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[Ontario] Question on TD Insurance's Direct Compensation Property Damage (DCPD) coverage

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[Ontario] Question on TD Insurance's Direct Compensation Property Damage (DCPD) coverage

Just recently did TD Insurance start allowing policy holders to tweak insurance policy rider amounts and deductibles and I noticed only yesterday that the DCPD at TD defaults to no deductible but can go as high as $5,000.

Because DCPD comprise 20-30% of my insurance premiums, depending on the vehicle, just wondering if anyone knows how DCPD and collision coverage works over at TD Insurance in the event of an accident, when I'm at 25%, 50%, 75% or 100% at fault.

This article says DCPD is for no fault accidents. So it makes sense that if I'm in the collision and 100% not at fault, DCPD will kick in and TDI will repair/replace my vehicle. I don't have to pay my collision coverage deductible.

https://www.moneysense.ca/spend/insuran ... insurance/
You’re out of luck if the accident was your fault. If you’re at fault for a collision, you’ll need collision insurance (or all-perils coverage, depending on where you live) to pay for the damage, which is optional and comes at an extra cost.


But over at TD Insurance, it's explanation and examples are vague. It almost suggest that even if I'm 25%, 50%, 75% at fault, DCPG will still kick in.

Direct Compensation - Property Damage
What it means: If you are the owner of a vehicle and you are involved in an accident where you are not entirely at fault, and at least one of the other vehicles involved is insured under a motor vehicle liability policy, your insurer will pay you for repairs to your vehicle and its contents and compensate you for loss of use of your vehicle. The amount payable will be determined by the degree to which you were not at fault.

Example
A car backing out of a driveway hits you as you are driving past. You are rear-ended at an intersection as you wait for the light to change. Your vehicle is parked in your driveway when a car loses control and hits it. If you and the other party are deemed equally responsible, you will receive half of your damages directly from your own insurance company.


Collision
Collision insurance covers your vehicle if it is damaged in an accident with another vehicle or an object (like a guard rail). We will repair the damages to your vehicle or provide a settlement based on the value of the vehicle at the time of loss. You, any listed driver or anyone driving with your consent is covered.

Example
While driving home from work you rear end another car that is stopped at the traffic lights. The damages to your car will be covered under your collision coverage.


-So from that, if I was 25% at fault, will TDI pay 75% under DCPD and 25% under my collision coverage? Do I pay 25% or 100% of the DCPD deductible?
-And if I'm 50% at fault, will TDI pay 50% under DCPD and 50% under my collision coverage? Do I pay 50% or 100% of the DCPD deductible in this case?

I haven't been in any at fault accident and even those no fault accidents are so rare I don't even know if I pay only part of the deductibles if I'm not totally at fault (collision or DCPD).


Does it even make sense to put a deductible on DCPD to lower my premiums further? I'm only paying around $260 for DCPD on one vehicle and around $240 for another and if I raise deductible to $1,000 from zero, I might save $200-300 per year.

Thanks for any advice/recommendation.
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The reason why I'm asking is I have had an experience where TD Meloche Monnex agent told me the wrong information that if I had put my visiting sister (Canadian with G license) on my policy and she got into an accident in one of my vehicles, removing her from the policy would remove the accident record. I didn't I was fed the wrong information until I asked on the insurance thread and brokers were kind of to tell me what I was told was flat out wrong.

So I know some insurance representatives may not have the right response to policy holder inquiries all the time and even if I had a written confirmation, it could still not past the litmus test in the case of a major accident/claim


TDI explains what it is normally here. Crazy bat shit but then it's broken into two components haha.

https://www.tdinsurance.com/products-se ... ance-Terms

Coverage - Direct Compensation: Coverage that provides compensation for your car and its contents if another person was at-fault, where you collect directly from your own insurer.

Coverage – Property Damage: Protection against liability for damage to property of another, including loss of use of the property.
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You pay the percentage of your DCPD deductible you were at fault.

So if you have a $1,000 deductible and you're 25% at fault, you'll pay $250.

