Sports & Recreation

RFD Raptors Lounge - NBA CHAMPIONS!

Deal Fanatic
Apr 8, 2013
9901 posts
648 upvotes
kenchau wrote: Wins are no excuse to critique the shortcomings of the team. Golden State is better, but it doesn't matter what record they finish with, they are not going far in the playoffs. They don't have much if the 3's aren't falling...no different than the Raptors. They are better than the Raptors because they are a better shooting team and they at least slash inside more. But you need bigs and an inside presence and (at least some) defence to win championships. Golden State lost to the Nets because Brook Lopez ate them up inside - they couldn't stop him, nor a streaky Jarret Jack.
Golden State is pretty much like the Raptors if 3's arent falling?. LOL. What a ridiculous statement. Curry and Klay doesnt just shoot 3's you know.

That team could go far. The only team in the West that have a real offensive inside presence is Memphis. Aldridge and Griffin's game is more mid range. Dwight sucks offensively. DJ is only good with dunks, also disappears in important games in the playoffs. Ibaka is also a mid range guy. As long as Bogut remains healthy, they are alright.

Golden State lost to the lakers too. What does that mean?. Nets is a very strong team. The only reason they have a bad record is because of injuries.
Deal Expert
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Jan 8, 2007
23363 posts
624 upvotes
Toronto
MaximDude wrote: As much as I want JV to develop into something potentially great here, I kinda wouldn't mind seeing him going to another team that would have interest in developing him properly because as long as Casey is coach of the Raps, JV is F**KED it seems. :confused:

How can JV develop if F**KING Casey never plays him? There's absolutely NO EXCUSE why our talented big man only got 2 SHOTS against the sh*ty 76ers while ball hog Derozan shot to his heart's content to a decent 50% FG for that game.

JV isn't perfect, but for some reason Casey constantly seems to love f**king him over and screwing with him by not giving him play time or running any kind of plays for him or putting him in when the game is on the line. On the otherhand Casey has no problem with pulling JV whenever he feels like even when he's done nothing wrong. I still remember like a month or so ago when JV had a monster game and shot for something like 14-16 Casey STILL didn't play him much in the 4th quarter. I just don't understand what Casey has against JV, but yet no matter how sh$tty our guards play, especially with Derozan he will simply let them continue to play and do whatever they want including shooting our team into losses without holding any of them accountable.

I'm sick of Casey and I want him GONE ASAP and I'm at a point where I wish Derozan would get a serious injury and be out for the season just so hopefully it will force Casey to play JV more and allow him to develop. I'm tired of seeing Demar do little else but be a low percentage chucker and I really wish we could trade him already because he's never going to lead the Raps anywhere.

And I also really want the Raps to give JV alot of play time and give him much more opportunity to shoot the ball. Even Raps commentators like Leo and Jack have been questioning Casey's choices regarding JV now. And Leo has pointed out that JV needs to be involved in the offense more because not only can he score but he also helps spread the floor and allow for our guards to get better shots like they were earlier in the season. And another good thing about JV is that he isn't a blackhole. Namely as Leo has pointed out when you pass the ball to him, he's willing to pass it back instead of making a bad shot attempt. In short we need to develop JV ASAP and give him more responsibility and see what his ceiling is. For all we know maybe he could potentially be another Pau Gasol, but he may never reach his full potential with the way how much Casey screws around with him.
JV doesn't even shoot the mid-range jumper anymore because that would get him pulled even quicker!!!

Look at Demarcus Cousins FG% and large number of turnovers. :( JV deserves 10-12 FGA a night.
Deal Fanatic
Apr 11, 2006
7733 posts
2588 upvotes
Mississauga
kevindurant1 wrote: Golden State is pretty much like the Raptors if 3's arent falling?. LOL. What a ridiculous statement. Curry and Klay doesnt just shoot 3's you know.

That team could go far. The only team in the West that have a real offensive inside presence is Memphis. Aldridge and Griffin's game is more mid range. Dwight sucks offensively. DJ is only good with dunks, also disappears in important games in the playoffs. Ibaka is also a mid range guy. As long as Bogut remains healthy, they are alright.

