Automotive

Red Light Camera Ticket - Picture Shows Me Stopped

  • Last Updated:
  • Sep 12th, 2021 11:06 pm
Banned
Jun 4, 2020
1634 posts
1750 upvotes
Clarington, ON
"Pictures show me stopped..."

Darn old stills.... They gots to upgrade to video evidence.
Deal Guru
User avatar
Mar 23, 2008
13006 posts
10009 upvotes
Edmonton
KevinM56081 wrote: "Pictures show me stopped..."

Darn old stills.... They gots to upgrade to video evidence.
They did it in Harry Potter… :)

C
Deal Addict
May 23, 2009
3681 posts
2388 upvotes
Mississauga
hahaty wrote: OP, why would you lie to a bunch of strangers on a random message board about stopping for 4 whole seconds?
OP deserves some credit though for not opening a new account to ask for advise. That is like rule #1 on RFD when in the wrong but asking for anonymous advise.
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Jul 4, 2005
9018 posts
2816 upvotes
Ottawa
Maybe mto photoshopped the op’s car out of pic 2 and sent him this ticket, just maybe…
Deal Fanatic
User avatar
Sep 9, 2012
6959 posts
6077 upvotes
Oakville, ON
Kyle12345 wrote: Hey,

Just got a red light camera ticket. None of the pictures show me proceeding through the intersection on a red light. The picture shows me stopped at the red light before the line. Second picture shows the intersection. Third picture shows the license place zoomed in from the first picture.

I actually stopped within the 4 seconds of the yellow. Light turned red while still stopped. And then turned right after it turned red.

What are your thoughts? If this is going to take hours and hours of my time, I might be better off paying it. But can they actually convict at court with just these pictures? Lol
Can you re-post the the first 2 pics + the header on both? Need to see larger & clearer + both headers to see if you have a case
Deal Addict
User avatar
May 8, 2007
1284 posts
486 upvotes
BC
hahaty wrote: OP, why would you lie to a bunch of strangers on a random message board about stopping for 4 whole seconds?
Maybe OP is not lying but thinks he remembers what he did at that intersection. Really, who accurately remembers the details of everything we did when we were driving days or weeks earlier? If nothing significant happened, we probably don’t remember any detail at all.

But what he “remembers” is actually formed from his incorrect misinterpretation of the red light camera photos. The photo sort of makes it look like he was stopped. But if we study the photos and the speed indicator we conclude he was moving fast around that corner, and the ticket is correct.

Need to consult a psychology professor who specializes in memory.
Deal Fanatic
Jul 26, 2007
7579 posts
5272 upvotes
Toronto
If you had ran the yellow, most likely you wouldn't have gotten a ticket. Problem here is your car was rolling when the camera was activated from yellow on red light. If you have stayed just a second on red, you would have been cleared.
Newbie
Jul 7, 2020
46 posts
52 upvotes
adams7 wrote: Maybe OP is not lying but thinks he remembers what he did at that intersection. Really, who accurately remembers the details of everything we did when we were driving days or weeks earlier? If nothing significant happened, we probably don’t remember any detail at all.

But what he “remembers” is actually formed from his incorrect misinterpretation of the red light camera photos. The photo sort of makes it look like he was stopped. But if we study the photos and the speed indicator we conclude he was moving fast around that corner, and the ticket is correct.

Need to consult a psychology professor who specializes in memory.
The first photo in red light camera tickets is always going to show the car behind the stop line with the light showing red. You also typically get the speed of the car on the photo. The second photo shows them entering the intersection afterward. The funny thing is that the OP was going so fast on the right turn that the second frame didn't catch them.
Banned
User avatar
Mar 7, 2007
5347 posts
3026 upvotes
100Pacer wrote:
You’re approaching at 35 KM/H. You didn’t come to a complete stop at the line prior to turning. You went right through. Ticket is legitimate.
rfdPFthrowaway wrote:
Exactly. Look at the opposing traffic. The left turning car barely moved between both photos yet the OPs car is completely out of frame already by the second photo. The left turning car probably saw OP trying to beat the red so it waited. The other cars that stopped for the red also barely moved. He must have taken that turn at a fast speed without stopping.