Adding a DCPD deductible is rarely worth it on private passenger vehicle (the saving is usually very minimal). It makes a lot more sense on some commercial vehicles (for example $200,000 semi trucks).
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Thanks for the information, I will keep it at zero deductible for both vehicles as you suggested. It doesn't cost me a lot and we have started driving a bit more and have adjusted mileage accordingly.

So how is this different from collision coverage? If I was paying a deductible on DCPD (hypothetically), it's almost as if I am being dinged by my insurer twice having to pay both deductible when I am partially at fault.

If I am not at fault, I don't seem to have to pay any deductible on both coverages.
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CanadianSpruce wrote: You pay the percentage of your DCPD deductible you were at fault.

So if you have a $1,000 deductible and you're 25% at fault, you'll pay $250.

Adding a DCPD deductible is rarely worth it on private passenger vehicle (the saving is usually very minimal). It makes a lot more sense on some commercial vehicles (for example $200,000 semi trucks).
I have DCPD deductible at $500 to save $250 per year on my premium. Why isn't it worth it? The way I see it is, if I get into any accident and it's my fault, I have to pay $500 to the insurance to have other properties fixed.
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peteryorkuca wrote: I have DCPD deductible at $500 to save $250 per year on my premium. Why isn't it worth it? The way I see it is, if I get into any accident and it's my fault, I have to pay $500 to the insurance to have other properties fixed.
That's a great deal but most companies don't provide much of a saving with a DCPD deductible like that. In your case, I would 100% stuck with the DCPD deductible.
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CanadianSpruce wrote: That's a great deal but most companies don't provide much of a saving with a DCPD deductible like that. In your case, I would 100% stuck with the DCPD deductible.
My other car is only $50 savings per year so, I just opt to keep it $0 deductible. The reason for 1st car had $250 saving is because they gave me options to lump all 3 fam members onto the 1st car. Usually 1 primary and 1 occasional per car, but not gonna argue with them if are willing to do that.
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peteryorkuca wrote: I have DCPD deductible at $500 to save $250 per year on my premium. Why isn't it worth it? The way I see it is, if I get into any accident and it's my fault, I have to pay $500 to the insurance to have other properties fixed.
I will see how much I can save with a $500 and $1,000 deductible.

I doubt either will save me more than $100 since I only pay $240 and $260 annually for DCPD.

TDI calculator is a handy tool and I might as well try simulating the savings ( wouldn't bother irating a TDI rep by having him or her play around numbers but since zi am pretty much wasting no one else's time, I am good) though savings it is showing is prorated (so kinda misleading) as my term ends January.

Not until i check an hour later will I see true annual costs for the various components reflect.
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IMO raising your deductible to $1000 to save $200-$300 isn't worth it. I've been rear ended at a red light once every 5 years on avg writing off my car.
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CanadianConsumerYEG wrote: IMO raising your deductible to $1000 to save $200-$300 isn't worth it. I've been rear ended at a red light once every 5 years on avg writing off my car.
If you are rear ended, wiill DCPD or collision or both cover that? You are clearly not at fault and probably don't have to pay any deductible on either coverage.

That's what confuses me. Why should I set a deductible on the DCPD because that sounds like TDI will ding me on both DCPD and collision if I was partially at fault.

Will chat with TDI to confirm how they work in conjunction with each other.

And yeah, if you think saving $200 with a $1,000 deductible is not worthwhile, i may only save $100, probably not even lol.

Update:
$257 on one with an occasional driver, $201 on ther other vehicle.
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Getting clearer now. DCPD is only in effect in Ontario, while collision is all over US/Canada.

https://www.thinkinsure.ca/insurance-he ... amage.html

What Are The DCPD Rules In Ontario?
There are four criteria that must be met to use DCPD insurance :

Not at-fault : You must not be at-fault for the accident. Fault determination rules under the Insurance Act are used to assess who caused the collision.
Vehicles involved : One or more vehicles must be involved in the accident.
Insured : All vehicles must be identified and insured.
Location : The accident must happen within Ontario.
When all of these situations apply, it will enact direct compensation coverage.

