Ottawa and Surrounding Area Real Estate market discussion

MSparrow wrote: ↑ Hello Everyone,
Just looking to see what your thoughts are on the Mattamy stacked townhouses in Blackstone south (which was just released); specifically the buttercup model. I am thinking of purchasing one but not very conversant with the area or if its a good buy. Little information about it: its a 2 bedroom, 1.5 bathroom, 1236 sqF, with an approximate condo fee of $150 and it's been sold for 347,990. Would have preffered a freehold townhouse but the prices have "skyrocketed". Any insight would be appreciated.

freeman93 wrote: ↑ I am really not a fan of stacked townhomes, they cram so much in these spaces. Everything feels so very small, I know it's all about budget. But, I'd rather get an older resale home with more space than a brand new stacked townhome.

MSparrow wrote: ↑ Was actually looking to have it rented out. Following the numbers, would only break even. Hoping it won't be difficult to rent out. Its going to be my first investment property.

MSparrow wrote: ↑ Was actually looking to have it rented out. Following the numbers, would only break even. Hoping it won't be difficult to rent out. Its going to be my first investment property.

wiab89 wrote: ↑ What is your target rent? FYI there are a large number of 2 bed low rise apartments being built along Livery and a high rise apartment planned between Robert Grant and Livery in the next few years so you might have a lot of competition for renters in that area.

MSparrow wrote: ↑ I noticed that too. Targeting a rent of $1650

audiorichard wrote: ↑ For today market, it is more reasonable for $1500 to $1550 with two bedrooms.....Of course, nobody knows the rental market one year later.

William W wrote: ↑ $495k for an end unit TH at Carleton Place.

https://www.redfin.ca/on/carleton-place ... /172687173

Looking at the listing, it looks like the seller accepted a $20k over asking bully offer.

I suppose there is some merit to the story here.
https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-ne ... l-underway

MSparrow wrote: ↑ Was actually looking to have it rented out. Following the numbers, would only break even. Hoping it won't be difficult to rent out. Its going to be my first investment property.

Tadalafil wrote: ↑ I'm not a fan of the development for few reasons.

First I don't think land in Kanata is valuable enough yet to justify buying condos, especially that price point. You can get similar priced condos (albeit smaller) within the downtown area. You are probably looking at 370k after basic upgrades from the builder, and another 5~10k in appliances, AC, window coverings, etc. That money gives you a lot of choices among condos within the green belt.

Second the parking situation is often a shit show for these buildings as they only provide 1 parking space per unit, but most working couples in the burbs have two cars. Having one parking space is OK within the greenbelt where transit is usually much more accessible. It is often a deal breaker for the burbs where commuting by transit alone is asking for a rough time. Communities packed with townhouses are pretty bad for this as well as new towns only provide one car length driveways, and most people have junk in the garage. The excess cars just get spilled onto the streets. These condos will often have no parking signs on all the narrow roads in and around the condos.

Third is I'm not sure what niche that these buildings serve in the rental market. Couples with children prefer beds+2.5 baths towns with 2 parking spaces. Younger DINKs that are OK with smaller spaces tend to want places closer to downtown. Retirees and downsizers typically have money to buy instead of rent, and these aren't attractive as rentals anyways compared to bungalows and condos with elevators. Good litmus test for owning a rental is if I (or a younger version of myself without kids) would live there, and the answer for suburban condo town is a no.

Lastly, these things are not cheap right now whatsoever. Yes, 2 story towns ballooned in price in the last couple of years, but so has these. Resale condo towns along Strandherd and Longfields in Barrhaven (market that I am most familiar with) were available for ~200k in 2018. These went up as much as, if not more in percentage wise as 2 story towns. IMO these have no business selling at 350k+.

Tadalafil wrote: ↑ Just a general observation- investing in Ottawa RE for cashflow now has such a high bar for expertise and skills that it might as well be dead for the average mom and pop investor. I freely admit it is well beyond my capabilities to add cashflowing properties to my portfolio.

The rental market is much weaker (renters typically work lower paid jobs which were more affected by Covid) yet the resale prices keep climbing. Airbnb and student boarding houses, the two go-to strategies for squeezing every last income potential out of a property, burned many investors and turned investments into liabilities.

Think "investors" looking to get in right now would be served well by reminding themselves that they are speculating instead of investing. Speculation is not necessarily a dirty word, and returns on speculation can be very handsome as seen in many markets. My personal returns so far on appreciation trumps returns from cashflow by many factor .However strategies for investing and speculating should be different, and it is best not to confuse the two.

Tadalafil wrote: ↑ I'm not a fan of the development for few reasons.

First I don't think land in Kanata is valuable enough yet to justify buying condos, especially that price point. You can get similar priced condos (albeit smaller) within the downtown area. You are probably looking at 370k after basic upgrades from the builder, and another 5~10k in appliances, AC, window coverings, etc. That money gives you a lot of choices among condos within the green belt.

Second the parking situation is often a shit show for these buildings as they only provide 1 parking space per unit, but most working couples in the burbs have two cars. Having one parking space is OK within the greenbelt where transit is usually much more accessible. It is often a deal breaker for the burbs where commuting by transit alone is asking for a rough time. Communities packed with townhouses are pretty bad for this as well as new towns only provide one car length driveways, and most people have junk in the garage. The excess cars just get spilled onto the streets. These condos will often have no parking signs on all the narrow roads in and around the condos.

Third is I'm not sure what niche that these buildings serve in the rental market. Couples with children prefer 3 beds+2.5 baths towns with 2 parking spaces. Younger DINKs that are OK with smaller spaces tend to want places closer to downtown. Retirees and downsizers typically have money to buy instead of rent, and these aren't attractive as rentals anyways compared to bungalows and condos with elevators. Good litmus test for owning a rental is if I (or a younger version of myself without kids) would live there, and the answer for suburban condo town is a no.

Lastly, these things are not cheap right now whatsoever. Yes, 2 story towns ballooned in price in the last couple of years, but so has these. Resale condo towns along Strandherd and Longfields in Barrhaven (market that I am most familiar with) were available for ~200k in 2018. These went up as much as, if not more in percentage wise as 2 story towns. IMO these have no business selling at 350k+.

gohabsgo1 wrote: ↑ I was just informed by my builder that my stittsville single will be delayed by about 3.5 and now close in March. Now that they’ve started delays, do they typically respect the new deadline or can I expect delay after delay now?

raaaaam wrote: ↑ Asking for opinions. We are offered a lookout basement for our new build for 3k. The premuim includes larger basement windows, a 6x8 ft deck for the main floor and around 7 to 8 steps. Unfortunately making it a walkout is not an option. With the lookout change, we would get a fairly flat backyard which otherwise would have a larger slope. From price point of view, it is a good value IMO. But is lookout basement advantageous over regular one?

gohabsgo1 wrote: ↑ I was just informed by my builder that my stittsville single will be delayed by about 3.5 and now close in March. Now that they’ve started delays, do they typically respect the new deadline or can I expect delay after delay now?

raaaaam wrote: ↑ Asking for opinions. We are offered a lookout basement for our new build for 3k. The premuim includes larger basement windows, a 6x8 ft deck for the main floor and around 7 to 8 steps. Unfortunately making it a walkout is not an option. With the lookout change, we would get a fairly flat backyard which otherwise would have a larger slope. From price point of view, it is a good value IMO. But is lookout basement advantageous over regular one?