Guilty as charged.

One second. Just one second.

This is an bogus ticket unless it is the proper HTA section.

Proceed contrary to sign at intersection – Highway Traffic Act 144.9
Disobey sign – Highway Traffic Act 182.2
Disobey sign – Applicable municipal By-law

In other words... If the ticket says he ran the red light, then the ticket is wrong. Because he turned (I assume contrary to a posted sign).


EDIT: Also, if there is no posted sign indicating a right turn is not allowed during the red light, then what did the OP do wrong? Unless they have video, it is just assumptions.
______________________________
Deal Addict
Sep 13, 2012
2724 posts
2297 upvotes
Vaughan, ON
motomondo wrote: One second. Just one second.

This is an bogus ticket unless it is the proper HTA section.

Proceed contrary to sign at intersection – Highway Traffic Act 144.9
Disobey sign – Highway Traffic Act 182.2
Disobey sign – Applicable municipal By-law

In other words... If the ticket says he ran the red light, then the ticket is wrong. Because he turned (I assume contrary to a posted sign).


EDIT: Also, if there is no posted sign indicating a right turn is not allowed during the red light, then what did the OP do wrong? Unless they have video, it is just assumptions.
You do realize the red light applies to all even those turning right prior to them actually proceeding past the line?

It’s actually remarkable how this is news to some drivers.
Deal Expert
User avatar
Oct 23, 2008
19235 posts
17863 upvotes
GTA, ON
motomondo wrote: One second. Just one second.

This is an bogus ticket unless it is the proper HTA section.

Proceed contrary to sign at intersection – Highway Traffic Act 144.9
Disobey sign – Highway Traffic Act 182.2
Disobey sign – Applicable municipal By-law

In other words... If the ticket says he ran the red light, then the ticket is wrong. Because he turned (I assume contrary to a posted sign).


EDIT: Also, if there is no posted sign indicating a right turn is not allowed during the red light, then what did the OP do wrong? Unless they have video, it is just assumptions.
Turning left, going straight, or turning right: vehicle must stop at red. Right turn on red can occur after coming to a full stop and if the way is clear & safe, and there is no signage prohibiting the turn.
Tis banana is IRIE 😎

10% off is cold, 50% off is warm, 75% off is hot, but FREE IS RFD!
Banned
User avatar
Mar 7, 2007
5347 posts
3026 upvotes
100Pacer wrote: You do realize the red light applies to all even those turning right prior to them actually proceeding past the line?

It’s actually remarkable how this is news to some drivers.
Not sure what you mean. I believe each ticket has to have the correct HTA section. One section does not "apply to all".

Not stopping for the red light is HTA section 144.18

If it is different, I would like to learn more about this.
______________________________
Banned
User avatar
Mar 7, 2007
5347 posts
3026 upvotes
chimaican wrote: Turning left, going straight, or turning right: vehicle must stop at red. Right turn on red can occur after coming to a full stop and if the way is clear & safe, and there is no signage prohibiting the turn.
Folks, I am NOT arguing that the OP didn't break the rules. Not sayin' he is 100% innocent.

What I am saying is... every moving violation ticket has to have the HTA section. And it has to be the correct one. What is in the ticket?
______________________________
Deal Addict
Mar 3, 2018
3475 posts
3994 upvotes
GTA
100Pacer wrote: You do realize the red light applies to all even those turning right prior to them actually proceeding past the line?

It’s actually remarkable how this is news to some drivers.
It is amazing how many people I see just roll through a right turn on a red light without stopping. Like a stop sign one is required to come to a complete stop before turning right on a red.

Besides catching those that run straight through a red light the cameras also catch those who fail to stop when turning right on a red light.
Last edited by DaveTheDude on Sep 10th, 2021 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Member
Sep 15, 2018
439 posts
90 upvotes
bubuski wrote: I know this exact intersection at Heartland. Do you have a dashcam video footage to help exonorate you?