Golden State lost to the lakers too. What does that mean?. Nets is a very strong team. The only reason they have a bad record is because of injuries.
Of the dozen or so GSW games that I watched, when their 3's weren't falling, they lost. Granted they don't have even close to the number of poor 3-point shooting games like the Raptors do, because they typically take quality shots and spread the ball. The point is they lost - so same result. The most memorable one was against the Bulls where they literally didn't hit a single 3-point attempt for the entire second half and overtime, and Rose had one of his worst games in recent memory (not because of GSW's defense but because Rose was just chucking it to no end that game). But GSW still lost because of the Bulls' inside presence defensively and offensively.

I'm not saying that all their losses are because of the 3's not falling, but I am saying when their 3's aren't falling they've lost (from the games I watched).
Deal Guru
User avatar
Jul 16, 2003
10103 posts
390 upvotes
Toronto
Guess you watched the only 12 games they've lost all season lol

Golden state is legit.... Offensive and defensive efficiency and they have a bench.... In the playoffs having a healthy bogut is key
Follow me on instagram to see Toronto https://instagram.com/kennyk3n/
Deal Fanatic
Apr 11, 2006
7733 posts
2588 upvotes
Mississauga
MaximDude wrote: As much as I want JV to develop into something potentially great here, I kinda wouldn't mind seeing him going to another team that would have interest in developing him properly because as long as Casey is coach of the Raps, JV is F**KED it seems. :confused:




How can JV develop if F**KING Casey never plays him? There's absolutely NO EXCUSE why our talented big man only got 2 SHOTS against the sh*ty 76ers while ball hog Derozan shot to his heart's content to a decent 50% FG for that game.

JV isn't perfect, but for some reason Casey constantly seems to love f**king him over and screwing with him by not giving him play time or running any kind of plays for him or putting him in when the game is on the line. On the otherhand Casey has no problem with pulling JV whenever he feels like even when he's done nothing wrong. I still remember like a month or so ago when JV had a monster game and shot for something like 14-16 Casey STILL didn't play him much in the 4th quarter. I just don't understand what Casey has against JV, but yet no matter how sh$tty our guards play, especially with Derozan he will simply let them continue to play and do whatever they want including shooting our team into losses without holding any of them accountable.

I'm sick of Casey and I want him GONE ASAP and I'm at a point where I wish Derozan would get a serious injury and be out for the season just so hopefully it will force Casey to play JV more and allow him to develop. I'm tired of seeing Demar do little else but be a low percentage chucker and I really wish we could trade him already because he's never going to lead the Raps anywhere.

And I also really want the Raps to give JV alot of play time and give him much more opportunity to shoot the ball. Even Raps commentators like Leo and Jack have been questioning Casey's choices regarding JV now. And Leo has pointed out that JV needs to be involved in the offense more because not only can he score but he also helps spread the floor and allow for our guards to get better shots like they were earlier in the season. And another good thing about JV is that he isn't a blackhole. Namely as Leo has pointed out when you pass the ball to him, he's willing to pass it back instead of making a bad shot attempt. In short we need to develop JV ASAP and give him more responsibility and see what his ceiling is. For all we know maybe he could potentially be another Pau Gasol, but he may never reach his full potential with the way how much Casey screws around with him.
Psubs wrote: JV doesn't even shoot the mid-range jumper anymore because that would get him pulled even quicker!!!

Look at Demarcus Cousins FG% and large number of turnovers. :( JV deserves 10-12 FGA a night.
To rub salt on that wound of ours, JV is ranked 5th in the league in FG%, and with just 26 minutes a game, he is 18th in rebounds per game, and 25th in double-doubles.

*sigh* Casey deserves a :facepalm:
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Sep 14, 2006
8328 posts
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kenchau wrote: To rub salt on that wound of ours, JV is ranked 5th in the league in FG%, and with just 26 minutes a game, he is 18th in rebounds per game, and 25th in double-doubles.

*sigh* Casey deserves a :facepalm:
It'd be funny if JV was traded to another team and they give him the minutes and he turns out a consistent 25 and 12 every game while still shooting over fiddy percent. Then when they interview him, he says Casey never gave him the opportunity so that's why his numbers in Toronto were so low.
TEAM CANADA!!!!!!!!!!!
Deal Guru
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Mar 1, 2008
13941 posts
3215 upvotes
Toronto, Ontario
kenchau wrote: To rub salt on that wound of ours, JV is ranked 5th in the league in FG%, and with just 26 minutes a game, he is 18th in rebounds per game, and 25th in double-doubles.

