Off Topic

Time to start Canadian manufacturing!

Deal Addict
Apr 30, 2011
3267 posts
387 upvotes
RICHMOND HILL
These are recommendations, not actual policy. Any long-term strategies pushed by the federal government will face significant opposition from other parties, provinces, industries, and interest groups. Buying votes is easy. Earning the voter's trust is hard. Considering that the last two administrations came to power through divide and conquer tactics and retained it in the same way, it's no wonder that they couldn't get universal support for any policy.

Also, I've found a full copy of the book you're quoting as these conclusions are useless without context. My observation is that the corresponding paragraphs are vague at best and apt to produce major social upheaval at worst. I hope you at least have some idea of their implications both administratively and politically. In today's partisan government, each of these conclusions is politically sensitive enough for an administration to lose voter support and be kicked out of office - only for the policies to be overturned by the subsequent government to keep votes.
Sr. Member
Mar 6, 2015
689 posts
50 upvotes
liemhoho wrote: Here here
What do you mean?
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Meiji: Ambassador Swanbeck, I have concluded that your treaty is NOT in the best interests of my people. So sorry, but you may not.
Swanbeck: This is an outrage!
Sr. Member
Mar 6, 2015
689 posts
50 upvotes
loserga wrote: Considering that the last two administrations came to power through divide and conquer tactics and retained it in the same way, it's no wonder that they couldn't get universal support for any policy. In today's partisan government, each of these conclusions is politically sensitive enough for an administration to lose voter support and be kicked out of office - only for the policies to be overturned by the subsequent government to keep votes.
Thank you for taking time reading my posts. Regardless, at least my effort of posting attracted person including you to the issue.
So excusing me for being blunt or incorrect use of terms, do you think keeping business in Canada benefit the nation, its business and citizens at all, even if or if not localism, nativism or patriotism mean anything, good or bad?
Regarding Implications, you are welcomed as any RFDer to share your stuff --- ideas, thoughts, solutions and whatnots.
If the post or comment helps or delights you, please CLICK that LIKE BUTTON!😃
Meiji: Ambassador Swanbeck, I have concluded that your treaty is NOT in the best interests of my people. So sorry, but you may not.
Swanbeck: This is an outrage!
Deal Addict
Apr 30, 2011
3267 posts
387 upvotes
RICHMOND HILL
cybercavalier wrote: Thank you for taking time reading my posts. Regardless, at least my effort of posting attracted person including you to the issue.
So excusing me for being blunt or incorrect use of terms, do you think keeping business in Canada benefit the nation, its business and citizens at all, even if or if not localism, nativism or patriotism mean anything, good or bad?
Regarding Implications, you are welcomed as any RFDer to share your stuff --- ideas, thoughts, solutions and whatnots.
I think this is too simple a question for our situation as it's rather obvious that no business is bad, so I'll pose a different question: Do I think Canada is effectively prioritizing the support of its industries such that both businesses and citizens benefit, regardless of territorial ideology? I'm leaning towards no.

There is a geopolitical factor to this issue. Our highest-capitalized industries - Finance, Energy, and Materials, are largely concentrated in different parts of the country. This usually results in a tug-of-war between the provinces when vying for federal support, and over the last few decades we've seen the incumbent party either trying to satisfy all parties, or pandering to a few of them as part of their strategy. A consistent problem is that our industries are uncompetitive in international markets, and require streamlining of processes, infrastructure and personnel. Forcing these conditions on companies and people is not going to help you stay in power. Unless staff are equipped with transferable skills which allow transition to other lines of work, there will be a lot of unhappy voters which the opposition parties will only be so glad to promise the moon to. There are also many areas which are singularly dependent on one industry - if it were to evaporate overnight, then the majority of residents would have to displace themselves to find work elsewhere. So the government, who can seldom afford to see the future beyond two terms of office, is left with two choices: support uncompetitive industries so that people can keep their jobs, or cut them off and face an unemployment crisis. Compared to the prospect of losing a shot at office, inefficiencies and mismanagement are minor problems which can be left to the next generation.

There is also another problem, which is the difference between our largest industry and the next two. Finance is concentrated in Ontario, right beside a cluster of American financial centres, and where the seat of federal government is. Finance doesn't have to worry about failing so long as capital continues to circulate in and out of Canada. They also have the ear of the federal government more than any other industry. The other two have to trade commodities which are subject to standard prices in international markets. They are sensitive to business cycles among many other factors, and thus their fortunes are not so secure. From their perspective, it doesn't seem fair that Finance gets to piggyback off all their hard work while holding the most sway over policy. Finance sees limited growth potential in other domestic industries, and decides to focus its efforts in more lucrative or emerging markets. So the tug-of-war rope gets stretched in a new dimension - domestic vs. foreign markets.