Are All Non At-Fault Accidents Covered Under DCPD?
No. There are certain situations where non at-fault accidents are not claimed under DCPD, such as hit and runs. This will be filed through your collision insurance .

Similarly, if you are involved in an accident with an uninsured driver and are not at-fault, the claim will be filed under the uninsured automobile section of your policy.

Is There A Direct Compensation Property Damage Deductible?
No, most policy holders do not have an deductible for direct compensation property damage insurance and claims. This is the case because you are not at-fault. However, in the case of part of your claim falling under collision, you will be required to pay the deductible.

For example, if you are found to be 20% at-fault, 20% of your claim would fall under collision and 80% under DCPD. This means you would also be required to pay 20% of your collision deductible. If your deductible is $1000, you would have to pay $200.


Interesting. So if I opt to lower my DCPD premium by setting a deductible of $1,000, if i"m at fault 20%, looks like I will have to pay 20% deductible on my collision and DCPD coverages so $200 + $200.

I'll probably skip raising the deductible on DCPD if that's the case as it's just a double whammy in the event my family is partially at fault.
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That sounds a little out of date. I believe Ontario was one of the first provinces to switch to DCPD but every single province has DCPD now (Alberta was the last to switch Jan 1st, 2022). I believe it’s just the territories that use the tort system.
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alanbrenton wrote: If you are rear ended, wiill DCPD or collision or both cover that? You are clearly not at fault and probably don't have to pay any deductible on either coverage.

That's what confuses me. Why should I set a deductible on the DCPD because that sounds like TDI will ding me on both DCPD and collision if I was partially at fault.

Will chat with TDI to confirm how they work in conjunction with each other.

And yeah, if you think saving $200 with a $1,000 deductible is not worthwhile, i may only save $100, probably not even lol.

Update:
$257 on one with an occasional driver, $201 on ther other vehicle.
This happened in Ontario. I only had minimum insurance so no collision coverage. I was 0% at fault and paid nothing to get my car written off and got a cheque. If I put a deductible on DCPD I was told I would be paying the deductible to start the claim even if 0% at fault.
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CanadianConsumerYEG wrote: This happened in Ontario. I only had minimum insurance so no collision coverage. I was 0% at fault and paid nothing to get my car written off and got a cheque. If I put a deductible on DCPD I was told I would be paying the deductible to start the claim even if 0% at fault.
Lol, that's crazy. If you were 0% at fault, shouldn't you be paying 0% on the DCPD deductible? It's based off percentage at fault it seem based on TDI's definition, could be different if you are with a different insurer.

Also if you were skipping comprehensive, doesn't make sense to pay a deductible for DCPD as you deem your vehicle to be of lower replacement value.

My vehicles aren't worth a lot but we started driving to work more so higher chance of getting into accidents.
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alanbrenton wrote: Lol, that's crazy. If you were 0% at fault, shouldn't you be paying 0% on the DCPD deductible? It's based off percentage at fault it seem based on TDI's definition, could be different if you are with a different insurer.

Also if you were skipping comprehensive, doesn't make sense to pay a deductible for DCPD as you deem your vehicle to be of lower replacement value.

My vehicles aren't worth a lot but we started driving to work more so higher chance of getting into accidents.
That's why most policies are $0 deductible for DCPD.

DCPD is only in effect if you're not at fault. If I was at fault for the accident it wouldn't even fall under DCPD but under collision (which I didn't have) and I would be responsible for my own repairs.

I skipped collision + comprehensive. The savings to putting a deductible on DCPD wasn't worth it, I would only be saving $100 a year while the deductible could be $500 or more. Even with a $5k shitbox

I think your math in the other post is off. Let's get 2 things straight-

DCPD is to repair your car when not at fault
Collision coverage is to repair your car when at fault

Let's say you have a $1000 deductible on DCPD and $500 deductible on collision. If you got into a 50/50 at fault accident;

50% would be covered by DCPD, so you need to pay $500/$1000 for that portion
50% would be covered by collision coverage, so you pay $250/500 for that portion

For a total of $750.

If you were 100% responsible for the accident you would pay $500, if you were 0% you would pay $1000.