*sigh* Casey deserves a :facepalm:
Don't forget that those ratings come because he is there to clean up the mess at the rim. Anyone can do that if they are 7 feet table and can box out well enough I think? As much as we like Jonas, his handles are poor. Have you seen how he handles double teams and passes that aren't thrown straight at him? A lot of times it ends up as a turnover.
Sr. Member
Apr 4, 2009
932 posts
192 upvotes
My biggest issue with JV's development, coming out of the draft, JV was known to be very agile. Casey tells him to bulk up and he lost all that agility. Now he's too slow to guard pick and rolls

Even the coach of the Lithuanian team criticized the Raptors for making JV bulk up - knowing his speed was his advantage against other centers. Speaking of the Lithuanian national team, JV is a completely different player compared to the Raptors. He actually passes the ball back to the perimeter and feels more comfortable out there

I really do think if JV were to succeed, it won't be here with the Raptors.

It's a shame too because these past few drafts produced some decent quality Centers. In the mid 2000's Greg Oden was supposed to be the next dominant center and he was one injury after another. Hasheem Thabeet turned out to be a total bust too. Now we have (Off the top of my head) Davis, Aldridge, Hortford who had to play out of position, Drummond, Gobert, Gasol, Noel, JV, Nurkic, Cousins, Jordan heck even Whiteside. With Karl Towns, Jahil Okafor coming in, the Center spot looks to be talented again. Even now most of these C's don't see a sniff in the 4th quarter because either teams love small ball, or these C's can't hit a FT. That's JV's biggest advantage over these guys. Might see fewer small ball in the future
Deal Fanatic
Apr 11, 2006
7733 posts
2588 upvotes
Mississauga
kitchensink wrote: My biggest issue with JV's development, coming out of the draft, JV was known to be very agile. Casey tells him to bulk up and he lost all that agility. Now he's too slow to guard pick and rolls

Even the coach of the Lithuanian team criticized the Raptors for making JV bulk up - knowing his speed was his advantage against other centers. Speaking of the Lithuanian national team, JV is a completely different player compared to the Raptors. He actually passes the ball back to the perimeter and feels more comfortable out there

I really do think if JV were to succeed, it won't be here with the Raptors.

It's a shame too because these past few drafts produced some decent quality Centers. In the mid 2000's Greg Oden was supposed to be the next dominant center and he was one injury after another. Hasheem Thabeet turned out to be a total bust too. Now we have (Off the top of my head) Davis, Aldridge, Hortford who had to play out of position, Drummond, Gobert, Gasol, Noel, JV, Nurkic, Cousins, Jordan heck even Whiteside. With Karl Towns, Jahil Okafor coming in, the Center spot looks to be talented again. Even now most of these C's don't see a sniff in the 4th quarter because either teams love small ball, or these C's can't hit a FT. That's JV's biggest advantage over these guys. Might see fewer small ball in the future
The problem is...earlier in the season, Casey's excuse for not playing JV in the 4th quarter was because opposing teams were playing small ball. Then as time went on, even teams that didn't play small ball in the 4th quarter, Casey still played small ball. So regardless of there being less small ball in the future, Casey is still going to be the dumbest coach ever and JV will still be on the bench.

The most frustrating thing is when you see Hansbrough in there in the 4th quarter instead of JV. Even if Casey were to not play JV in the 4th, there's no reason why it can't be Amir Johnson, James Johnson, and Patrick Patterson as your forwards in the game down the wire - they are very mobile and can keep up on defense and Patterson still provides that 3-pt threat. But no, he insists on 3 guards who all shot for a poor percentage, despite our bigs being the best on the team in terms of ball movement.
Deal Addict
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Jul 13, 2014
3869 posts
1271 upvotes
Parry Sound
Keep Lowry (unless we can magically get Lillard)
Keep DeRozan (he's a Raptor no matter what)
Keep Lou
Keep AJ
Keep PP
Maybe keep JV and JJ if no fit replacement available

Scrap the rest.
Sr. Member
Apr 4, 2009
932 posts
192 upvotes
kenchau wrote: The problem is...earlier in the season, Casey's excuse for not playing JV in the 4th quarter was because opposing teams were playing small ball. Then as time went on, even teams that didn't play small ball in the 4th quarter, Casey still played small ball. So regardless of there being less small ball in the future, Casey is still going to be the dumbest coach ever and JV will still be on the bench.