The still images show the other cars slowing down but no brake lights on yours. Unless you were the 1st to arrive and the light has been red for a while.

The car across from you turning left does not help. That lane does not have an advanced Green and the driver stopped past the line.
engineered wrote: Can you let us see close ups of the photos?
Do you have dashcam video to prove your case?
No dash cam unfortunately.
Member
Sep 15, 2018
439 posts
90 upvotes
at1212b wrote: The issue was once it turned red, that's when the timer starts. Not how long you stopped before hand. You should have just sped through the yellow then you would have been safe.

When I see a red light camera, which I always watch out for like a hawk, and it turns red, I don't care, I stop for a full 3 seconds at least. I'm not even looking all the way left. Just stay in a bubble type thing. Then look left to see any cars coming.

I've had times where a car has been behind my ass and they don't stop and just tail me. I'm wondering if those cars get ticketed.
peteryorkuca wrote: If you had ran the yellow, most likely you wouldn't have gotten a ticket. Problem here is your car was rolling when the camera was activated from yellow on red light. If you have stayed just a second on red, you would have been cleared.
Yah but the problem is I didn’t see it turn yellow, I saw the yellow but was not sure when it changed so I decided to stop as I usually do if I miss the light changing due to looking at odometer, changing radio channels, looking at the time, etc.
Banned
User avatar
Mar 7, 2007
5347 posts
3026 upvotes
DaveTheDude wrote: It is amazing how many people I see just roll through a right turn on a red light without stopping. Like a stop sign one is required to come to a complete stop before turning right on a red.

Besides catching those that run straight through a red light the cameras also catch those who fail to stop when turning right on a red light.
Completely agree with you, these are dangerous practices.

HOWEVER, these two are not the same, they are difference offences in the HTA. For good reason.

To be "guilty as charged", it has to be the correct charge.

I will say it again - I'm not defending the OP, or saying that the OP didn't break the law. But I think the OP could research the possibility the ticket is wrong.
______________________________
Member
Sep 15, 2018
439 posts
90 upvotes
CNeufeld wrote: So first off, there's a whole "Fighting your traffic ticket" thread, stickied at the top of this forum. You might want to browse through there (and this post belongs in there).

Second, you don't show the top of first image. Was there a header on there, showing your speed? Because I'm thinking it's what the others have indicated; you were travelling at a decent rate of speed when you got to the corner. It's a still-motion picture; even if you're moving it would look like you're stopped.

Third, another possibility is that you stopped on the wrong side of the stop line. The top picture looks like you might be across it. Sucks, but them's the breaks (if that's the case).

Fourth, realistically the only way you fight this and win is if you have dash-cam footage to dispute the photo radar evidence. However, that doesn't mean that you can't request a trial and negotiate a discount.

Fifth, one more option is that it was a "no right turn on red", but I don't see any signs for that in your pictures. Doesn't mean they don't exist, though, out of the camera frame.

C
1.) sry abt the wrong section post.

2.) I’ll post a better pic when I get home.

3.) yah I’m not too sure.

4.) do you mind elaborating? I’ve never gotten this or been through anything of this sort. If I request a trial, they will lower the fine?

5.) right turns are allowed, no signs prohibiting.
Member
Sep 15, 2018
439 posts
90 upvotes
bubuski wrote: OP deserves some credit though for not opening a new account to ask for advise. That is like rule #1 on RFD when in the wrong but asking for anonymous advise.
LOOL, not gonna lie I thought abt it. Only cause these sorta posts usually get trashed haha but thought oh well instead haha.
Member
Sep 15, 2018
439 posts
90 upvotes
engineered wrote: Can you let us see close ups of the photos?
Do you have dashcam video to prove your case?
CanadianLurker wrote:
Can you re-post the the first 2 pics + the header on both? Need to see larger & clearer + both headers to see if you have a case
I’ll post when I get home later today. But both headers had the same time showing 19:18 with no seconds or milliseconds?
Last edited by Kyle12345 on Sep 10th, 2021 4:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top