Not an expert but the above is the way I understand it and was told.

Keep in mind some provinces (like AB up until the beginning of this year) didn't even have DCPD. If you have no collision insurance and got rear ended, you would need to be responsible for fixing your car yourself and would need to personally sue for compensation.
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CanadianSpruce wrote: You pay the percentage of your DCPD deductible you were at fault.

So if you have a $1,000 deductible and you're 25% at fault, you'll pay $250.

Adding a DCPD deductible is rarely worth it on private passenger vehicle (the saving is usually very minimal). It makes a lot more sense on some commercial vehicles (for example $200,000 semi trucks).
Fake news
DCPD is a mandatory coverage with a $0 deductible by default. However, an insured can elect to have a DCPD deductible added to the policy in exchange for a reduction in their premium. In these instances, note that even if you are in a not-at-fault collision, you are responsible for paying that deductible.
https://peacehillsinsurance.com/blog/po ... deductible.

DCPD is coverage for when not at fault
Collision is coverage for at fault

If you were at fault 100% and you have collision, you would pay the collision deductible. DCPD isn't even a factor.

If you are at fault and have no collision coverage, you are responsible for all repairs yourself out of pocket, up to and including just scrapping the car for $100.
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CanadianConsumerYEG wrote: Fake news



https://peacehillsinsurance.com/blog/po ... deductible.

DCPD is coverage for when not at fault
Collision is coverage for at fault

If you were at fault 100% and you have collision, you would pay the collision deductible. DCPD isn't even a factor.

If you are at fault and have no collision coverage, you are responsible for all repairs yourself out of pocket, up to and including just scrapping the car for $100.
This is missing a key requirement- that the other driver's insurance is registered in ON or with the FSCO- otherwise DCPD does not apply.

For example, I was rear-ended (not at fault), in Ontario (I live in Ontario) by a BC driver insured by ICBC. The claim did not quality for DCPD as ICBC is not registered with the FSCO. Therefore my collision coverage is triggered, including its deductible. Thankfully my insurer subrogated the claim, inclusive of the deductible to ICBC, who agreed to cover 100%. Therefore I was found to be 0% at fault, compensated under collision coverage, and did not have to cover the deductible. Worked out for me since I carry a $500 DCPD deductible for ~$200/year savings.
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Kasakato wrote: This is missing a key requirement- that the other driver's insurance is registered in ON or with the FSCO- otherwise DCPD does not apply.

For example, I was rear-ended (not at fault), in Ontario (I live in Ontario) by a BC driver insured by ICBC. The claim did not quality for DCPD as ICBC is not registered with the FSCO. Therefore my collision coverage is triggered, including its deductible. Thankfully my insurer subrogated the claim, inclusive of the deductible to ICBC, who agreed to cover 100%. Therefore I was found to be 0% at fault, compensated under collision coverage, and did not have to cover the deductible. Worked out for me since I carry a $500 DCPD deductible for ~$200/year savings.
True + other factors like hit and run, unidentified driver, if you own both cars, etc where DCPD is not eligible.
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Sounds like one more reason to keep DCPD deductible at zero, at least for those like me who are with TDI:

"And yes Alan, I did get word back, you do pay the full deductible, no matter the percentage of fault"
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CanadianConsumerYEG wrote: True + other factors like hit and run, unidentified driver, if you own both cars, etc where DCPD is not eligible.
true. hit and run - collision
unidentified driver - likely collision
uninsured motorist - uninsured motorist coverage

It was a confusing chat with TDI representative. Although helpful, it doesn't seem she knew what I was asking. I did copy and paste the chat transcript but it came out as ordinary text lol.

When I asked if had to pay $250 for DCPD and $250 for collision in the case I were at 25% fault and had $1,000 deductibles, she was telling me quite a few times that I only had to pay for collision deductible. Not until I asked her why not raise my DCPD to $5,000 to get it close to zero if that were the case, that she correctly her response and said I would be on the hook for both deductibles.

At TDI, I would have to pay 100% deductible as long as I'm partially at fault. If this is true, that's one more reason to keep DCPD at zero deductible.

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