The most frustrating thing is when you see Hansbrough in there in the 4th quarter instead of JV. Even if Casey were to not play JV in the 4th, there's no reason why it can't be Amir Johnson, James Johnson, and Patrick Patterson as your forwards in the game down the wire - they are very mobile and can keep up on defense and Patterson still provides that 3-pt threat. But no, he insists on 3 guards who all shot for a poor percentage, despite our bigs being the best on the team in terms of ball movement.
Oh don't get me wrong, I think Casey's best case scenario is leading us into constant 1st or 2nd round exit if lucky. That Detroit game is still fresh on my mind when JV went 14/15 against Detroit's bigs. He opted to go small ball and Detroit countered with their bigs and ended up winning the game. Even Monty Williams countered Casey's small ball with Ajinca and Asik and cut out 18 point lead into single digits. Those bigs had their way with rebounding. Even when we lost to an undermanned Milwaukee team, Jason Kidd had to play small ball because of the circumstances of the lineup. Casey for some stupid reason decided to match Milwaukee's lineup instead of punishing them inside
Deal Expert
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Jan 8, 2007
23363 posts
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Toronto
MayorOfToronto wrote: Keep Lowry (unless we can magically get Lillard)
Keep DeRozan (he's a Raptor no matter what)
Keep Lou
Keep AJ
Keep PP
Maybe keep JV and JJ if no fit replacement available

Scrap the rest.
I would let Lou actually walk because he's not efficient and too inconsistent. First throw that money at bigger FA's that can start; already paying Vasquez and Patterson off the bench. Atlanta is doing fine playing more team ball. :|

Definitely keep JV and JJ, they help the team a lot on the defensive side.

Hmmmm, Deandre Daniels coming back to North America and a late first pick to add... Tyus Jones from Duke or Delon Wright from Utah? Both are underclassmen so they have time to develop.

PG Lowry - Vasquez - Jones
SG Derozan - Ross
SF JJohnson - Daniels - Caboclo
PF Amir - Patterson
C Valanciunas - Amir - Nogueira

I am still going with the theory that upper managment wants to keep JV and Ross down so their post-rookie contract extensions are cheap. :mad: At this rate JV will be around $12 million per year and Ross around $6 million. That's probably a savings of $8 million per year.
Deal Fanatic
Apr 8, 2013
9901 posts
648 upvotes
kenchau wrote: Of the dozen or so GSW games that I watched, when their 3's weren't falling, they lost. Granted they don't have even close to the number of poor 3-point shooting games like the Raptors do, because they typically take quality shots and spread the ball. The point is they lost - so same result. The most memorable one was against the Bulls where they literally didn't hit a single 3-point attempt for the entire second half and overtime, and Rose had one of his worst games in recent memory (not because of GSW's defense but because Rose was just chucking it to no end that game). But GSW still lost because of the Bulls' inside presence defensively and offensively.

I'm not saying that all their losses are because of the 3's not falling, but I am saying when their 3's aren't falling they've lost (from the games I watched).
Teams lose. It happens.

And 3 point is much more important than having a presence inside when it comes to the playoffs. A team needs to be able to drain their threes in order for them to get anywhere. I cant think of any championship team that sucked in shooting threes.

Jordan 91-93 didnt have a true inside big. Even during the rodman days, they didnt really have it. Rodman was a defensive monster. I guess you could say Luc longley was one but he didnt really carry any significant offensive load.

Lebron's miami didnt have a true scoring big. Bosh was a mid range guy.

Spurs last year was carried by their threes. Duncan was carried.

Celtics with Garnett and them didnt have it.

Dirk 2X finals showing didnt have an offensive prescence inside. When they won, Chandler was a defensive and rebounding god. Dirk was lights out with his shooting.

Like I said man, Memphis is the only team that falls into that category. I can tell you that in past years that they have been cheated by the NBA but still they havent even been into the finals. They are montrous in the paint.
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Feb 26, 2004
26999 posts
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Raps reportedly interested in JaVale McGee. He'd be a good pickup for the team.

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