credit card balance monthly. Some lenders take 3% of the limit on your revolving credit - most do not. I'm running into that problem right now: I've got $100k of available credit via various ULOCs and CCs and my credit union is taking 3% of that $100k and adding it to my TDS.
A few years back, I had that problem with an Ontario Credit Union as well.
They wanted me to close some of the credit card accounts which I think would have affected my credit score.
I eventually went through a Mortgage Broker and a different financial institution.
Newbie
Jan 22, 2020
2 posts
Just bought my first home and I'm looking to see what is an appropriate mortgage rate.

-What is the purchase price?
$575,000
-How much is the down payment?
20%, $115,000
-Where it the property located?
Burnaby, BC
-When is the closing date?
March 30
-Will the property be owner-occupied or a rental?
Rental
Newbie
Jan 20, 2020
2 posts
Hey RFD,

I am newbie here. Asking the question once more as there was no response on previous question. Looking to buy mortgage for first time home buyer in BC. Its new build which will be completed in March 2020 for condo.Subject removal is 29th Jan 2020. What should be the best interest rate:

For a purchase of a property:

-What is the purchase price? ~485k (Including GST)
-How much is the down payment? 20%
-Where it the property located? Surrey, BC
-When is the closing date? Feb
-Will the property be owner-occupied or a rental? Owner Occupied

Also, i and my fiance will be both listed on property and we both are PNP approved by BC. IS there any issue or additional taxes we are looking for ?
Newbie
Sep 27, 2017
6 posts
Looking for some advice here. I have a CMHC-insured mortgage with renewal July 15, 2020 currently sitting at 360K, 2.59%. House is probably worth 610K. Current penalty to break mortgage is about 2300.

We're looking to start some fairly hefty renos July 1st, probably totaling somewhere around 155K. In order to pay for construction advance and materials we'll probably need access to somewhere in the neighbourhood of 70K from Arpril until July 1. Not sure of the best way to proceed.

Do I refinance now (incurring a penalty) to access 128K (610K * 80% - 360K), float the rest (27K) with my unsecured personal LOC, then reappraise and blend/extend the mortgage?

Or am I better off getting a HELOC now, renewing July 15, floating the rest with the unsecured LOC, then blend/extend?

I'm not worried about getting approved, as household income and credit rating should be fine (250K and 876) - I just want to minimize extra fees and minimize the rate I end up with.

Any advice would be appreciated.

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