Our government is unable to decide on a long-term strategy to oversee the restructuring of domestic industries to ensure competitiveness in international markets. Over time, the inefficiencies and mismanagement create bloated organizations which run deep into the red, and the end result is the sell-off of the company to prospective buyers who are interested in the limited but specialized knowledge that we've managed to accrue. With a lack of capital in Canada, the buyers are likely foreign. Workers are laid off or fired, our hard-earned experience is given away, and the possibility of a new domestic company emerging to take its place are limited (we just sold off what it needed to do so). No one benefits, except Finance in the short term.
Deal Addict
Apr 14, 2017
1910 posts
610 upvotes
DT Calgary
This only works if Canadian manufacturing firms can win contracts over places like China and other low cost producers. If there is a concerted effort by governments and big businesses to support Canadian, then it's possible.
Sr. Member
Mar 6, 2015
689 posts
50 upvotes
loserga wrote:
Any remedy?
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Meiji: Ambassador Swanbeck, I have concluded that your treaty is NOT in the best interests of my people. So sorry, but you may not.
Swanbeck: This is an outrage!
Sr. Member
Mar 6, 2015
689 posts
50 upvotes


Is that true?
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Meiji: Ambassador Swanbeck, I have concluded that your treaty is NOT in the best interests of my people. So sorry, but you may not.
Swanbeck: This is an outrage!
Deal Addict
User avatar
Dec 12, 2005
3988 posts
253 upvotes
Greater Toronto Area
What can Canada offer to manufacturers to make them open up in Canada?.Name one large company in the last 5 years that opened up that offer $20+an hour to workers without getting government breaks?.Are we talking jobs or high paying jobs?.If your talking about sub $20 an hour jobs there were tens of thousands of these jobs open before the corvid 19 that went unfilled.
Deal Expert
User avatar
Oct 26, 2003
34205 posts
3918 upvotes
Winnipeg
eldiablo wrote: Sure.
Federal deficit could reach $184.2-billion this year based on coronavirus measures, PBO says
Just tell me where you plan to get the money to start building all these factories and buying the equipment?
More importantly, manufacturing can't be done without creating GHG, which JT strictly forbids as part of his environmental nazi agenda.
Sr. Member
Oct 31, 2012
597 posts
26 upvotes
SCARBOROUGH
Everytime, I hear someone say we should manufacture here, I roll my eyes.

People that say that want OTHERS to put down their savings and money to start a factory, but won't put down their own money. If you think others should manufacture here, then why not you do it yourself?

Most (not everything) things are not manufactured here for a reason, cause it's not feasible. The things that are feasible to manufacture here won't bring many factory assembly line jobs. I've seen factories that had 500 employees, cut it down to 1 single operator. Most factories goals are to be turn key operations, literally meaning that the factory starts and stops by turning a key.

If you want a good job and stable income, learn computers, robotics and IT.
Black lives matter!
Sr. Member
Mar 6, 2015
689 posts
50 upvotes
elephantrider wrote: People that say that want others to put down their savings and money to start a factory, but won't put their money where their mouth is. If you think others should manufacture here, then why not you do it yourself? If you want a good job and stable income, learn computers, robotics and IT.
what manufacturing are we thinking? After this pandemic, shall manufacturing PPE domestically be a consensus? Or after the report on five eyes' dependence on China for strategic goods, shall some domestic manufacturing be domestic?
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Meiji: Ambassador Swanbeck, I have concluded that your treaty is NOT in the best interests of my people. So sorry, but you may not.
Swanbeck: This is an outrage!
Sr. Member
Oct 31, 2012
597 posts
26 upvotes
SCARBOROUGH
cybercavalier wrote: what manufacturing are we thinking? After this pandemic, shall manufacturing PPE domestically be a consensus? Or after the report on five eyes' dependence on China for strategic goods, shall some domestic manufacturing be domestic?
Any kind of manufacturing, just in general. I think manufacturing jobs here are not coming back, people gotta move on.

After the pandemic (hopefully the vaccine will work) the need for masks and prices will jump off a cliff. If someone opens a factory here making masks, I think it is a bad idea.
Black lives matter!
Deal Addict
User avatar
Dec 12, 2005
3988 posts
253 upvotes
Greater Toronto Area
Same posters here saying they would buy a Canadian made phone,Canadian made car,Canadian made washer,etc are the same ones crying Canada Goose are rip offs and so expensive.
Sr. Member
Mar 6, 2015
689 posts
50 upvotes
elephantrider wrote: Any kind of manufacturing, just in general. I think manufacturing jobs here are not coming back, people gotta move on.
After the pandemic (hopefully the vaccine will work) the need for masks and prices will jump off a cliff. If someone opens a factory here making masks, I think it is a bad idea.
Making mask is one thing. As you make your scope of manufacturing of PPE to of all, may I know what your ideas about domestic manufacturing of any in this nation?
For my part, I am getting busy in real life so I am backing off from this discussion.
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Meiji: Ambassador Swanbeck, I have concluded that your treaty is NOT in the best interests of my people. So sorry, but you may not.
Swanbeck: This is an outrage!
Deal Addict
User avatar
Dec 12, 2005
3988 posts
253 upvotes
Greater Toronto Area
So what kind of manufacturing you dreamers thinking about?..$20+ jobs with benefits or sweat shop level manufacturing a min wages?.No one here explain what kind of manufacturing jobs Canada can attract.If the moron in the white house and his threats about US companies in Mexico and Asia cannot bring jobs back who can?.Trump threats were hallow,US actually lost more manufacturing jobs under his watch,the so call beautiful job he did get were off Obama efforts and the low unemployment was due to people working two jobs to survive and his ban on work visa workers removed about 150,000 green card holders.

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